Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x02 - "New Eden"

[Succubint]

What people are trying to explain to you is that it's a common element of human psyche to occasionally vicariously enjoy a bad person (from their point of view) getting a karmic punishment. It doesn't mean they morally are deficient, but that in entertainment, someone is catering to their frustrations and giving them a cathartic release. Even if it's a brief one. This is Greek drama and comedy 101. This is why people in those times supported community theatre so that the public could work through their issues and not revolt against the status quo.

The show gave some of us a little valve moment. A fleeting release from the tensions and injustices we experience on a daily level.

The writers weren't being unnecessary malicious. What makes you think they were? They were making a point that being a douchebag who mansplains and disobeys orders is not someone to root for and maybe if they'd listened they wouldn't be dead right now. Talk about a life lesson.

Yes, I find this little fictional scene ultimately amusing. Because in real life I have had to endure situations which led me to wish karmic justice really did exist. Someone sneezing a large amount of snot on a guy's face, not so much.

 

[fireproof78]

What people are trying to explain to you is that it's a common element of human psyche to occasionally vicariously enjoy a bad person (from their point of view) getting a karmic punishment. It doesn't mean they morally are deficient, but that in entertainment, someone is catering to their frustrations and giving them a cathartic release. Even if it's a brief one. This is Greek drama and comedy 101. This is why people in those times supported community theatre so that the public could work through their issues and not revolt against the status quo.

No, I get that.

Catharsis is not the same as humor to me, but that might be a distinction without a difference.

The writers weren't being unnecessary malicious. What makes you think they were? They were making a point that being a douchebag who mansplains and disobeys orders is not someone to root for and maybe if they'd listened they wouldn't be dead right now. Talk about a life lesson.

Again, just stating what I'm reading. I don't see it as malicious. I see other people reading it as malicious and am confused by it.

 

[Succubint]

Who is reading it as malicious? Just was responding to your comment, but I see now, you are seeing it from others? I don't understand your confusion.

I can agree that not everyone may find it humorous, or cathartic. I am just explaining why someone might do so. And why the writers might have deliberately written it that way.

 

[fireproof78]

Who is reading it as malicious? Just was responding to your comment, but I see now, you are seeing it from others? I don't understand your confusion.

I can agree that not everyone may find it humorous, or cathartic. I am just explaining why someone might do so. And why the writers might have written it that way.

Just, never mind. It's all gone by the wayside now. This isn't the hill I'm willing to die on to try and explain my confusion of expressed opinions around the death of this guy. No, I didn't find it humorous, but that doesn't mean others won't find it as such. I attempted to express myself by giving the example of Twister and my reaction to the arrogant jerk's death in that scene-again, I didn't react with humor and was wondering if anyone else did.

Yes, it is an old dramatic trope. Yes, I get that. I don't understand some of the opinions expressed here, the expression of some posters stating that the writers had malice towards the character in having that death, but that moment is gone.

Peace.

 

[DaveyNY]

He was an obnoxious mansplainer who got spattered on the side of an asteroid. He's not the first junior or senior officer with one-dimensional development that's gotten killed off in Trek and he probably won't be the last.

How are we still arguing about this? Funny or not, he got killed because he was expendable and obnoxious. Had Tig Notaro's character been the one killed this forum would be going up in an explosion bigger than the Tsar Bomba. Sheesh, I'm a hardcore fan who can pedant with the best of them but how is this still going on page after page?

Cause the new episode doesn't come out till tomorrow night and we's got nuttin better to do?

 

[Succubint]

Okay, now I think I understand better what you are getting at. That some people read the character as being a stand in for the kind of anti-DSC fan who often comes across as sexist, tossing around terms like SJW unironically etc. Or the overly nerdtastic fan, set in their ways and presuming they know better than those who actually work on the show.

Maybe that's true. Maybe someone on the writing staff made Connolly that metaphorical effigy to obliterate via rogue asteroid. But we'll never know unless they talk about their intentions. Does it ultimately matter in terms of author intent? That's an age old dilemma. Author intent is important, but it doesn't mean that other interpretations aren't also valid when it comes to discussing art and other forms of media. We view our media through our own personal perspectives or lens. That's what makes it so interesting but also sometimes frustrating when those readings don't mesh.

 

[fireproof78]

Author intent is important, but it doesn't mean that other interpretations aren't also valid when it comes to discussing art and other forms of media.

Precisely so. I am interested in other's viewpoints on the matter, otherwise I would have left the conversation. But, I'll freely admit to being a person who puts a lot of stock in to authorial intent and am genuinely curious as to the purpose.

Ultimately, does it matter? No. I watched the episode, was surprised at his death and saddened by the abruptness. I appreciated Pike's reaction as well as Burnham's. To me, it fit well with what happened later on in the scene between Pike and Burnham.

People found humor it. OK, not my thing but fine. The writers are mean spirited? Yeah, that makes no sense.

 

[cooleddie74]

Cause the new episode doesn't come out till tomorrow night and we's got nuttin better to do?

Good point.

 

[Succubint]

LOL pretty much.

 

[Awesome Possum]

Don't worry, I'm sure the episode will do something to upset people.

 

[cooleddie74]

I hear somebody has a man bun.

I'm putting Ramens and extra shotgun ammo in the blast bunker. You guys are free to join me, but touch my beef jerky and you're gonna wish I left you above ground.

 

[Succubint]

Sometimes the man bun is sexy, sometimes the man bun is try hard. I look forward to coming to an understanding in this regard.

I offer shin ramyun, a 3rd edition run of Archie comics and a bottle of expired antibiotics for entry in the blast bunker. What say you?

 

[Disco!Disco!]

Sometimes the man bun is sexy, sometimes the man bun is try hard.

In this instance, it simply looks practical. A dude's gotta keep his hair out of his face.

 

[oberth]

In this instance, it simply looks practical. A dude's gotta keep his hair out of his face.

you better hide - apparently the season for blue-shirts is open right now

 

[Hythlodeus]

I find it odd that people think it was meant to be enjoyable.
What's the line between satisfaction at the comeuppance schadenfreude?

there is none. because Schadenfreude still is the best Freude, as the saying goes.

 

[Gov Kodos]

Suppose it was Tuvix hitting the asteroid trying to escape Janeway fixing him?

 

[Agony_Boothb]

Suppose it was Tuvix hitting the asteroid trying to escape Janeway fixing him?

It would be funny because Neelix would be dead, but also sad because tuvok would be dead.

 

[Locutus of Bored]

I find it odd that people think it was meant to be enjoyable.

What's the line between satisfaction at the comeuppance schadenfreude?

Real people versus fictional ones?

 

[Lord Garth]

I don't recall this much of a reaction to the death of Landry. Granted, I wasn't back to regularly posting on the board yet when "The Butcher's Knife" first aired. But I checked the list of threads and not a single one solely devoted to it at the time.

 

[Hythlodeus]

I don't recall this much of a reaction to the death of Landry. Granted, I wasn't back to regularly posting on the board yet when "The Butcher's Knife" first aired. But I checked the list of threads and not a single one solely devoted to it at the time.

Well, Landry wasn't a straight white male