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CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar 2 - Electric Boogaloo-Fanboys gone WILD-too many hyphens

Do you enjoy pie?

  • Yes, sweet, please

    Votes: 79 40.9%

  • Yes, savory, please

    Votes: 42 21.8%

  • Yes, any kind

    Votes: 80 41.5%

  • No, I'm a heathen

    Votes: 37 19.2%
  • Total voters
    193
King Daniel Beyond said:
RMB has dropped a ton of Axanar VFX footage with commentary. I'm pretty sure Alec planned to use some of that footage in Axanar Lite, so I am sure he's thrilled. Click!
Click to expand...
I came back in to see if anyone was commenting on the footage released, and very little commentary. Disappointing.

There were a few nice shot designs, but overall it's nothing spectacular. Above typical fanfilm level but not movie quality. The ships, as ever, move too slowly in combat, they loooooove to roll the camera, the weapons fire is slow-mo and not scary, and the behavior of the iceteroids in the gas giant rings is laughable as the Ares deflectors push some out the the way which then flow back into the hole as if this was water. Even the warp jump shows is lame and lacks snap.
 
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Sgt_G said:
True, but it's hard to feel sorry for anyone *STILL* donating money to the Axanar project.
Click to expand...

My feeling towards those who donated to Axanar:

Pre-lawsuit - Star Trek fans who wanted a good film and contributed good money , only to be let down by Alec. They are the people I feel for and I am mad at Alex for ripping them off.

Lawsuit and post-lawsuit - Suckers, what else can I say? CBS is suing Axanar, why are you still giving money?

What I would have done, if it were me filming Axanar:

Pre-Lawsuit - Drop the building your own studio idea, first of all. After the first fundraiser, shoot the dam film, get all your production set up and shoot the live action. Do a additional fundraiser(s) after the production shoot to pay for post related costs, VFX, editing, scoring, SFX, etc... This is the way we have done it, and it works.

Lawsuit and post-lawsuit - There would not be a lawsuit ;), but if some reason there is.
SUSPEND ALL FUNDRAISING IMMEDIATELY!
SUSPEND all billable work on the film!
Freeze the production bank account (in case you have to give some money back, etc..)!
Try to settle with CBS and not let it drag on.
 
I got off the Axanar bandwagon right before the lawsuit when I got the annual report that showed Alec paying himself a salary. I saw what was happening to those who were questioning it, and thought it was better that I keep my mouth shut.

I agree with what @Tom said above that there's no reason the live action footage couldn't have been shot after the first Kickstarter where I think the original $500,000 was raised. I've seen very well made independent films shot for a lot less than that. I've said this before, I just didn't like the idea of taking donor money, and using it to build a studio. I made sure that the perk I chose went for something from the movie. I wanted to see a good well polished fan film set in the pre-TOS era.

I'm about a third of the way through the Bill Hunt version of the script. The Vulcan scene that was shot starts on page 25. It is pretty much the same story, but better written than the version of the script that was released by Terry McIntosh. I may post more thoughts on it one I'm completely done reading it.
 
So, reading the script. 17 pages in and it's still crap. The writing is total amateur-hour.

The title page reads:

"AXANAR"

Written by
Bill Hunt
and
Alec Peters

Directed by Robert Meyer Burnett

Based upon a screenplay by Alec Peters
​

The director's name doesn't belong [EDIT] in that spot at all. You don't stick the director in the middle of the WRITING credits, dumbasses...[END EDIT]

The dialog is...well here...

Klingon dialog is translated into English, except for the occasional word. "It’s possible that mistakes were made... in the shadows of veS." Mind you, "veS" means "war", not some specific foreign term that doesn't have an English equivalent, so fucking translate it.

Cut-and-paste cookie-cutter, clichéd by-the-numbers dialog, e.g. " I bet you’re getting damn sick of giving those speeches." "Not as sick as you are of hearing them, I’m sure." Not as sick as I am READING this crap.

We have the beginner's mistake of unfilmable scene directions, e.g. "He ends the recording - his last of several for the day." Nothing in the scene directions provides any clue that this is number X of Y. Apparently we're supposed to read the minds of the writers.

Page 11, Garth banters with Corax... um, hello, Korax anyone? Garth literally says to her, "You haven’t exactly gone out of your way to be friendly to them." and then "For starters, you might try smiling once in a while." In short, "Honey you should try smiling more. People don't like girls who are mad." Fuck. This. Shitty. Script.

Ah, Garth appears to be playing docking maneuvers with his Intelligence officer. Of course he is. Our sterling hero is fraternizing with a female subordinate who should smile more. Ew...

"Sparks fly from a Bridge station". Trek cliché #4 engaged.

Ah, attempt to try to humanize Garth with awkward dialog. "This war is ugly enough. It doesn’t have to make us so. Whatever our feelings given recent events, those were sentient beings. And we’re Starfleet officers. Let’s try not to forget it."

Forget it? I wish...
 
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Maurice said:
So, reading the script. 17 pages in and it's still crap. The writing is total amateur-hour.

The title page reads:

"AXANAR"

Written by
Bill Hunt
and
Alec Peters

Directed by Robert Meyer Burnett

Based upon a screenplay by Alec Peters
​

The director's name doesn't belong there at all. The credits on the script are the WRITING credits, dumbasses...

The dialog is...well here...

Klingon dialog is translated into English, except for the occasional word. "It’s possible that mistakes were made... in the shadows of veS." Mind you, "veS" means "war", not some specific foreign term that doesn't have an English equivalent, so fucking translate it.

Cut-and-paste cookie-cutter, clichéd by-the-numbers dialog, e.g. " I bet you’re getting damn sick of giving those speeches." "Not as sick as you are of hearing them, I’m sure." Not as sick as I am READING this crap.

We have the beginner's mistake of unfilmable scene directions, e.g. "He ends the recording - his last of several for the day." Nothing in the scene directions provides any clue that this is number X of Y. Apparently we're supposed to read the minds of the writers.

Page 11, Garth banters with Corax... um, hello, Korax anyone? Garth literally says to her, "You haven’t exactly gone out of your way to be friendly to them." and then "For starters, you might try smiling once in a while." In short, "Honey you should try smiling more. People don't like girls who are mad." Fuck. This. Shitty. Script.

Ah, Garth appears to be playing docking maneuvers with his Intelligence officer. Of course he is. Our sterling hero is fraternizing with a subordinate who should smile more. Ew...

"Sparks fly from a Bridge station". Trek cliché #4 engaged.

Ah, attempt to try to humanize Garth with awkward dialog. "This war is ugly enough. It doesn’t have to make us so. Whatever our feelings given recent events, those were sentient beings. And we’re Starfleet officers. Let’s try not to forget it."

Forget it? I wish...
Click to expand...
Ouch, even I can tell that is pretty bad. I'm shocked, shocked I tell you, to hear that this amazing script, was that bad.
 
Maurice said:
So, reading the script. 17 pages in and it's still crap. The writing is total amateur-hour.

The title page reads:

"AXANAR"

Written by
Bill Hunt
and
Alec Peters

Directed by Robert Meyer Burnett

Based upon a screenplay by Alec Peters
​

The director's name doesn't belong there at all. The credits on the script are the WRITING credits, dumbasses...

The dialog is...well here...

Klingon dialog is translated into English, except for the occasional word. "It’s possible that mistakes were made... in the shadows of veS." Mind you, "veS" means "war", not some specific foreign term that doesn't have an English equivalent, so fucking translate it.

Cut-and-paste cookie-cutter, clichéd by-the-numbers dialog, e.g. " I bet you’re getting damn sick of giving those speeches." "Not as sick as you are of hearing them, I’m sure." Not as sick as I am READING this crap.

We have the beginner's mistake of unfilmable scene directions, e.g. "He ends the recording - his last of several for the day." Nothing in the scene directions provides any clue that this is number X of Y. Apparently we're supposed to read the minds of the writers.

Page 11, Garth banters with Corax... um, hello, Korax anyone? Garth literally says to her, "You haven’t exactly gone out of your way to be friendly to them." and then "For starters, you might try smiling once in a while." In short, "Honey you should try smiling more. People don't like girls who are mad." Fuck. This. Shitty. Script.

Ah, Garth appears to be playing docking maneuvers with his Intelligence officer. Of course he is. Our sterling hero is fraternizing with a subordinate who should smile more. Ew...

"Sparks fly from a Bridge station". Trek cliché #4 engaged.

Ah, attempt to try to humanize Garth with awkward dialog. "This war is ugly enough. It doesn’t have to make us so. Whatever our feelings given recent events, those were sentient beings. And we’re Starfleet officers. Let’s try not to forget it."

Forget it? I wish...
Click to expand...
It doesn't say "LOCKED." :techman:
 
Maurice said:
I came back in to see if anyone was commenting on the footage released, and very little commentary. Disappointing.

There were a few nice shot designs, but overall it's nothing spectacular. Above typical fanfilm level but not movie quality. The ships, as ever, move too slowly in combat, they loooooove to roll the camera, the weapons fire is slow-mo and not scary, and the behavior of the iceteroids in the gas giant rings is laughable when the Ares deflectors push some out the the way and then the flow back into the hole as if this was water. Even the warp jump shows is lame and lacks snap.
Click to expand...
I couldn't watch it on-line. I had to download it to my hard drive, which took over an hour. I ran a speed-test and also pulled down other large files with no problem, so it wasn't my ISP that was slow.

Let me watch it a few times before I decide how I feel about it. Save yourselves some time and skip ahead to 16:50 to see the final product, and to avoid listening to RMB talk about how brilliant he is.

Right off the bat, I will say I didn't like the combat range. At one point, they could have thrown rocks at each other. The ships should be thousands, if not tens of thousands, of kilometers apart. I don't think they were more than ten kilometers away at any point during the combat.
 
Maurice said:
So, reading the script. 17 pages in and it's still crap. The writing is total amateur-hour.

The title page reads:

"AXANAR"

Written by
Bill Hunt
and
Alec Peters

Directed by Robert Meyer Burnett

Based upon a screenplay by Alec Peters
​

The director's name doesn't belong there at all. The credits on the script are the WRITING credits, dumbasses...
Click to expand...

To be fair, scripts for TNG, DS9, and VGR would put a "Directed by" credit on the title page for the final drafts, sometimes the preceding n+1 drafts, too. There is industry precedent there.
 
Firebird said:
To be fair, scripts for TNG, DS9, and VGR would put a "Directed by" credit on the title page for the final drafts, sometimes the preceding n+1 drafts, too. There is industry precedent there.
Click to expand...
Yeah, that's true of TV so the production knows which director is assigned to what episode, but this was supposed to be a "professional" feature, and from what I've seen there you generally don't do that (looking at scripts for Her and Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind as I write this), unless you are doing something like this from the shooting script Straight Outta Compton:

Director: F. Gary Gray
PROD #02443
Producer: Ice Cube
Producer: Tomica Woods-Wright
Producer: Matt Alvarez
Producer: F. Gary Gray
Producer: Scott Bernstein
Producer: Dr. Dre Executive
Producer: Adam Merims​

So maybe I was being a little unfair but it just smacks of ego for the director to inject his name amidst the writing credits and above the "Based on" one.
 
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Maurice said:
I came back in to see if anyone was commenting on the footage released, and very little commentary. Disappointing.

There were a few nice shot designs, but overall it's nothing spectacular. Above typical fanfilm level but not movie quality. The ships, as ever, move too slowly in combat, they loooooove to roll the camera, the weapons fire is slow-mo and not scary, and the behavior of the iceteroids in the gas giant rings is laughable when the Ares deflectors push some out the the way and then the flow back into the hole as if this was water. Even the warp jump shows is lame and lacks snap.
Click to expand...

I credit them for trying to create a different kinda space battle and one that's more three-dimensional, not two-dimensional (i.e. the "lakes in space" as RMB called it).

But watching the animatics and bits that were rendered, I kept thinking... why does feel familiar? One, the use of a gas giant is very similar to the Deep Space Nine episode, "Starship Down," where the Defiant is slowly "sinking" into a gas giant.

But this was different, it was a chase through a gas giant to trap and destroy the enemy ship. Which also felt familiar. In Babylon 5 episode "Messages from Earth," Sheridan forces a Shadow vessel to chase the White Star into Jupiter's atmosphere, where the enemy ship then is crushed by the pressure.

But similarities happen in SF... so I can't fault them for using a gas giant and at least there was some tactical thinking involved, which is a rarity in these things.

The one thing that did bother me is that while RMB says they were avoiding the "lakes in space", this still felt like "submarines in the ocean" right out of The Hunt for Red October.

Nevertheless, I agree that the ships still lumber and everything lacks a kinetic energy.
 
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The problem Axanar has (when it comes to criticism) is that Alec and Co. sold it as a "professional" production. Were they to just stayed a "fan film" and FINISH the dang thing, Axanar would have been a rather impressive film.
But Alec's ambitions to sit back and make money off of something he doesn't own led them to oversell and now everything they ever wrote or produced is viewed through that prism.
 
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