I wondered about that when I saw the housing prices. I was like, "Man, in that area?! Those houses must be utter shitholes!"
The Walking Dead Season 6 Discussion
- Thread starter Tom
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I mean that it cannot work for a group's survival. for example, Rick tried negotiating with the Governor for a non-violent resolution:
--essentially, a "life is precious" based plea, but that goes nowhere with those hell bent on your death, especially in group situations where there's more to lose (people, resources, etc.). So, "life is precious" works fine--when you're isolated as you will never have to compromise that value. The Wolves' attack proves Morgan's belief is not applicable to a group that required defense, or offensive measures.
In short, try applying "all life is precious" when Terminus is uncompromising in trying to eat you, or the Wolves are cutting your throats for reasons beyond human understanding.
How do you meld Morgan's belief with animistic butchers? The Governor? Terminus?
Depends when the show is based. We don't have an exact year for the show. We are 553 days post-zombies. There is some speculation about a 2010 start date, so we need to compare to 2010 home prices, not to 2015 prices.
Even in 2010 $800,000 would be the price of a pretty crummy home in Alexandria, Virginia. That area of the country has some of the highest housing prices in the country.
YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 
Yeah, Morpheus--YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If the preview of the mid season finale is any indicator, the group will be hit harder than the same point in S5 E8.
Tara seems like she's being set up for her to go the redshirt route. Masterson is pregnant, but for the moment, she's not playing an important character (like Sonequa Martin who was pregnant during season 5), and her "that's what we do" while true within the group, somehow makes her seem reckless.
Ron: there's no way he's getting out of this season alive, since its clear the series is trying to follow the comic.
Morgan: he has not learned a thing...unless the wolf-man will *suddenly* see the light during the coming disaster. Then again, I can also see him simply being a "wolf (intended) in sheep's clothing," helping the group, gaining their trust (to a point), only to set them up for death as he always intended.
Enid: too many issues, but why does it seem her flashback (from "JSS") is not how things really unfolded for her family?
If the preview of the mid season finale is any indicator, the group will be hit harder than the same point in S5 E8.
Tara seems like she's being set up for her to go the redshirt route. Masterson is pregnant, but for the moment, she's not playing an important character (like Sonequa Martin who was pregnant during season 5), and her "that's what we do" while true within the group, somehow makes her seem reckless.
Ron: there's no way he's getting out of this season alive, since its clear the series is trying to follow the comic.
Morgan: he has not learned a thing...unless the wolf-man will *suddenly* see the light during the coming disaster. Then again, I can also see him simply being a "wolf (intended) in sheep's clothing," helping the group, gaining their trust (to a point), only to set them up for death as he always intended.
Enid: too many issues, but why does it seem her flashback (from "JSS") is not how things really unfolded for her family?
YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Agreed!
Rick was a total ass tearing town Gabriel's notices. I'm not sure his motive is about an issue with Gabriel, or he's become some militant atheist, but in any case, his behavior is sort of screaming for him to earn some serious pain.
Well, if she was good at her job, then Ron could not get what he needs to...
In other news, I think it's time we pulled Olivia off of armory detail. She's effing awful at it.
Well, if she was good at her job, then Ron could not get what he needs to...
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Note: we aren't all familiar with what happens in the comics
I suppose no one was too surprised by Glenn's fate. And I'll say it again those Alexandrians must have lemming DNA or something, their lack of survival instinct is quite remarkable. Dude only found losing his shoe to be of note after that.
I thought the balloons were a nice way to show that Enid still had a tinge of kid in her no matter how hard she tries to deny it.
I suppose no one was too surprised by Glenn's fate. And I'll say it again those Alexandrians must have lemming DNA or something, their lack of survival instinct is quite remarkable. Dude only found losing his shoe to be of note after that.
I thought the balloons were a nice way to show that Enid still had a tinge of kid in her no matter how hard she tries to deny it.
I think he realizes the severity of what had just happened and he was just being humorously glib.
Maybe. But, Gabriel was also an ass for "warning" Deanna about Rick and the rest of the group after they'd saved his life numerous times, had take him in and under their protection on the trip from the Georgia area to Alexandria and *he* was the one that left his flock outside the church to be savagely torn apart by the walkers.
I don't know what Rick's angle is, it could be just to rub salt in Gabriel's wounds, a militant Atheism or it could be part of his plan to "harden" the Alexandrians. It's hard to get a group of people to realize the harsh, cold, realities of this world when they're praying to God (which given the state of the world it would seem "God" has pretty much decided to have a much more creative way to "flood the Earth" in the hopes of starting over like he did with Noah) singing Hymns and, like Morgan, taking on an "all life is precious" sort of meaning. The Six Commandment is hard thing to live by when there's entire groups of people out there set to kill you.
I guess seeing her getting the balloons I more thought it was genuinely out of wanting a signaling device for others and not a kid wanting balloons. She is, after all, a teenager who's lived in a very harsh world for the better part of two years or more, I think balloons wouldn't be on her mind anymore.
And, yes, finally we get an answer to what happened to Glenn although at this point it was something we all expected to see happen. Good to see him finally back and it'll be interesting to see if the events had "changed" him. It was nice to see the "alternate angle" of what happened and of Nicholas' intestines being ripped out over Glenn's body.
So... Are Walkers really bad at finishing their meal? Why was the "I got to see my wife guy" still mostly intact when he was found? Given the herd that was there and ripping into him I'd think he'd have been mostly devoured by the time he would have turned. But he looked mostly fine. I'd think he'd look more like the "Bicyclist Walker" Rick ran into in the park in Episode 1.
Good on Rick, Carol and Michonne on calling Morgan out on his "this pacifist nonsense is incompatible with the world today" bullshit. Setting aside the vegetarianism/vegan lifestyle it inherently suggests (if "all life is precious" why doesn't that extend to plant life? Or the microbial life needed to make, say, goat cheese? Or is it only life that has a face?) but in this world, as the Governor said, you either kill and you live or you die and then you kill. (para)
Rick put the chain of events together, Morgan let the Wolves go and they ended up ambushing Rick in the RV. If Rick hadn't been so quick on the draw he could have been killed by the Wolves and not been able to get back to Alexandria in order to prepare them for the herd coming their way and lead them in what's coming next.
Nice mis-direction with the "bleeding wall" (which did seem to be from a rivet hole or something in the siding) being a breach point for the herd. Instead it was the collapsing building that took down the wall to allow the herd in.
Hmmmm.... That's going to be a lot of Walkers to take out. I sure hope they have some means to, say to take a bunch out at once. I dunno, by lobbing a grenade at them. Perhaps propelling the grenade with a rocket or something.
Seriously, yeah, what's her name sucks at guarding the pantry. And when is there going to be a confrontation between her and Carol regarding her seeing Carol kicking ass in her apocalypse hijab?
And then there's angsty teenage kid. So, it would seem, he's more-or-less gotten on Rick's side and his issues are with Carl over Enid? When Rick was teaching him to use the gun I'm surprised he didn't teach him the "Rick way" of holding the gun by kind-of holding it up way high and pointing the gun down slightly in order to aim/fire it.
Maggie's reaction to seeing Glenn's signal he's alive and out there was touching.
Rosita's dressing down of Eugene during their combat-training was funny. Can we see Eugene and Rosita hook up instead of Rosita and Spencer? That'd be pretty damn awesome.
Tara may not be long for this world considering the "arc" she's had over these last few episodes, the most she's really done since the arc with the Governor.
So I guess the Wolf Morgan captured wasn't bitten/scratched by a Walker and just has a simple(r) scratch/injury?
It is nice to see a slightly more rational and thoughtful Rick instead of the slightly maniacal man he's been. Maybe that kiss with Jessie tempered him some? (Yeah, he snapped at Tara, but his talk with the guy helping him shore-up the wall, teaching what's-his-name to use the gun and other things here and there has shown a bit more thoughtful Rick than the "Ricktator" or, worse, the "Rick-ovenor."
All and all, good episode and be interesting to see what our cliffhanger or tension hook is to end the mid-season next week.
Gabriel gave them shelter, but from the start, Rick thought the worst of him. If Gabriel turned them away--never showing them the location of the church, its almost a guarantee that the group would have suffered more casualties at the hands of the Terminus survivors, since they would have remained outdoors, and Gareth was already close to getting Carol.
Further, Gabriel witnessed the witnessed the Terminus members hacked/stabbed to death--an act so horrifying that Glenn, Maggie, Tyreese and Tara watched in shock. If members of the group were shocked by such brutality (after just escaping a cannibal cult--think about that), imagine how Gabriel--a man who has never participated in, or witnessed such unrelenting barbarity--considered Rick's group.
So, the relationship between Gabriel & Rick's group is not one-sided at all. Does Rick know that Gabriel helped Maggie and Sasha with prayer when both were still reeling from their sudden tragedies? All of the aggressive survivalist mindset in the world was not helping either woman with the death of loved ones. By tearing down the prayer announcements, Rick is not only attacking Gabriel, but disregarding the feelings of any other Alexandria resident who would be interested in the service. That's not his right, or business.
I maintain that Rick is setting himself up for something terrible to happen to him--or perhaps Carl or Judith. He's getting to the point where he pushes, compromises and schemes in a manner reminiscent of season 2 Shane. For several seasons, we have watched other characters stand as contrasts to his behavior: Glenn, Hershel, Tyreese, Daryl, Bob and recently, Michonne (the latter in his mistrust in even trying to find a decent place to live / keeping the Alexandria residents at arm's length).
It will be fitting if the group splits into two camps, and who among them believe Rick's way is the better path to take.
Humans have always lived in situations where others were trying to kill them, but there are endless numbers who did not return the "favor," or let go of faith. Hershel was certainly aware of deadly people (Randall's gang, the Governor), but he did not lose sight of the greater call to the human purpose, lest civilization all join the aggressor survivalist side, and at that point, what is life worth?
...and the Governor's world view is the reason he is dead, as in time, one can rationalize murder as a means to survival in any, random case, including taking what others have to support your existence (the National Guard group and ultimately, the prison). Or killing others who really want nothing to do with you, but you see them as a threat (sending Merle's death squad after Michonne).
The actors say their characters'relationship is like a brother & sister, but with Abraham seeking the company of other women, who knows where it will go? Eugene--if he survives--cannot be the odd man out forever.
Disagree. As has just been said, prayer isn't going to do jack for them in this situation. They've got work to do, and the great invisible man ain't gonna do it for them.
Plus, Gabriel has almost gotten them killed more than once. The last thing I'd want to do is say Hail Mary's with him. He needs to go meet his maker.
I do agree that Morgan needs to alter his approach when it comes to killing-- especially if he's going to be part of their community-- but I also don't think he should be faulted too much for wanting to hold onto what is a very noble and honorable ideal. Or that he should be responsible for every bad thing someone chooses to do in the future if he doesn't kill him on the spot.
I just don't buy this idea some fans seem to have that the only way to survive in this zombie apocalypse is to be as ruthless and unforgiving as possible.
I just don't buy this idea some fans seem to have that the only way to survive in this zombie apocalypse is to be as ruthless and unforgiving as possible.
I don't think you need to be ruthless and unforgiving, but you should probably be willing to kill in self defense.
About what you're responsible for, we've all seen this lesson over and over. Rick learned it when he let Andrew go without killing him at the prison. That lesson has stuck with him, and so in this world you kind of are responsible for taking half measures.
About Rick being a dick to Gabriel. Yeah, maybe he is, but Gabriel is still being naive. It doesn't have anything to do with religion, it has to do with people focusing on survival. At the current moment, there isn't time for stuff like that.
About what you're responsible for, we've all seen this lesson over and over. Rick learned it when he let Andrew go without killing him at the prison. That lesson has stuck with him, and so in this world you kind of are responsible for taking half measures.
About Rick being a dick to Gabriel. Yeah, maybe he is, but Gabriel is still being naive. It doesn't have anything to do with religion, it has to do with people focusing on survival. At the current moment, there isn't time for stuff like that.
Prayer saved Sasha's life, and gave Maggie hope. Rick's way offered no solace for them at all, and again, Rick's not only attacking Gabriel, but disregarding others who want to participate in a service. Rick has no business in that matter at all.
The moment you play dictator, the rules are off, and as this series has illustrated time after time, dictators disrespecting individuals leads to their own failure, misery or death.
If Gabriel had not offered his church, that group would have lost many to the hunting Terminus members lurking in the woods. Moreover, he took them to the pantry for food they were not about come across on their own.
Playing Devil's advocate, its been said (by Carl) he did not learn it, since he had the opportunity to kill the Governor during their meeting ("Arrow on the Doorpost"), but failed to do so. Martinez was the only capable member outside, so if gunfire was heard, Daryl or Hershel were more than ready to stop anything else from happening. With the Governor (and possibly Martinez) dead, Andrea might still be alive, and its questionable if Milton or Shumpert would continue the Governor's plot once the "head" was removed.
Being an ass to Gabriel is not going to make anyone better prepared for an attack. They lived in a prison, were all armed, with one still searching for the Governor, but that did not prevent the prison from falling. Grady Memorial was run like a prison ward, but that too, accomplished nothing.
As I noted earlier, all are not living like its a constant state of war; Glenn tried to bring Nicholas back, but it was Nicholas who could not see hope. Now, we see him trying with Enid because life has to mean more than a constant state of anger, horror and dealing death (sort of what Bob tried to tell Rick...to no avail). Then, there's Maggie. She's preganant--is she (and Glenn) wrong for conceiving a child (presumably) duing the chaos of Terminus, being on the road, and now the ASZ? Was it irresponsible?
What are they living for--or is it as Enid said--
..or worse yet, the Governor's--
There's no hope--or reason to in both views.
And then he led his dead flock from the place where he locked them up to the church where he gave them sanctuary. And then he tried to get them turned out of ASZ by bitching to Deanna. And then he went a walkabout and left the fucking gate open. Don't tell me he deserves a pass because he did a couple of things right. So did Doctor Smith, but I would have been kicked his ass outta the Jupiter II.
I think the real issue with Gabriel holding vigils isn't so much that Rick or anyone in that group would be opposed to such things, but that they should have reason by now to suspect that Gabriel might not be the best person for that job, shitheel that he's been.
I wouldn't necessarily toss Gabe out on his ass for his transgressions, (Others have been just as weak at times) but I would seriously object to him fathering a spiritual movement amongst my friends & family. His "Way" is highly questionable. Any flock I'm in, I do not trust to his guidance
Another thing... In all of our relief, we have forgotten that it appears Glenn wasn't the guy on the other end of Daryl's walkie, calling out for help. That intrigues me now
I wouldn't necessarily toss Gabe out on his ass for his transgressions, (Others have been just as weak at times) but I would seriously object to him fathering a spiritual movement amongst my friends & family. His "Way" is highly questionable. Any flock I'm in, I do not trust to his guidance
Another thing... In all of our relief, we have forgotten that it appears Glenn wasn't the guy on the other end of Daryl's walkie, calling out for help. That intrigues me now
And... all tension has been expelled from the show like the air out of one of Enid and Glenn's balloons. I have never been so angry at a TV show as I was in the opening few minutes of last night's show. From the two foot gap between the asphalt and the bottom of the dumpster to the alleyway full of walkers changing into maybe a group of fourteen, this episode has shown that the showrunners have nothing but utter contempt for their audience.
From this point forward, any time Rick, Carol, Daryl, Glenn or CORRRRAAAAALLLLLLL! have a gun trained on them, we will know that the writers don't have the testicular fortitude to carry through with the threat. Especially if it's a popular character. The dude warming up to Rick reinforcing the fence? He's fucked next week. The doctor woman? Gone. Say bye bye to Alexandrian redshirt #s 1, 2, 3, and 17 because the walkers are coming!
This show likes thinking itself as being edgy and nobody being safe because everybody's expendable, but as of last night, we know they're afraid of losing their spot as cable's #1 show if they kill off the wrong character(s).
I could be completely wrong. If they actually carry through with the aforementioned Negan spoiler that everybody knows about, I'll be completely shocked. But after the COMPLETELY OBVIOUS fake out a few weeks back, and the asshattery involved in stretching out the resolution over several episodes, I have a feeling it'll be one of the lesser liked characters that meet that demise. I seriously don't think AMC or the douchenozzle showrunners have it in them to kill Rick, Daryl, Carol or Glenn.
That having been said, the only reason I continue to watch from this point forward is to see how they handle Negan. If he's not interesting or they pussify him in any way, shape or form, I'm done with this "show."
From this point forward, any time Rick, Carol, Daryl, Glenn or CORRRRAAAAALLLLLLL! have a gun trained on them, we will know that the writers don't have the testicular fortitude to carry through with the threat. Especially if it's a popular character. The dude warming up to Rick reinforcing the fence? He's fucked next week. The doctor woman? Gone. Say bye bye to Alexandrian redshirt #s 1, 2, 3, and 17 because the walkers are coming!
This show likes thinking itself as being edgy and nobody being safe because everybody's expendable, but as of last night, we know they're afraid of losing their spot as cable's #1 show if they kill off the wrong character(s).
I could be completely wrong. If they actually carry through with the aforementioned Negan spoiler that everybody knows about, I'll be completely shocked. But after the COMPLETELY OBVIOUS fake out a few weeks back, and the asshattery involved in stretching out the resolution over several episodes, I have a feeling it'll be one of the lesser liked characters that meet that demise. I seriously don't think AMC or the douchenozzle showrunners have it in them to kill Rick, Daryl, Carol or Glenn.
That having been said, the only reason I continue to watch from this point forward is to see how they handle Negan. If he's not interesting or they pussify him in any way, shape or form, I'm done with this "show."
I'm glad Glenn is alive but honestly, I think they lose some credibility for the way they dangled it front of us with such glee and held off the reveal for so long. It's a slight insult to the audience and one thing's for sure, they cannot ever do that again. That's it. That's was your one and only piss take. Every time a regular is faced with death now, it will be tinged with the Glenn bullshit and result in a greater cynical reception. If they do try it again, then they're simply treating their audience with contempt.
Rick was right to tear down the flyers. They've got slightly more important things to worry about right now. If Gabriel was sincere about providing people with some spiritual counselling then he would speak to people individually and offer them some solace (whilst simultaneously helping to fix the fence). The fact that he wants the congregation to come to him and listen to him preach gibberish simply highlights that he isn't interested in their spiritual well-being; he is only interested in his own.
I have some sympathy for Morgan but he needs to pick and choose his fights. By all means, avoid killing if you can but sometimes it will be necessary. You will have to do it. Hell, even before the apocalypse, that was true.
Finally, the Alexandrians are being trained and waking up to the world they live in. About time.
Would I mind if Curl was killed. Probably not.
Rick was right to tear down the flyers. They've got slightly more important things to worry about right now. If Gabriel was sincere about providing people with some spiritual counselling then he would speak to people individually and offer them some solace (whilst simultaneously helping to fix the fence). The fact that he wants the congregation to come to him and listen to him preach gibberish simply highlights that he isn't interested in their spiritual well-being; he is only interested in his own.
I have some sympathy for Morgan but he needs to pick and choose his fights. By all means, avoid killing if you can but sometimes it will be necessary. You will have to do it. Hell, even before the apocalypse, that was true.
Finally, the Alexandrians are being trained and waking up to the world they live in. About time.
Would I mind if Curl was killed. Probably not.
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