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Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 1x15 - "Will You Take My Hand?"

Rate the episode...

  • 10 - A wonderful season finale!

    Votes: 89 26.2%
  • 9

    Votes: 51 15.0%
  • 8

    Votes: 64 18.8%
  • 7

    Votes: 46 13.5%
  • 6

    Votes: 18 5.3%
  • 5

    Votes: 24 7.1%
  • 4

    Votes: 15 4.4%
  • 3

    Votes: 10 2.9%
  • 2

    Votes: 7 2.1%
  • 1 - An awful season finale.

    Votes: 16 4.7%

  • Total voters
    340
I'm kind of speechless at the moment at how completely lackluster that was as the ending of an arc.

Excellent timing, you just saved me about half of what I was going to write.

I'd like to add that, philosophically, I consider two things highly in stories; ambition counts over execution, and the ending is the most important part. If you're not trying anything special, but you do it perfectly, well, that's great, but if you're trying something audacious and it doesn't quite work out because your reach exceeded your grasp, well, points for trying. And the ending tells you what a story is about. It provides unity and closure to themes, catharsis of the emotional journeys of the characters, and, in a very real sense, tells you what the story was in the first place. We shall not cease from exploration/And the end of all our exploring/Will be to arrive where we started/And know the place for the first time.

Discovery's first season had an amazing middle-section, but started flying off the rails with "What's Past is Prologue." I didn't like what they did in that episode, I thought it was the laziest, most conventional way to play out their twist, but they did it perfectly, so I didn't give it too much gruff. This one... didn't have that degree of spectacle, and had the larger problem of having to tell us what the Klingon War meant, in a dramatic sense, both to Burnham and how it fit in to the larger context of the Federation's foe-to-friend relationship with the Klingons, which was an abysmal failure. Bribing the Klingons with what they (or rather, one of them) actually wanted to get them to call off the war? No checks, no deadman switch, no Ash-and-L'rell-have-to-agree-to-keep-the-bomb-turned-off? I'd say they were setting up the rematch at Organia, but there wasn't the slightest indication in the episode this was anything other than a return to the pre-"Vulcan Hello" status quo.

And what the hell was that cliffhanger? "The Enterprise shows up, looks fine, but apparently has a busted radio and is having a planetary- or galactic-war-scale emergency"? Never mind the way they brutalized the ship by cutting half the neck off and stitching the bits together like Cotton Hill's legs and then giving it a blacklight body kit, where can they go? I realize the intended answer is "anywhere," but what is that supposed to give me as a viewer? It reminds me of how Michael Pillar talked about how he didn't worry much about how "Best of Both Worlds" might conclude, since he didn't think he'd be writing it, but this takes it to a whole new level. It feels like the kind of thing the showrunner might do if they were being fired and didn't care for their replacement. "Have fun replacing Jeffery Hunter/Bruce Greenwood, Leonard Nimoy/Zachary Quinto, and Majel Barrett, not to mention figuring out a story worth teaming up our crew with the Enterprise. Sucks to be you if you can't and would rather keep that in your back pocket, because now you're committed!" Supergirl's first season dancing around Superman was better-done (and it wasn't done that well), and even though they put him on-screen in the season season premiere, they didn't end the first with an out-of-left-field scene saying, "Guess what, sick of these bozos? Well, the person/ship you really want to see is here!... in one to two years." They spent fifteen episodes building up this cast, only to end the season with a promise that they're immediately going to be overshadowed by pop-culture legends. Bra-vo.

Jeeze, Discovery. You were doing so, so well, but you had a pile-up of your good-to-great execution overflowing your very conservative ambitions. I know it's been denied that the season was plotted out as an anthology show, but it really feels like nobody was expecting more than thirteen episodes with this crew and they didn't mind burning their best bridges rather than husbanding them throughout the show (and making odd decisions about them. Sure, it's more of a pain in the ass for Burnham the way they did it, but character-wise, it would've made way more sense for Lorca to skulk off to fight another day and become a pirate king or something and the Emperor to fight to the death, even with Lorca being recontextualized and wiping out all his existing characterization and motivations, so, I guess, no one would care that they were getting rid of him).
 
It wasn't entirely his fault for sure.

My guess is that his premise had unquestionable problems. Then, he left, and the remaining staff REALLY struggled with what to do with it and how to make it their own while still living up to the elements that had already been committed to.

So, part was on him in terms of development...part on himfor his departure...and part on the remaining staff for struggling to pull it back together totally smoothly.

It's pretty clear that Micheal Burnham was more or less Fuller's baby, given the number of commonalities she had with other Fullerverse protagonists (female, flawed, has a male name, etc). I don't think, once he left, anyone really knew how to write her, because she clearly wasn't the stereotypical Starfleet hero who saves the day by doing the right thing. So we ended up in this weird circumstance where she made poor choices, yet the plot had to move to a good resolution, and the writers felt the need to reinforce that she was supposed to be awesome by telling us in virtually every episode.

I'm pretty sure next season she's just going to be one character in an ensemble cast now that her story is done, but of course it remains to be seen.
 
Really?
Cause the dudes with the black badges don’t appear to care about “Boldly Going Where No Else Went Before” . Neither did Admiral Cornwall, who installed an alternate dimension war criminal and gave her the highest value defensive asset in Starfleet. The Emperor of the Terran Empire is the head of a morally bankrupt dictatorship; she would have jumped Discovery to Paris,blown a hole through the Presidents office and set herself up to rule . Instead the leader of a Mirror Universe dictatorship is sneaking a bomb into Qonos under orders of a Federation she despises? WTF.

The reason Picard speech’s worked for Picard is because (TV Picard anyways) he didn’t say one thing and do something else. It doesn’t work for a convicted mutineer whos a fugitive from Federation justice.

Yes kids,she’s a fugitive; Captain Lorca was himself a fugitive from the Mirror Universe, so .....how is his wartime conscription of Burnham and her subsequent promotion to Specialist legal? He wasn’t the lawful captain of Discovery.

The season started off good,then got lost in the mycelial network of lazy writing.
Yes, really.
The blink and you'll miss them guys with the Black badges????? Who cares.
You can't show Starfleet/Federation ideas without having someone, often a Federation official or Starfleet officer, going against those ideas so our heroes can remind them."That's not who we are".
How is Burnham a fugitive? Starfleet knows where she is and they approved of her being put there. Hell, they've talked to her. Lorca's reveal doesn't change that.
 
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It's pretty clear that Micheal Burnham was more or less Fuller's baby, given the number of commonalities she had with other Fullerverse protagonists (female, flawed, has a male name, etc). I don't think, once he left, anyone really knew how to write her, because she clearly wasn't the stereotypical Starfleet hero who saves the day by doing the right thing. So we ended up in this weird circumstance where she made poor choices, yet the plot had to move to a good resolution, and the writers felt the need to reinforce that she was supposed to be awesome by telling us in virtually every episode.

I'm pretty sure next season she's just going to be one character in an ensemble cast now that her story is done, but of course it remains to be seen.
...we should be so lucky.

No, seriously, that would probably be the best route to take for her character. Perhaps some wistfulness over lost opportunities and mistakes made--all elliptically phrased, of course--but maybe the best thing for her is to simply consider this entire season a prologue for the series as a whole and proceed onto a more ensemble-type style.

She's been given an undeserved break. Best not look the gift horse in the mouth too much. Let's see what the next season will bring with her (and the others).
 
It's pretty clear that Micheal Burnham was more or less Fuller's baby, given the number of commonalities she had with other Fullerverse protagonists (female, flawed, has a male name, etc). I don't think, once he left, anyone really knew how to write her, because she clearly wasn't the stereotypical Starfleet hero who saves the day by doing the right thing. So we ended up in this weird circumstance where she made poor choices, yet the plot had to move to a good resolution, and the writers felt the need to reinforce that she was supposed to be awesome by telling us in virtually every episode.

I'm pretty sure next season she's just going to be one character in an ensemble cast now that her story is done, but of course it remains to be seen.

I agree. I think a LOT will depend on who they cast as the new captain.

Interesting that the new captain would be picked up on Vulcan, BTW.
 
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I agree. I think a LOT will depend on who they cast as the new captain.

Interesting that the new captain would be picked up on Vulcan, BTW.
That does not necessarily mean that the captain will be a Vulcan, though (not that you claimed it would have; just pointing it out). It could mean several things...

A) A Vulcan captain, perhaps on shore leave awaiting reassignment.
B) A non-Vulcan captain en route from another duty assignment who's to rendezvous with the Discovery at Vulcan
C) A non-Vulcan captain stationed at Vulcan.

And probably a couple of more options.

Personally, I'd love to see an Andorian in charge. I've seen enough Vulcans. Let's put the spotlight on other species.
 
Yes, really.
The blink and you'll miss them guys with the Black badges????? Who cares.
You can't show Starfleet/Federation ideas without having someone, often a Federation official or Starfleet officer, going against those idea so our heroes can remind them."That's not who we are".
How is Burnham a fugitive? Starfleet knows where she is and the approved of her being put there. Hell, they talked to her. Lorca's reveal doesn't change that.

Stop it. The overwhelming disappointment that Section 31 was not involved in this series is far too much of an emotional burden for some fans to take.
 
That does not necessarily mean that the captain will be a Vulcan, though (not that you claimed it would have; just pointing it out). It could mean several things...

A) A Vulcan captain, perhaps on shore leave awaiting reassignment.
B) A non-Vulcan captain en route from another duty assignment who's to rendezvous with the Discovery at Vulcan
C) A non-Vulcan captain stationed at Vulcan.

And probably a couple of more options.

Personally, I'd love to see an Andorian in charge. I've seen enough Vulcans. Let's put the spotlight on other species.
It will be Number One from the Cage.
 
That does not necessarily mean that the captain will be a Vulcan, though (not that you claimed it would have; just pointing it out). It could mean several things...

A) A Vulcan captain, perhaps on shore leave awaiting reassignment.
B) A non-Vulcan captain en route from another duty assignment who's to rendezvous with the Discovery at Vulcan
C) A non-Vulcan captain stationed at Vulcan.

And probably a couple of more options.

Personally, I'd love to see an Andorian in charge. I've seen enough Vulcans. Let's put the spotlight on other species.

I agree. I just thought it was interesting.

The fanbase will spend the next several months talking about how the captain NEDS to be a gender-fluid Pakled/Shelliak hybrid or "not real Star Trek," I'm sure!
 
Given that it had to be wrapped up at warp speed, the choice was as good as any. I just wish the writers had not painted themselves into that corner and had given themselves more time to play out a better ending.

I believe most of the season was spent un-Fullering the show after he left. Someone pointed out how more normal the old species were to their original appearances than the Klingons, which was a symptom of Fuller's departure. I was pretty surprised at the Orion-ness of the Orions.

As for the Enterprise.

I think Sarek has created a test scenario for either Saru or Burnham to test their leadership in order to promote them to Captain and the Enterprise has been brought in to participate.

Saru was acting captain, so he could get it. Burnham also got her commission as Commander back quite conveniently, and Saru could play it off as though he'd be happy to let her be captain instead. They were talking about getting her own Command episode 1. But we'll see.
 
It was never said what the battle of Axanar was fought against

And it was fought sometime before 2250. The first time Kirk visited Axanar was as a cadet on the peace mission for which he was decorated by Starfleet, and Garth's victory had already occurred by then.
 
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