The Orville is Overrated Nostalgic Trek Fans
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I've watched both Discovery and Orville, all of Discovery Season 1 and a good deal of Orville Seasons 1 and 2, but not every episode. I like Discovery more because it's more interesting to me because I am a Trek fan. I like the Star Trek universe more (I also prefer Trek over Star Wars, Stargate, Battlestar Galactica, Babylon 5, etc.). I think Burnham is a more interesting lead than Mercer. I like the production values and it feels like they are attempting something fresher. I do think Discovery/CBS All Access is plumbing the Trek brand, but so did every post-TOS series to some extent (though I would think DS9 and VOY did it the least). And Discovery is remixing-perhaps because of legal reasons-things which leave them not just swimming in nostalgia. Discovery also is adding to Trek lore, and will provide us with new stories for Pike, Spock, Number One, and the Enterprise, and potentially have us look at that those characters in a new light. The danger there is that they can also blemish the reputation of those characters if not handled correctly. That being said, I am intrigued to see more Pike and Number One stories. I hope the other "Cage" and also some Early Voyages characters show up or are mentioned during Season 2.
I do like the familiar feeling of Orville. It has a lot of Trek hands behind the scenes and Penny Johnson Jerald and other Trek veterans on screen and it's always good to see them. McFarlane doesn't hide his love and reverence of Trek and I think that's very cool, though the danger is that it just becomes all about nostalgia. With Orville I do also like the production values, though I think it can be too brightly lit at times, and some things need to be more detailed, like the interiors of the Orville for example. I have some issues with the some of the characters, especially in Season 1, but so far, in Season 2, I haven't had those issues. I think Orville works best when it starts to diverge from being a TNG-lite/like show and build on the potentially interesting characters and cultures that exist on the show. I enjoyed last week's "Home" episode quite a bit because it did present a situation that was unique to Alara's species that we wouldn't have seen in Trek, except maybe for Melora Pazlar to some extent, though I guess in a reverse kind of way. Orville can feel a bit lightweight at times. Breezy, bright, warm, but doesn't make enough of impression. That being said, if they continue building on the potential that's already there Orville could find its own voice instead of being a well-made Trek clone. I also agreed with the poster who felt that the show's name should've been something different. I get that it was probably meant to speak to the show's less serious approach and to step outside of how starships are named on Trek, but I wish they had went for a broader name, like how "Galaxy Quest" did.
I do like the familiar feeling of Orville. It has a lot of Trek hands behind the scenes and Penny Johnson Jerald and other Trek veterans on screen and it's always good to see them. McFarlane doesn't hide his love and reverence of Trek and I think that's very cool, though the danger is that it just becomes all about nostalgia. With Orville I do also like the production values, though I think it can be too brightly lit at times, and some things need to be more detailed, like the interiors of the Orville for example. I have some issues with the some of the characters, especially in Season 1, but so far, in Season 2, I haven't had those issues. I think Orville works best when it starts to diverge from being a TNG-lite/like show and build on the potentially interesting characters and cultures that exist on the show. I enjoyed last week's "Home" episode quite a bit because it did present a situation that was unique to Alara's species that we wouldn't have seen in Trek, except maybe for Melora Pazlar to some extent, though I guess in a reverse kind of way. Orville can feel a bit lightweight at times. Breezy, bright, warm, but doesn't make enough of impression. That being said, if they continue building on the potential that's already there Orville could find its own voice instead of being a well-made Trek clone. I also agreed with the poster who felt that the show's name should've been something different. I get that it was probably meant to speak to the show's less serious approach and to step outside of how starships are named on Trek, but I wish they had went for a broader name, like how "Galaxy Quest" did.
I love Orville. When I have come home from work and I'm tired and play an episode of that show it never fails to make me smile and feel good. It's not TNG but as a tribute in many ways it just works.
Discovery, even in its best episodes didn't elicit the same reaction for me. Rather the reverse in many episodes as I wanted a stiff drink after some of those piss poor episodes from season one.
And look at that I didn't have to download an app or pay extra money to watch Orville.
When I see the word over rated I would say no, not even one bit. Orville, unlike discovery, knows what it is and takes pleasure in that. So I take pleasure in it.
Discovery, even in its best episodes didn't elicit the same reaction for me. Rather the reverse in many episodes as I wanted a stiff drink after some of those piss poor episodes from season one.
And look at that I didn't have to download an app or pay extra money to watch Orville.
When I see the word over rated I would say no, not even one bit. Orville, unlike discovery, knows what it is and takes pleasure in that. So I take pleasure in it.
I might watch The Orville if it weren't for Seth MacFarlane. There's just something about his presence onscreen that makes me want to change channels. There's no rationale for my taste - I just find him unwatchable as an actor - although somewhat oddly, I could tolerate him well enough when he was performing musical theatre numbers at the Proms from the Royal Albert Hall.
Is "The Orville" a nostalgic look back at TNG, of course it is.
Seth has said so himself. But I don't tune in to satisfy some nostalgic Star Trek need when I watch, I tune in for an hour of goofy, light-hearted sci-fi and that is what I get. I just want better stories than the three we have gotten so far this year. I hope tonight's episode is better than what we have seen so far. The show can be very good, just no so much this season, IMO.
DSC isn't nostalgia.
It's new stories set in a known universe. And while some of the references are obvious nostalgic nods to earlier shows I think they are more for viewer information and backstory than just nostalgia porn.
Seth has said so himself. But I don't tune in to satisfy some nostalgic Star Trek need when I watch, I tune in for an hour of goofy, light-hearted sci-fi and that is what I get. I just want better stories than the three we have gotten so far this year. I hope tonight's episode is better than what we have seen so far. The show can be very good, just no so much this season, IMO.
DSC isn't nostalgia.
It's new stories set in a known universe. And while some of the references are obvious nostalgic nods to earlier shows I think they are more for viewer information and backstory than just nostalgia porn.
At this point it's a great deal more than back story and nostalgia porn - STD and the new All Access Trek projects are anxiously mining characters and designs from the oldest and most widely-known versions of Trek in an attempt to regenerated fan interest and publicity for a show that was poorly received in its first season.
It goes overboard with the "obvious nostalgic nods." Seriously, just how many damn arrowheads need to be displayed on screen at any one time?
It’s interesting how people talk about Discovery as new when we’ve already been to the mirror universe (been done on three prior shows) and the thing fans are talking about the most in anticipation of the new season is Pike and Spock. Hell, the original cast of Discovery has pretty much been pushed aside in their own show based on some of the reactions I’ve seen.
I am looking forward to Discovery, but it’s not new. Heck I am worried they have tossed thier characters to the side. At least the Orville has given all of its characters time to shine, and I even heard we are getting a Yalphet episode this season. When are we going to get a Detmer, or Airiem, or Owosekun episode?
I am looking forward to Discovery, but it’s not new. Heck I am worried they have tossed thier characters to the side. At least the Orville has given all of its characters time to shine, and I even heard we are getting a Yalphet episode this season. When are we going to get a Detmer, or Airiem, or Owosekun episode?
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Exactly so. And what's with this "Daring" bullshit? STD is daring for a TV drama produced in 1992. Maybe.
Discovery is new in the sense that bell bottoms were new compared to straight jeans but are still...jeans. In other words, it's stylistically novel.
That is the main problem that I and many others have with it. The dutch angles, the constantly swooping camera, the harsh lighting, the look of the Klingons, etc...
That is also the one element of nostalgia that The Orville nails down, the style. Simple locked-down camera angles. Flat TV lighting. Great theatrical-grade scoring (better than Berman-limited TNG wallpaper), restrained ship-shots with little to no camera rattle/rack-zoom/lens-flare BS, and luxurious dramatic pacing.
The pacing has been an issue with season 2. In the last season, when there was a lack of action, they made up for it with punch-lines, but these first few episodes have been low in action and low in comedy and you're left with drama and, while earnest, it gets dull after a while, especially now that episodes are longer due to shorter commercial breaks. That's really the core problem with The Orville. It has struggled to find the ideal mix of these three elements.
That is the main problem that I and many others have with it. The dutch angles, the constantly swooping camera, the harsh lighting, the look of the Klingons, etc...
That is also the one element of nostalgia that The Orville nails down, the style. Simple locked-down camera angles. Flat TV lighting. Great theatrical-grade scoring (better than Berman-limited TNG wallpaper), restrained ship-shots with little to no camera rattle/rack-zoom/lens-flare BS, and luxurious dramatic pacing.
The pacing has been an issue with season 2. In the last season, when there was a lack of action, they made up for it with punch-lines, but these first few episodes have been low in action and low in comedy and you're left with drama and, while earnest, it gets dull after a while, especially now that episodes are longer due to shorter commercial breaks. That's really the core problem with The Orville. It has struggled to find the ideal mix of these three elements.
Orville is a fun and explores some different sciifi tropes that I am enjoying. I am increasingly fascinated by the Moclan culture, as well as the Seleyan. The one thing I don't like is the constant need to introduce new aliens species as "background noise" with little detail.
Now, the aliens look great, and I have really enjoyed the bartender this season. But, ugh, it's becoming a lot.
Now, the aliens look great, and I have really enjoyed the bartender this season. But, ugh, it's becoming a lot.
@CorporalCaptain @Serveaux Sorry, I meant to write: "The Orville is Overrated Among Nostalgic Trek Fans"
I just couldn't go back and fix it after I noticed I missed a word.
Not for modern television. Not one bit. It's rather stodgy, in fact.
No, no, NO, that's NOT how the internet works, if you don't like something than it is the WORST THING IN THE HISTORY OF HUMANITY, and everyone who likes it is an IDIOT and a LOSER. You're just not doing this right at all....
Luckily for me Discovery goes online an hour and a half before The Orville, so I'll be able to watch both, with either Young Sheldon or an old The Simpsons on FXX to fill in the half hour left between them.For me, I'm just sad both have to be on late on Thursday evenings! Tomorrow I'll be watching Discovery for my Star Trek story, I think the first time I've really enjoyed new Star Trek since TNG, and then the Orville for comfort!
They do seem to be putting a bit more focus on those three in the promotional for Season 2, so I'm hoping they might at least get a bit more development, even if they don't get their own episodes. They need to at least settle once and for all who/what Airiem is, since there seems to a bit of inconsistency over whether she's an enhanced human or an alien.
No, no, NO, that's NOT how the internet works, if you don't like something than it is the WORST THING IN THE HISTORY OF HUMANITY, and everyone who likes it is an IDIOT and a LOSER. You're just not doing this right at all....
Luckily for me Discovery goes online an hour and a half before The Orville, so I'll be able to watch both, with either Young Sheldon or an old The Simpsons on FXX to fill in the half hour left between them.
They do seem to be putting a bit more focus on those three in the promotional for Season 2, so I'm hoping they might at least get a bit more development, even if they don't get their own episodes. They need to at least settle once and for all who/what Airiem is, since there seems to a bit of inconsistency over whether she's an enhanced human or an alien.
I'm focusing on those characters because of what/who they are. I mean Detmer looks like 7 of 9, and when I did my rewatch, there was nothing to say if she got those implants because of what happened at the Binary stars. It's implied, but isn't that a story worth following to develop a member of the bridge crew? The same can be said about Airiem. Enterprise introduced the Denobulan, this series introduced Airiem, a robot/human hybrid. That's an interesting story. As far as Owosekun goes, she's the Operations officer (I think, or is that Kayla) so she kinda has an important job. It's not just them either. It's the bridge crew. I get they are minor characters, but they could be interesting characters if we can just "meet" them.
The Orville owes it's existence to Trek. It'll never not be mentioned in the same breath. It'll never stand alone, but I don't think it was ever intended to. They could have put that Next Gen/Voyager storytelling into a different show format or made bigger changes. But they chose to make it Trek with the serial numbers filed off and endless comparisons are the inevitable result.
I completely agree, Airiam (just looked on Memory Alpha and it's an a between the i and m, not an e) and Detmer seem to have a lot of potential. Detmer's history with Saru and Burnham on the Shenzhou and then the story behind Airiam and how/why she cyborg both give them a ton of potential. What we've seen of Owosekun is good, but she isn't quite as intriguing as the other two since she's just kind of been there, and appears to be a standard issue human.
^^^
IMO - It hasn't so far in Season 2. All 3 feel way more like TNG then TOS. I hope that trend doesn't continue myself.
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