Huh? Tartigrades aren't bacteria. They're metazoan animals which are closely related to the stem group which gave rise to arthropods.
Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 1x04 - "The Butcher's Knife Cares Not for the Lamb's Cry"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
Huh? Tartigrades aren't bacteria. They're metazoan animals which are closely related to the stem group which gave rise to arthropods.
All that made it look like she tried to attack the Klingon's out of revenge and then purposely started a war. I think she asks herself if that was her motivation.
I could've sworn Burnham described the creature as bacteria.
You confirm my original suspicions
I have no idea what YMMV means.
I do know what murder means. It seems that is one of many differences between us. In no way were Burnham's actions a murder. It is war. It is live combat. Get real. That is just blatantly incorrect and meritless. No malice aforethought or intent.
Second, your 'analysis' of MB's actions is odd. Borderline non-sensical. So, a person whose parents were killed by Klingon's & whose captain is killed by them in front of her makes a split-second decision to shoot to kill instead of wound = cold blooded murder.
However, a calculating decision that the only way to prevent a war is to commit mutiny & throw away your career but that it is totally worth it is viewed is impulsive?
You view MB's act of killing T'Kumva as both impulsive and a conscious decision. It can't be both. And you are apparently too blind to see this.
Again, I understand you don't want to get into actual examples from Trek history, as it won't help your argument. Particularly the Worf example which you ignored. Again. Or Spock's mutiny in the Cage. Or Kirk's mutiny. Or Data's. And the list goes on.
And in case you missed it. She got thrown in jail for the rest of her life. She wasn't trusted or given vommand again. Now, Kirk and the TOS crew were. Worf was. Odo was. Paris was. Seven was. Data was.
Only Burnham suffers real consequences. Harsh ones. Only the state of war & the Black Ops section 31 feel to Discovery give her a shot at all. Otherwise she rots in prison. Yet you seem upset that SHE got off scott free (as you inaccurately put it) but have zero problems with anyone else?
Wow. I will keep trying but I fear further communication with you may be pointless. Uhura out.
I just assumed they ate her as a sign of a hard won victory. I'm actually surprised Voq managed to keep his group from turning on him for 6 MONTHS because he wouldn't salvage the needed parts from wrecked federation ships to get them out of their cannibalistic conundrum, out of a matter of pride? They were loyal to T'Kumva (sp) not him, or why that other Klingon who wanted to seize the ship just didn't show up and TAKE it with a bunch of soldiers....
Darmok is overrated and the premise doesn't make much sense.
Her exact description is, it "appears to share some natural traits with the Tardigrade species, a docile creature that lives in the waters of the Earth. A micro-animal capable of surviving extreme heat and subfreezing temperatures." It only shares traits with bacteria. This line, perhaps, induced the confusion: "No unregistered microbiota in the transporter's pattern buffer."
G
Gonzo
Guest
I am about to start watching the 4th episode, even so I am a little bit suspicious of Tilly, I don't think she is quite as harmless as she seems.
That was preposterous. I was picturing them on the mining colony lining them up beforehand. "Find me a wailing orphan for this!"
I could be wrong, but I think right now we're supposed to be in the space of seeing this as a difficult snap decision made in the heat of battle. But I have a strong suspicion that down the line we're going to get the emotional confession scene from Burnham -- something along the lines of "in the moment I believed I was making a good call to use deadly force, but now I see it was vengeance that was in my heart and coloring my actions."
Almost analogous to the investigation after some police shootings, the attempts afterwords to parse out what was procedure, and what was a mistake, and how those mistakes were fed by conscious or unconscious bias, and were the decisions corrupted enough that they crossed the line into criminality...
Some intel on four of the bridge crew. Someone on NeoGAF either made this or copied it from elsewhere.
I was hoping someone will post this. This is from the After trek show. I think all of them got a line of dialogue in the latest episode, including Airiam.
I always felt that, esp after I saw the reimagined BSG, where I could feel the danger, strangeness, and aloneness.
On Voyager Janeway talked about emphatically about being alone and short on supplies, but her saying it just underscored how I didn't feel it.
Doesn't explain why they would leave the cloaking device with them. Or did they know that Starfleet's so stupid that they would come back to retrieve a telescope but not bother with the cloaking device.
I liked this episode. As I said last week I didn't care much for for the first two episodes but the past two have felt more like Trek.
Likes
With Burnham's commentary and thoughts on the Tardigrade I finally felt that we were getting back to asking the questions that Trek does well. I haven't felt like that since Enterprise ended. Shades of Devil in the Dark with the creature being largely harmless. A clear commentary on the modern resurgence of the capacity to fear and hate what we don't understand.
Michelle's Yeoh's cameo hinting at exploration.
Stamets. Hated him last week. This week his ranting about not wanting to be on a warship was very welcome. Overall the show is definitely introducing the correct threads for moving away from war and getting the Federation back to what it does best.
The Klingons seems slightly more like old Klingons in this episode, particularly Kol. Plus the trailer for next week's show hinted as a much more familiar Klingon ship interior.
Learning what the "ring" on Discovery's saucer is for. I thought that was quite neat.
Not Sure
What's the deal with Wilson Cruz's campiness? Is he normally that way or has he been told to play the character camp? I hope it's the former because I really don't want them to go down the "must have a camp gay character" route.
Dislikes
Overall, despite my comment above, the Klingons still aren't doing it for me. The redesign continues to annoy me and seem pointless and yet I could get beyond that if they acted like the Klingons we know but they don't. I feel they are the weakest part of the show and so far I see little evidence of this alleged new style exploration of the race. Kurtzman & co talk of the Klingons being just cliché bad guys up until now. It's clear he hasn't see the majority of Berman era Trek because the Klingons of that era seem to have a lot more depth than they do now. With these guys it feels as if the showrunners think we are seeing Klingons for the first time and they have no 50 year backstory.
Cannibal Klingons. Certainly not canon breaking, but it felt, I dunno, just not right. Maybe I just need to get used to the idea.
Birds of Prey. Wow, what a poor design. Look like generic pew pew pew fighters from an old sci-fi fluff.
Continued use of gore. I don't like that they are essentially shutting kids off from this show.
The security chief as moustache twirling villain. Christ on a bike, this character was more predictable than an alt righter defending racists. More dimensional characters than this please writers.
Most of the crew still being in the background. I get that the focus is on Burnham, but what the exception of Lorca and Giorgiou we still don't know much about the rest of the cast. A few hints at Stamets, Tilly and maybe Saru, but these characters still feel pretty one dimensional and uninteresting. It feels like in TOS we had the concentration on three characters, which became seven by the movies, and that the Berman era, rightly, moved forwards to tell shows about a more ensemble cast. This focusing almost entirely on Burnham's arc seems a step in the other direction. I want to know about the other characters as well. Still, next week's looks like a Lorca focused show, so maybe that is still coming.
Overall
Still not won me over on various aspects, but still seeing things I Like and there are enough hints that what I want to see is indeed coming down the road. Enough of a reason to keep giving the show a chance.
Likes
With Burnham's commentary and thoughts on the Tardigrade I finally felt that we were getting back to asking the questions that Trek does well. I haven't felt like that since Enterprise ended. Shades of Devil in the Dark with the creature being largely harmless. A clear commentary on the modern resurgence of the capacity to fear and hate what we don't understand.
Michelle's Yeoh's cameo hinting at exploration.
Stamets. Hated him last week. This week his ranting about not wanting to be on a warship was very welcome. Overall the show is definitely introducing the correct threads for moving away from war and getting the Federation back to what it does best.
The Klingons seems slightly more like old Klingons in this episode, particularly Kol. Plus the trailer for next week's show hinted as a much more familiar Klingon ship interior.
Learning what the "ring" on Discovery's saucer is for. I thought that was quite neat.
Not Sure
What's the deal with Wilson Cruz's campiness? Is he normally that way or has he been told to play the character camp? I hope it's the former because I really don't want them to go down the "must have a camp gay character" route.
Dislikes
Overall, despite my comment above, the Klingons still aren't doing it for me. The redesign continues to annoy me and seem pointless and yet I could get beyond that if they acted like the Klingons we know but they don't. I feel they are the weakest part of the show and so far I see little evidence of this alleged new style exploration of the race. Kurtzman & co talk of the Klingons being just cliché bad guys up until now. It's clear he hasn't see the majority of Berman era Trek because the Klingons of that era seem to have a lot more depth than they do now. With these guys it feels as if the showrunners think we are seeing Klingons for the first time and they have no 50 year backstory.
Cannibal Klingons. Certainly not canon breaking, but it felt, I dunno, just not right. Maybe I just need to get used to the idea.
Birds of Prey. Wow, what a poor design. Look like generic pew pew pew fighters from an old sci-fi fluff.
Continued use of gore. I don't like that they are essentially shutting kids off from this show.
The security chief as moustache twirling villain. Christ on a bike, this character was more predictable than an alt righter defending racists. More dimensional characters than this please writers.
Most of the crew still being in the background. I get that the focus is on Burnham, but what the exception of Lorca and Giorgiou we still don't know much about the rest of the cast. A few hints at Stamets, Tilly and maybe Saru, but these characters still feel pretty one dimensional and uninteresting. It feels like in TOS we had the concentration on three characters, which became seven by the movies, and that the Berman era, rightly, moved forwards to tell shows about a more ensemble cast. This focusing almost entirely on Burnham's arc seems a step in the other direction. I want to know about the other characters as well. Still, next week's looks like a Lorca focused show, so maybe that is still coming.
Overall
Still not won me over on various aspects, but still seeing things I Like and there are enough hints that what I want to see is indeed coming down the road. Enough of a reason to keep giving the show a chance.
There are all kinds of instances on the shows where stun setting doesn't work. It has to ne turned up, people repeatedly shot. Her only shot is to waste him & try to see if Georgiou can be transported to sick bay.
The real issue is Saru's giving up too soon. I mean, how often have we seen patients revived after being dead for minutes. Granted, later in the timeline. Still, she's only been dead for seconds. Has to be brain activity still. Saru didn't even wait 5 seconds for his beloved Captain?
She deliberately, and carefully, turned her phaser to kill. Then took careful aim and went for a killshot to the region of arteries leading over the Klingon torasic region where the heart is, a lingering and painful way to kill someone. Even a Klingon.
She used her Vulcan clam and skill to make him suffer.
She used her Vulcan clam and skill to make him suffer.
VOY was never going to be anything other than what it was... and accepting that truth is the first step in recognizing it for the "great Star Trek" that it is.
And VOY had a recreational Holodeck that somehow had a power source unusable/incompatible with all other systems of the ship; so hey, no reason to turn it off/use it sparingly to save power. Plus every species and station they met seemed to have fully compatible technology and food stores, so hey, it's really just a long roadtrip.
Changed my vote from a nine, to an eight.
It was a good solid 8, on reflection (and a night’s sleep!)
Edit: doh - can’t change my vote. My bad! Nevermind.
It was a good solid 8, on reflection (and a night’s sleep!)
Edit: doh - can’t change my vote. My bad! Nevermind.
Good episode. Also voted 8.
The Discovery design is still fugly (exterior - the interiors are good). The Shenzhou is - oops, was - far better. The rotation is cool and mitigates the fugliness somewhat, but one wonders at the science and purpose other than coolness. I guess there are no quarters in that ring? It's a hell of a centrifuge.
I like that the show does NOT try to imitate or extrapolate the literal look of the 1960s vision of the future, but our more modern vision of the future. It's all subjective anyway and still probably not future-proof, but better to go with our point of view than live in the past.
It seems to be following my prediction for going Game of Thrones on Trek with Rekha Sharma’s Commander Landry. I liked her. So sad. I'm calling Jason Isaacs going all Sean Bean by the end of the season or start of the next.
The Discovery design is still fugly (exterior - the interiors are good). The Shenzhou is - oops, was - far better. The rotation is cool and mitigates the fugliness somewhat, but one wonders at the science and purpose other than coolness. I guess there are no quarters in that ring? It's a hell of a centrifuge.
I like that the show does NOT try to imitate or extrapolate the literal look of the 1960s vision of the future, but our more modern vision of the future. It's all subjective anyway and still probably not future-proof, but better to go with our point of view than live in the past.
It seems to be following my prediction for going Game of Thrones on Trek with Rekha Sharma’s Commander Landry. I liked her. So sad.
I'm calling Jason Isaacs going all Sean Bean by the end of the season or start of the next.
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