Voyager season 3

[cosmic mouse]

I remember not liking Rise at first. But upon later viewings I actually enjoyed it. I grew to really like Neelix. I think he's terribly underrated as a character, and Ethan Phillips is underrated as an actor.

I strongly suspect that, after I finish my initial viewing of Voyager, I will go back and re-watch specific episodes, if not the entire series at some point. So it's possible my appreciation of some characters (and actors) will increase over time and/or I will pick up on details that I missed first time around.

I am serious when I say that I'm really enjoying this series and you guys don't know me from a hole in the wall, but I am not normally a fan of television series. I am way, way more of a film/cinephile person... there are less than 10 TV series that I can say I've seen over the years that I actually like and/or love and I have gone back and rewatched all of those, even just in spots... and I can now add Voyager to that list. And I'm barely halfway through the series!

 

[Sophie74656]

I strongly suspect that, after I finish my initial viewing of Voyager, I will go back and re-watch specific episodes, if not the entire series at some point. So it's possible my appreciation of some characters (and actors) will increase over time and/or I will pick up on details that I missed first time around.

I am serious when I say that I'm really enjoying this series and you guys don't know me from a hole in the wall, but I am not normally a fan of television series. I am way, way more of a film/cinephile person... there are less than 10 TV series that I can say I've seen over the years that I actually like and/or love and I have gone back and rewatched all of those, even just in spots... and I can now add Voyager to that list. And I'm barely halfway through the series!

And you haven't even seen the best episodes yet!!

Going back and rewatching is always fun, especially if it's been a while. Every so often I'll go back and watch some of my favorites. Several months ago I started from the beginning and watched every episode because my boyfriend had not seen any and he wanted to watch them. It had been a couple of years since I watched everything in order, and I definately feel like I picked up a couple things I didn't before.

 

[2takesfrakes]

The problem on these fora is that people are so sure their opinion is the only right one. Also, some people get hurt if they love a character/an episode and others don't.
I mean ... Janeway is a goddess for me ... But I don't mind if other people don't like her. However, ... and here's the crux of it, there's a certain civility that should go with expressing one's negative opinion and most people are incapable of doing this. Which is strange, the only thing they'd need to do is to start their sentences with "I think" or "In my opinion" ...
No big deal ...

Okay, my fellow artist. As for me, I don't consider myself an artist. I am a teacher ... making these wallpapers is just a pleasant way of spending my free time. The best thing for those of you who like (some of) them is probably the end result, the wallpaper itself. I'm not saying there aren't a few I don't love (hell I love most of them ) but for me it's different: it is the process of making them that I enjoy the most. While playing with who should be where in the picture with who else, what background I should use and what colours there should be in the wallpaper, I relive the episodes from a different angle - and this is fun. Hell it's even more than that: it is great delight!

Yes, it's true ... I've been known to take a Street Fighter approach to my posts in the past. Even now, I'll sometimes ruffle feathers, because of a post, or two. But where there is "drama" on these boards, the name 2takesfrakes is absent and this is not an accidental happenstance. I like people, I've always maintained that and I really like discussing STAR TREK with them. I've even abandoned conversations, to avoid causing "problems" on these boards. For example, there was a conversation, once, about finding people to go out with on The Internet. I was - and ever shall be - vehemently against that, as you'll not find anyone good on the computer. But some on here claim to have and challenged me to answer how that was possible, if my view was correct. Instead of saying, "you found someone on the net because you're just as whacked out as they are," I just bailed out on that discussion, so that the world would not explode. Another thing is that I've never, ever - Not Once! - posted a "Babe of the Week" thread, or posted any responses in others. The reasons for this are two: First, because I already know who's hot and I don't need anyone's bullshit opinions on what's fact. And Second ... because "Babe of the Week" threads only lead to mischief. I'm on the side of the angels, but my detractors take no notice. They just want to hate on 2takesfrakes, because they know I'm all Iron & Nails. They're like, "... he can take it." That's another reason why I'm such a fan of Chakotay. He's derided so much, but he's cool as all hell -- just like me!

 

[cosmic mouse]

... That's another reason why I'm such a fan of Chakotay. He's derided so much, but he's cool as all hell -- just like me!

He is cool as all hell... hmmmmm. Do you look like Chak too? Because, you know, I once heard someone say on a forum one time that the internet was a good place to meet people.

I kid, I jest, 2tf, really... and I'm a blank slate (at least as far as anything you've done or not done here in the past) and don't tend to take things personally. I think we'll get along fine... and, yeah, Chakotay rocks.


edit: even though I jumped in there and responded to a post not directed at me... apologies of I offend!

 

[Sophie74656]

He is cool as all hell... hmmmmm. Do you look like Chak too? Because, you know, I once heard someone say on a forum one time that the internet was a good place to meet people.

I kid, I jest, 2tf, really... and I'm a blank slate (at least as far as anything you've done or not done here in the past) and don't tend to take things personally. I think we'll get along fine... and, yeah, Chakotay rocks.


edit: even though I jumped in there and responded to a post not directed at me... apologies of I offend!

The internet is a good place to meet people...especially if you are more of an introvert. I met my boyfriend online (and he has a resemblance to Tom...blue eyes )

 

[cosmic mouse]

Well, I have met several friends online on forums, but so far no boyfriends. And I am pretty introverted actually, although I have pretty high confidence and I'm moderately sociable, so I guess it evens out. Sort of.
Good on you for meeting your current man online though, Sophie. So far I haven't had much success utilizing the Internet in that manner. I find it to be really hit or miss, more so than when I meet people the old school way.

 

[Refuge]

Blood Fever, was not a favorite of mine. On my first viewing, I wasn’t that into the Paris-Torres relationship and I thought Vorik transferring his Pon Farr to B'Elanna and then her beating him in a fight was dumb. It was funny though when Paris tells Chakotay that she bit him. Reminds me of when Suzie Plakston played an acerbic half Klingon on NexGen and tells someone, “It’s OK, I don’t bite… Oh, actually, I do.”

Anyway, I did like the ruins and the mystery of what happened to the inhabitants. And then to find the people live in the caves, and are very camouflaged so that they can appear out of nowhere, was very cool. And of course, finding the Borg drone corpse at the end explained what happened. So interesting.

The ending had a nice (Borg) haunting promise, lol.

I didn't like the B'Ellana/Vorik situation either. B'Ellana getting the Pon Farr.. it was a mess. Vorik has it first and his attack on B'Ellana then means she gets it and gets to pounce on Tom and then B'Ellana and Vorik fight, and we find out Klingons are stronger than Vulcans. Or some such crazed versions of each other. Then 'poof' Pon Farr gone. Whether all that fits Vulcan and Klingon lore it was awkward to watch.

 

[Thomas Eugene]

I watched Rise and Favorite Son yesterday... Rise was okay I guess, even though I'm not a real fan of Neelix. I didn't particularly care for Favorite Son either, but you all know my general opinion of Harry by now.
Before and After is next! ....hopefully tonight or tomorrow.

RISE is a big fav of mine - FAVORITE SON is less so. It is one of the weaker episodes in my book, it's just lacking something (can't tell you what). And since I'm gay, the episode isn't redeemed by the many women for me (and that one guy they had on it wasn't particularly good-looking ...). Although it's good that the Terminator girl is in it ...
Here's a wallpaper for RISE:

Oh, I hear you. There was a time in my life, oh 25 years ago or so, when I would have watched anything with Ewan McGregor in it, even if he was just mowing the damn lawn.

Oh yes ... he is another big fav of mine ... esp. as Obi-Wan Kenobi in the second and third episodes. Although I know that in real life he is short ... Still there's something very sexy about him.

Yes, it's true ... I've been known to take a Street Fighter approach to my posts in the past. Even now, I'll sometimes ruffle feathers, because of a post, or two. But where there is "drama" on these boards, the name 2takesfrakes is absent and this is not an accidental happenstance. I like people, I've always maintained that and I really like discussing STAR TREK with them. I've even abandoned conversations, to avoid causing "problems" on these boards. For example, there was a conversation, once, about finding people to go out with on The Internet. I was - and ever shall be - vehemently against that, as you'll not find anyone good on the computer. But some on here claim to have and challenged me to answer how that was possible, if my view was correct. Instead of saying, "you found someone on the net because you're just as whacked out as they are," I just bailed out on that discussion, so that the world would not explode. Another thing is that I've never, ever - Not Once! - posted a "Babe of the Week" thread, or posted any responses in others. The reasons for this are two: First, because I already know who's hot and I don't need anyone's bullshit opinions on what's fact. And Second ... because "Babe of the Week" threads only lead to mischief. I'm on the side of the angels, but my detractors take no notice. They just want to hate on 2takesfrakes, because they know I'm all Iron & Nails. They're like, "... he can take it." That's another reason why I'm such a fan of Chakotay. He's derided so much, but he's cool as all hell -- just like me!

What's a 'Babe of the Week" thread? Do we have something similar here on the VOY board?
Well, if those people have found the love of their lives on the Internet, there's nothing wrong with that. I guess this works like everything else: some people find it good and some find it bad. You seem to be pissed off by the fact that some people have found their love here. Why does that bother you?
As for me, the only thread that's like a red rag to a bull for me is when they start bashing Janeway's hair ... As someone once pointed out (s)he was waiting for a thread where they would start bashing Picard's or Sisko's hair ...

 

[Lynx]

Both "Rise" and "Favorite Son" are good episodes.
"Favorite Son" is often criticized but I find it exciting. The best Harry Kim episode of the series.

 

[Sophie74656]

Both "Rise" and "Favorite Son" are good episodes.
"Favorite Son" is often criticized but I find it exciting. The best Harry Kim episode of the series.

I strongly disagree. Harry is featured in this episode but it does nothing for him. There's no character development or exploration, he doesn't learn anything or grow from this epidoe at all. The Disease, Nightengale, and Timeless are much better Harry episodes because they do all that.

 

[2takesfrakes]

He is cool as all hell... hmmmmm. Do you look like Chak too? Because, you know, I once heard someone say on a forum one time that the internet was a good place to meet people.

I kid, I jest, 2tf, really... and I'm a blank slate (at least as far as anything you've done or not done here in the past) and don't tend to take things personally. I think we'll get along fine... and, yeah, Chakotay rocks.


edit: even though I jumped in there and responded to a post not directed at me... apologies of I offend!

No 'offense' taken -- type freely, in my presence & without fear! And yes, we will get along, fine. Just fine! To answer your query, I do not look like Chakotay, or even Riker, for that matter. I'll tell you, though, I'm sometimes too good looking for my own good! Had this cougar, the other day, lusting after me, as she saw me walking down the street ... just minding my own business. And she's moaning at me, as I pass, you know? She's all like, "mmmmmmmmmm ... " like she's hungry, in the sexual sense. The sound effects I didn't care for, but if she wants to check me out, then ... fine! Feast your eyes! Enjoy the sight. There is a moral to this tale, everyone out there ... so, be mindful:

The cougar wants the cub ... the cub does not want the cougar!

What's a 'Babe of the Week" thread? Do we have something similar here on the VOY board?

A thread where gentlemen (usually) post a different T&A model every week and discuss her many & varied attributes, often times with accompanying photographs. Could be about anyone famous, though - up to and including STAR TREK actresses.

Well, if those people have found the love of their lives on the Internet, there's nothing wrong with that. I guess this works like everything else: some people find it good and some find it bad. You seem to be pissed off by the fact that some people have found their love here. Why does that bother you?
As for me, the only thread that's like a red rag to a bull for me is when they start bashing Janeway's hair ... As someone once pointed out (s)he was waiting for a thread where they would start bashing Picard's or Sisko's hair ...

I may seem "pissed by the fact that some people have found their love" on The Internet, but you have my every assurance, this is not the case. Experience has taught me that Love is a Contact Sport. There's just nobody "good," as in "worth having" to be found on dating sites and so-on. Go to local event parties, or festivals, or block parties, wherever there are people, and in plenty. That's the equation that works and I won't charge you for the use of it, Thomas. For you, sir? My 2 cents are absolutely FREE of charge! As to Janeway's hairstyle, when she kept it short, it did not flatter her, at all. Though Seven of Nine was not my favourite character on VOYAGER, Jeri Ryan had really gorgeous hair! Made me want to just run my hands through it, her hair looked so healthy! Like she belonged in a shampoo commercial, or some shit ...

 

[cosmic mouse]

The cougar wants the cub ... the cub does not want the cougar!

Bummer, man... looks like I'm sol then!

 

[Odonna]

Fantastic! I haven't been called young for some time now ... but thanks for the compliment ...

Or simply break their journey, settle down on a planet, mix with the locals ... and then things would have happened more "naturally" ...
So if you're stuck on a ship with 150 people, you won't necessarily find the partner you'd want to have children with ... And to have children because circumstances beg for it ... and to have them with people who you'd choose because you can't find better ones ... that would be a little too much for me. I'd surely remain childless.
Of course, if I could seduce Tommyboy ..., that would be a completely new situation ...

You’re welcome, TE, you youngster, you!

Yes, I actually thought Chakotay in Scorpion made a little more sense in that regard, that they might need to turn back and try to find a safer route, maybe even find a nice planet, while they reassess the journey.

I can see I’m not getting any agreement on re-populating the ship. :-( Though I can relate to what you are saying. But I would like to share the following as food for thought. A few years ago, I was able to locate the farm site of one of my colonial ancestors that was in the family for a couple of generations. As I studied the land deeds in the town archives, I came to realize that his son, who was also my line, had married twice, and both times had found his wife at a farm next door! I noticed this occurred in other family lines as well. Some towns had already created “Founders Maps” showing the locations of the early families, and I noticed that they as well had married someone next door, or a short ways down the street. Now I say this as someone who did not marry until I was 44 and had to cross the continent to find my compatible partner! But it does make me wonder about our modern expectations. When the accessible “pickins” are fewer, do we adapt? I don’t know. Just food for thought.

I will mention that at the only Star Trek event I ever went to I met “Tommyboy” very briefly at the signature table. Although he wasn’t my #1 favorite character on the show (though he was sitting next to him), he is certainly among the more interesting. In the few seconds of talking with him, I found him very personable and friendly. Seemed like a nice guy. My appreciation of him went up at least 10%!

 

[2takesfrakes]

Bummer, man... looks like I'm sol then!

Not at all, cosmic mouse! Not ... at ... all. You'll note my avatar and signature. Contained within are a constant reminder to us all that there really is someone for everyone. Not that it always works out, in the end. But, as the British poet Lord Alfred Tennyson once so eloquently stated:

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

Hey! Chakotay was a living example of this, was he not?

 

[Thomas Eugene]

There's just nobody "good," as in "worth having" to be found on dating sites and so-on.

Well ... although I don't use these sites (any more ... ), I guess the very same people are there that you'd meet in real life. I mean I can imagine that you meet some people who are not on these sites in their physical form at actual events but most people I know use such sites (as well as go to events) ... and some of them have even found a wife or a husband on the Internet.

For you, sir? My 2 cents are absolutely FREE of charge!

They are? That's really big of you ... But hey ... thanks anyway.

As to Janeway's hairstyle, when she kept it short, it did not flatter her, at all.

I understand that people have (strong) opinions about this - although they seem to be a lot more vocal about Janeway's hairstyle than about any other person's hairstyle in the entire ST franchise - but when this becomes a fifty-page long (heated) debate, that's a bit too much for me.
Also, there seems to be a general agreement that her hairstyle only looks good from YEAR OF HELL on. As for me, I liked her with any hair with the exception of the way she wore it in PARTURITION. But it's not like I absolutely need to start a thread about this and scream it to the world that Janeway's hair sucked in that one episode. However, this is what most people do and very often they make it seem like their whole enjoyment of VOY was destroyed by the Captain's hairstyle.

You’re welcome, TE, you youngster, you!

Thanks, Odonna ... just keep on flattering me ...

But it does make me wonder about our modern expectations. When the accessible “pickins” are fewer, do we adapt? I don’t know. Just food for thought.

If something similar happened to me that happened to the crew of VOY, circumstances might change my perception of certain things - so much is true. I can't really speculate about anything beyond that since I'm gay so even imagining having children in real life is difficult for me - not to mention under extreme circumstances like those under which Voyager finds herself. But I can tell you that one of the things I really love about this show is that in spite of the extreme circumstances, the crew kept up a very pleasant morale and in this sense it set me a good example. On other shows like SG Universe or Babylon 5, similar circumstances resulted in a much less acceptable atmosphere (acceptable to me that is) but here the stories did not focus on the depression this caused for the crew but on the brave face they put on their changed circumstances - in no small part thanks to Janeway - and showed that extreme circumstances can forge you into a family and there's a chance you can avoid all the hostility we get on ST Universe for example.

Yes, I actually thought Chakotay in Scorpion made a little more sense in that regard, that they might need to turn back and try to find a safer route, maybe even find a nice planet, while they reassess the journey.

It would have been interesting if they had done so for, say, five or ten episodes, and then for some reason had been forced to continue their journey. In this way we could have been shown that Janeway did try to avoid the alliance with the Borg but ultimately she had no other choice.

I will mention that at the only Star Trek event I ever went to I met “Tommyboy” very briefly at the signature table. Although he wasn’t my #1 favorite character on the show (though he was sitting next to him), he is certainly among the more interesting. In the few seconds of talking with him, I found him very personable and friendly. Seemed like a nice guy. My appreciation of him went up at least 10%!

This means from 95% to 105%, right?
I don't ever remember reading anything bad about the actor anywhere on the Internet. It seems that my appreciation of the character coincides with that of the actor, which is often not the case with several other people (most notably in the case of Avery Brooks, where I like the Sisko character but the actor acts - no pun intended - at conventions like he is drugged or something and in the case of Michael Shanks from StarGate where I don't really like Daniel Jackson but the actor seems super nice). So it's good to know that "Robbieboy" is just as loveable as "Tommyboy" although my feelings (whatever they are) have always been there for the character only and not so much for the actor. But I wish him all the best and it would be nice to meet him one day but this'll probably never happen because it's highly unlikely I can go to the US any time.

Anyway @cosmic mouse , are you making progress with Season Three?

 

[Prax]

By short, do you mean her hair in the later seasons. If so, I agree. Her hair was best in season 1-4, especially the pony tail in 2-4.

(Yes, with all of the elaborate discussion going on, I focused in on Janeway's hair. I must be shallow)

 

[cosmic mouse]

Anyway @cosmic mouse , are you making progress with Season Three?

...watched Before and After and Distant Origin recently, so I'm making some headway:

Before and After I really liked... it's probably the best Kes ep so far imho. The concept of Kes moving backwards through time/reverse aging was pretty cool and handled well in the ep. I also liked the Doctor's involvement and the role he played (I am having some mixed feelings about the Doctor as a character, but maybe I'll touch on that more as I get into season 4). I guess this one is also related to an upcoming ep I haven't got to yet... I either read that somewhere or someone here posted it. Either way that's something to look forward to.

Distant Origin is probably one of my favorite episodes of the first 3 seasons, so far, although I need to let is "settle" a bit. One of my favorite aspects of VOY are the main characters, but it was nice to see the plot told more from the perspective of the aliens for a change. That's not unique to this ep, but I thought it was done particularly well here. I also felt genuine sympathy for the character of Forra Gegen and I thought that character was well-played and well-written. And this was also another nice ep for Chakotay. On the critical side the central theory that drove the plot was a little flimsy, but if the viewer takes that with a grain (like many other things presented in the ST universe) I thought this was a very strong episode overall.

 

[2takesfrakes]

Well ... although I don't use these sites (any more ... ), I guess the very same people are there that you'd meet in real life. I mean I can imagine that you meet some people who are not on these sites in their physical form at actual events but most people I know use such sites (as well as go to events) ... and some of them have even found a wife or a husband on the Internet.

Well, there is some overlap, to be sure, but when it comes to Men and women ... one thing is for certain, Thomas:

It takes teamwork to make The Dream work!
-- It takes two!

It's not often that I think of Janeway as cute, but in Season 3 (in an attempt, here, to stay on topic), I found her to be so, when Q was hitting on her, right after he gave her the puppy. When he's bragging on his sexual prowess and ... and so forth ... to impress her, Kate Mulgrew's mugging for the camera the whole time and there's this sort of glow about her, reminiscent of how TOS treated its actresses, back in the day. Way, way ... WAY back in the day!

 

[Paul Weaver]

I liked the callbacks to Basics and other s1/2 episodes in Distant Origin - makes you feel like they really happened, I really value that kind of continuity.

 

[Lynx]

...watched Before and After and Distant Origin recently, so I'm making some headway:

Before and After I really liked... it's probably the best Kes ep so far imho. The concept of Kes moving backwards through time/reverse aging was pretty cool and handled well in the ep. I also liked the Doctor's involvement and the role he played (I am having some mixed feelings about the Doctor as a character, but maybe I'll touch on that more as I get into season 4). I guess this one is also related to an upcoming ep I haven't got to yet... I either read that somewhere or someone here posted it. Either way that's something to look forward to.

Distant Origin is probably one of my favorite episodes of the first 3 seasons, so far, although I need to let is "settle" a bit. One of my favorite aspects of VOY are the main characters, but it was nice to see the plot told more from the perspective of the aliens for a change. That's not unique to this ep, but I thought it was done particularly well here. I also felt genuine sympathy for the character of Forra Gegen and I thought that character was well-played and well-written. And this was also another nice ep for Chakotay. On the critical side the central theory that drove the plot was a little flimsy, but if the viewer takes that with a grain (like many other things presented in the ST universe) I thought this was a very strong episode overall.

I like "Before And After" but I don't consider it the best Kes episode, those honors go to "Cold Fire" and "Persistence Of Vision".
Jennifer Lien's acting was excellent but the whole story with that constant jumping between now and then gave me a headache, a little bit over the top for me. Still a good one.

"Distant Origin" is great. I agree with your comments on that episode.