The lack of national diversity in the Discovery cast...

[Christopher]

Ah.... I had to look that up. Shes a greek born in England, i had No idea.

Sirtis's natural accent was Cockney, i.e. a working-class East London accent. As Troi, she initially used a blend of a more upper-class, Received Standard English accent and a Greek accent based on her parents, I think, but eventually she dropped the Greek part and just went for straight-up RSE. These days, after living in the US for decades, her accent has become sort of an Americanized Cockney.

 

[indranee]

As Troi, though, she used a wierd amalgam of Greek and something else, right? What combo was she using? Anyone know?

 

[ihno]

Well, I guess it was all well calculated by some marketing experts from CBS, who has to be in the crew. And they know always best.

And I noticed that Orville has gay scenes too without making a big fuzz over it.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

Apart from the fact that the first major character we saw on the show was MICHELLE FUCKING YEOH, there's the fact that Lorca mentions that his family used to own a fortune cookie business back in the 21st century. This implies that, despite the name, his ancestors might actually be Chinese after all, along with six or seven other ethnic contributions along the line. There's also the fact that Discovery features more obviously alien characters -- if only background characters -- than any Star Trek series we have seen to date, both on the bridge of the Discovery and earlier on the Shenzhou.

 

[David]

I’d like to see an Aussie in Star Trek.

Captain: Engage.

Aussie: No worries.

 

[Awesome Possum]

Apart from the fact that the first major character we saw on the show was MICHELLE FUCKING YEOH, there's the fact that Lorca mentions that his family used to own a fortune cookie business back in the 21st century. This implies that, despite the name, his ancestors might actually be Chinese after all, along with six or seven other ethnic contributions along the line. There's also the fact that Discovery features more obviously alien characters -- if only background characters -- than any Star Trek series we have seen to date, both on the bridge of the Discovery and earlier on the Shenzhou.

Fortune cookies are an American invention, one of the major companies is actually in San Francisco. So who knows.

Well, I guess it was all well calculated by some marketing experts from CBS, who has to be in the crew. And they know always best.

And I noticed that Orville has gay scenes too without making a big fuzz over it.

Star Trek is sort of a bigger deal than Orville because of the history and legacy. Some of the fans are also resistant to change unfortunately.

 

[ihno]

Star Trek is sort of a bigger deal than Orville because of the history and legacy. Some of the fans are also resistant to change unfortunately.

And Disco was in more need of publicity because of the high expectations that Mr. Moonves (don't know the spelling, sorry) and his friends have.

Just doing it without making a big fuzz would have been more convincing I think. Intolerant people don't become tolerant if you tell them that tolerance is fun and important.

Since I don't watch the show I have no idea how it turns out. I hope it is a little better than the "I give my partner a gay clance and a tip at the shoulder" Sulu on the movies, which also was introduced with a big announcement. As a gay man I found it a little insulting.

What's your impression? Did they do it well in Disco?

 

[Awesome Possum]

And Disco was in more need of publicity because of the high expectations that Mr. Moonves (don't know the spelling, sorry) and his friends have.

Just doing it without making a big fuzz would have been more convincing I think. Intolerant people don't become tolerant if you tell them that tolerance is fun and important.

Since I don't watch the show I have no idea how it turns out. I hope it is a little better than the "I give my partner a gay clance and a tip at the shoulder" Sulu on the movies, which also was introduced big a big announcement. As a gay man I found it a little insulting.

What's your impression? Did they do it well in Disco?

It’s more than that. I also don’t think it required a big announcement. At this point it’s pathetic that Trek waited this long for a gay character.

 

[ihno]

It’s more than that. I also don’t think it required a big announcement. At this point it’s pathetic that Trek waited this long for a gay character.

You're right. They should have done it with DS9.
I have edited something to my post (which I do something and corrected some mistakes). Do you think they do it well on Disco? I don't watch the show.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Fortune cookies are an American invention, one of the major companies is actually in San Francisco. So who knows.

I think I've read they were invented by Japanese immigrants.

 

[Awesome Possum]

I think I've read they were invented by Japanese immigrants.

They were. It’s really a fascinating history.

 

[Kor]

Yes, fortune cookie manufacturing was primarily a Japanese-American industry in the beginning. Arguably, the fortune cookie was based on a traditional Japanese snack.

Nowadays, fortune cookie factories are mostly Chinese-American-operated.

Even though the current form of this cookie was created in America, that doesn't mean it's an invention of mainstream Anglo/white America.

Kor

 

[Christopher]

Since I don't watch the show I have no idea how it turns out. I hope it is a little better than the "I give my partner a gay clance and a tip at the shoulder" Sulu on the movies, which also was introduced with a big announcement. As a gay man I found it a little insulting.

What's your impression? Did they do it well in Disco?

I felt they were being kind of half-hearted about it initially -- the first time we saw the couple alone in their quarters, the most intimate thing they did was brush their teeth together. But in last night's episode, they had a pretty sweet scene together, a heartfelt kiss and mutual "I love you"s before one of them placed himself in danger.

 

[GeekUSACarl]

I felt they were being kind of half-hearted about it initially -- the first time we saw the couple alone in their quarters, the most intimate thing they did was brush their teeth together. But in last night's episode, they had a pretty sweet scene together, a heartfelt kiss and mutual "I love you"s before one of them placed himself in danger.

This is the thing that makes it seem much more natural.

They don't need to overtly highlight it, or shy away from it, they just depict it as naturally as they depict any other relationship on the show, sparingly, but natural when it counts. And when they do that, it seems unforced, not there just because, it seems simply germane to a good story. and that's why it works. It doesn't matter if a show is first, or tenth, it's not a race.

They had a story, and they portrayed it well, natural, lovingly and caringly.

 

[ihno]

Yeah, they have more time in a series. Thanks for your impressions, I'll watch it someday.

 

[Christopher]

This is the thing that makes it seem much more natural.

They don't need to overtly highlight it, or shy away from it, they just depict it as naturally as they depict any other relationship on the show, sparingly, but natural when it counts.

Yeah, but I'd think it would be natural for two people in a relationship to, you know, touch each other occasionally, instead of just standing at a polite distance with stiff body language while pretending to be a couple. That's what I meant -- it wasn't the toothbrushing scene I had a problem with, it was the lack of any other visible sign of intimacy between them, at least until this week. When you see a heterosexual or lesbian couple on TV, there's usually a fair amount of physical affection, touching, kissing, etc -- even just tender looks and smiles. But sometimes it seems there's a reluctance to go there when depicting a gay male relationship on TV. I had the same problem with Curtis and Paul on Arrow. They were husbands, but we virtually never saw them touch each other as far as I can remember, and there was nothing in their body language to suggest they were even attracted to each other. It felt unnatural and evasive to me. I was afraid Discovery was showing the same timidity, but this week's episode reassured me on that front.

 

[GeekUSACarl]

Yeah, but I'd think it would be natural for two people in a relationship to, you know, touch each other occasionally, instead of just standing at a polite distance with stiff body language while pretending to be a couple. That's what I meant -- it wasn't the toothbrushing scene I had a problem with, it was the lack of any other visible sign of intimacy between them, at least until this week. When you see a heterosexual or lesbian couple on TV, there's usually a fair amount of physical affection, touching, kissing, etc -- even just tender looks and smiles. But sometimes it seems there's a reluctance to go there when depicting a gay male relationship on TV. I had the same problem with Curtis and Paul on Arrow. They were husbands, but we virtually never saw them touch each other as far as I can remember, and there was nothing in their body language to suggest they were even attracted to each other. It felt unnatural and evasive to me. I was afraid Discovery was showing the same timidity, but this week's episode reassured me on that front.

Partly what I meant by "as naturally" as they show every other relationship.

From Michael's relationship with her former captain to stamets and culber, the show is pretty stiff with showcasing the relationships. I mean it's a fairly dry show, so I'm at a loss as to call it a criticism, it could just be an aesthetic choice,

It's one of the things that keeps me from being attached to the characters, I mean I can like and appreciate them but personally I have a hard time really "caring" for one without some attachment like this.

Stamets is the first one I can truly care about, they finally gave us a genuine show of love, and caring and concern but yeah, it was a truly dry road getting there.

Maybe they aren't particularly affectionate people too? Either way it's not like it was well explained or flushed out thus far.

So I do agree with you.

:: edit ::

something also just occurred to me,

Stamets was a bit of a dick for a couple/few episodes. I also wouldn't be surprised if he just wasn't an affectionate type a guy too, I dunno they didn't show enough of him and Culber together for me to get a good feel, once again I kinda feel like we're playing fill in the blanks, doing the writer's job for them.

 

[donners22]

I hope it is a little better than the "I give my partner a gay clance and a tip at the shoulder" Sulu on the movies, which also was introduced with a big announcement. As a gay man I found it a little insulting.

Well, you can put aside that perceived insult, because that's not what happened.

There was no "big announcement". It was not mentioned at all until after the world premiere. Thereafter, media asked direct questions of the cast about it and reported their responses.

It is only after thry started copping a bit of flack about it that there were more detailed comments.

 

[Christopher]

From Michael's relationship with her former captain to stamets and culber, the show is pretty stiff with showcasing the relationships. I mean it's a fairly dry show, so I'm at a loss as to call it a criticism, it could just be an aesthetic choice,

Burnham and Tyler have been pretty physical with each other since they got involved, although it's natural to expect a lot of that early in a romance.

Stamets was a bit of a dick for a couple/few episodes. I also wouldn't be surprised if he just wasn't an affectionate type a guy too, I dunno they didn't show enough of him and Culber together for me to get a good feel, once again I kinda feel like we're playing fill in the blanks, doing the writer's job for them.

Sure, you can rationalize the characters that way, but it would still have been the writers' and producers' choice to portray them that way instead of in a more affectionate way. As I said, this week's episode assuaged my concerns about Discovery, but I suspect that shows like Arrow and others are more timid about showing physical affection/intimacy between two men than between two women or a man and a woman, because there's less cultural acceptance of it. A lot of writing is still directed toward the male gaze, and many male viewers would much rather watch two women making out than two men doing so.

 

[GeekUSACarl]

Burnham and Tyler have been pretty physical with each other since they got involved, although it's natural to expect a lot of that early in a romance.




Sure, you can rationalize the characters that way, but it would still have been the writers' and producers' choice to portray them that way instead of in a more affectionate way. As I said, this week's episode assuaged my concerns about Discovery, but I suspect that shows like Arrow and others are more timid about showing physical affection/intimacy between two men than between two women or a man and a woman, because there's less cultural acceptance of it. A lot of writing is still directed toward the male gaze, and many male viewers would much rather watch two women making out than two men doing so.

That's what I meant by doing the writer's job for them.

It's a bit of a pet peeve of mine, we shouldn't be the ones rationalizing the characters.

Sometimes it's a fun exercise but mostly I find it a bit annoying.