Roberto Orci Not Directing Trek XIII

[Amaris]

Everything is awesome until it isn't. What stakeholder would say differently? Prometheus, for good example.

Orci is the last to survive the great purge of STID. So I assume he did the best job, for whatever it's worth.

What great purge? J.J. had an obligation to Star Wars. Alex Kurtzman and Orci split, but it had nothing to do with Star Trek.

Let me repeat this because this must be some strange upside down land, but STID made piles of money. It is the fourth highest grossing Star Trek movie of all time, beating the shit out of both TWOK and First Contact, two Trek films highly prized by fans both casual and hardcore. It was a critical success. STID was financially and critically successful. This is fact.

Given what you are saying, I wonder why Orci is being given the boot? Paramount lost J.J. to Star Wars, Kurtzman to Venom, etc. Why would Par push aside (possibly the most fannish member) of their Bad Robot Supreme Court?

Of the five members (J.J. Abrams, Bryan Burk, Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman, Damon Lindelof) who is on board for Trek 3 in any meaningful capacity? How many have moved on?

Who was the team for Star Trek III vs Star Trek IV? or Star Trek V? VI? Generations? First Contact? Insurrection? Nemesis? Why does a change in teams spell uncertainty or disaster? Why is a change in teams suddenly a purge?

 

[CorporalClegg]

That brings up an interesting question: when Star Trek traded in one of the best directors of all time for a nobody, did fans run around screaming about the end of the world?

 

[BillJ]

Who was the team for Star Trek III vs Star Trek IV? or Star Trek V? VI? Generations? First Contact? Insurrection? Nemesis? Why does a change in teams spell uncertainty or disaster? Why is a change in teams suddenly a purge?

Because this is about the Abrams films that some desperately hate and they need something to grasp onto. Nothing else really makes sense.

I guess I'm sticking knives again...

 

[HaplessCrewman]

What great purge? J.J. had an obligation to Star Wars. Alex Kurtzman and Orci split, but it had nothing to do with Star Trek.

Let me repeat this because this must be some strange upside down land, but STID made piles of money. It is the fourth highest grossing Star Trek movie of all time, beating the shit out of both TWOK and First Contact, two Trek films highly prized by fans both casual and hardcore. It was a critical success. STID was financially and critically successful. This is fact.

Given what you are saying, I wonder why Orci is being given the boot? Paramount lost J.J. to Star Wars, Kurtzman to Venom, etc. Why would Par push aside (possibly the most fannish member) of their Bad Robot Supreme Court?

Of the five members (J.J. Abrams, Bryan Burk, Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman, Damon Lindelof) who is on board for Trek 3 in any meaningful capacity? How many have moved on?

Who was the team for Star Trek III vs Star Trek IV? or Star Trek V? VI? Generations? First Contact? Insurrection? Nemesis? Why does a change in teams spell uncertainty or disaster? Why is a change in teams suddenly a purge?

I did not call it a purge.

 

[Mudd]

Ah. The victim card.

Exactly so.

As to whether there was negativity about Meyer replacing Wise...yeah, but a good deal more about Harve Bennett replacing Roddenberry. The idea of the guy behind Six Million Dollar Man replacing The Great Bird was beyond the pale.

 

[Sindatur]

... Why is a change in teams suddenly a purge?

Another excuse to throw stones?

Another crime to add to the rap sheet to make it look longer?

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Given what you are saying, I wonder why Orci is being given the boot? Paramount lost J.J. to Star Wars, Kurtzman to Venom, etc. Why would Par push aside (possibly the most fannish member) of their Bad Robot Supreme Court?

Of the five members (J.J. Abrams, Bryan Burk, Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman, Damon Lindelof) who is on board for Trek 3 in any meaningful capacity? How many have moved on?

Who was the team for Star Trek III vs Star Trek IV? or Star Trek V? VI? Generations? First Contact? Insurrection? Nemesis? Why does a change in teams spell uncertainty or disaster? Why is a change in teams suddenly a purge?

I did not call it a purge.

But JWPlatt did, the poster to whom Santa Claus had been responding.

What great purge? J.J. had an obligation to Star Wars. Alex Kurtzman and Orci split, but it had nothing to do with Star Trek.

Let me repeat this because this must be some strange upside down land, but STID made piles of money. It is the fourth highest grossing Star Trek movie of all time, beating the shit out of both TWOK and First Contact, two Trek films highly prized by fans both casual and hardcore. It was a critical success. STID was financially and critically successful. This is fact.

Given what you are saying, I wonder why Orci is being given the boot? Paramount lost J.J. to Star Wars, Kurtzman to Venom, etc. Why would Par push aside (possibly the most fannish member) of their Bad Robot Supreme Court?

Of the five members (J.J. Abrams, Bryan Burk, Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman, Damon Lindelof) who is on board for Trek 3 in any meaningful capacity? How many have moved on?

Everything is awesome until it isn't. What stakeholder would say differently? Prometheus, for good example.

Orci is the last to survive the great purge of STID. So I assume he did the best job, for whatever it's worth.

What great purge? J.J. had an obligation to Star Wars. Alex Kurtzman and Orci split, but it had nothing to do with Star Trek.

Let me repeat this because this must be some strange upside down land, but STID made piles of money. It is the fourth highest grossing Star Trek movie of all time, beating the shit out of both TWOK and First Contact, two Trek films highly prized by fans both casual and hardcore. It was a critical success. STID was financially and critically successful. This is fact.

I'd have expected the Great Purge to have been capitalized, though.

 

[M'Sharak]

Some people need something/one to hate.

I never experienced so many nasty below-the-belt potshots until I experienced Trek fans who like JJ Trek sticking knives into Trek fans who don't. And yet JJ Trek fans love to play police about how other Trek fans should and shouldn't behave. It seems like this begins and ends with thou shalt not criticize JJ Trek.

mos, you and I both know that you're hardly in any position to be criticizing anyone about "nasty below-the-belt potshots" and "sticking knives into Trek fans" with whom you disagree. Don't even go there, man. Moreover, you know perfectly well that in-thread call-outs like your post quoted above are a no-no. Go run your own forum if you want to be able to do that, but keep that shit out of here.

Now, I'll admit I am seeing more comments critical of fans and fan groups than I like to see (as opposed to comments critical of opinions or positions expressed by those fans or fan groups, which are fair game) but mos, if you think any of this has been particularly nasty, you may want to pause and compare to the bile and venom and rage routinely dispensed by the anti-Abrams brigade in the 18 months prior to release of the 2009 movie. What's going on here is a family picnic, by comparison. There are times now when, yes, things could be more friendly, but all in all it's much nicer now every day than it too often was in those old days. Let's not backslide, 'K?


Aaaaand topic. Go.

 

[JWPlatt]

I'd have expected the Great Purge to have been capitalized, though.

I did capitalize it at first, but I changed it before posting because JJ and Orci are still attached. There is no proof that Orci is not supported by Paramount, and I would think JJ is even more favored. So no capitalized great purge. It's just that some of the team have left and the rest are there in a different or diminished capacity.

 

[Amaris]

I'd have expected the Great Purge to have been capitalized, though.

I did capitalize it at first, but I changed it before posting because JJ and Orci are still attached. There is no proof that Orci is not supported by Paramount, and I would think JJ is even more favored. So no capitalized great purge. It's just that some of the team have left and the rest are there in a different or diminished capacity.

Which is not unexpected, particularly given the situation as it stands. J.J. went to make his Star Wars movie. Now, he could make Star Wars and Star Trek at the same time, but then one or the other, or both, would have to suffer somewhat for the divided attention.

As for writing crews, that changes all of the time in movies. Quite frankly, Orci is a lucky man for being present as a writer for all three films.

None of this is out of the ordinary for movies, even successful ones like ST09 and STID.

 

[F. King Daniel]

It's worth pointing out that Bad Robot took over another franchise for it's third movie - Mission: Impossible. Now others are taking over from them (to one degree or another, depending what rumours you believe) for Star Trek.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Someday it will be revealed that Orci stepped down because Paramount wanted "a little less conversation and a little more action" and his script was all conversation full of philosophy, allegory and thinly disguised social commentary.

 

[Belz...]

A lot of people don't want to make movies, nor do they want to become chefs or politicians. They do something else, but know what they like in those other things. They bitch about what they don't enjoy, including bad movies, bad food, and bad policy decisions - or praise good movies, people, food, and policy.

They do more of the former than the latter. In any event, they should speak with their money, not their twitter account. Profit is measurable, while tweets and Youtube comments or whatnot do not give a good idea of the general satisfaction or dissatisfaction of the audience.

I have no problem with people disliking the movies. I dislike a fair amount of Trek myself. But I never wished for it to fail, told people they shouldn't enjoy it, hurled insults at the creators of the material or simply made things up to support my views. Nor do I treat the things I do like, like some type of religious texts that should never be altered or criticized.

Great post. +1.

Someday it will be revealed that Orci stepped down because Paramount wanted "a little less conversation and a little more action" and his script was all conversation full of philosophy, allegory and thinly disguised social commentary.

I wouldn't be surprised if his movies were seen as such by "true" fans in a few years, once we get more "modern" ones in 2028.

 

[Jedi_Master]

Who was the team for Star Trek III vs Star Trek IV? or Star Trek V? VI? Generations? First Contact? Insurrection? Nemesis? Why does a change in teams spell uncertainty or disaster? Why is a change in teams suddenly a purge?

"Purge" sounds ominous and dangerous and Nazish.

Remember the narrative being sold by a few (very vocal) fans is that Bad Robot is evil incarnate. Every fact or rumor must be twisted and molded to fit that narrative.

 

[urbandefault]

Great Purge? Hmmm.

I don't know much about how Hollywood works, but I do know that the people who work on movies take jobs that are available at any given moment. That might mean that they are not available for the next movie in a particular franchise. Also, people decide that they want to do other things and might take another job based on its appeal. The fact that some people decide to go different directions and work on something else doesn't sound much like a "great purge" to me.

Didn't Orci say something a while back about bigger chairs to sit in? That doesn't sound to me like he was kicked out of the one he was already in.

I think there's a lot more to the story than is revealed in internet fora and social media.

 

[BillJ]

Great Purge? Hmmm.

I don't know much about how Hollywood works, but I do know that the people who work on movies take jobs that are available at any given moment. That might mean that they are not available for the next movie in a particular franchise. Also, people decide that they want to do other things and might take another job based on its appeal. The fact that some people decide to go different directions and work on something else doesn't sound much like a "great purge" to me.

Didn't Orci say something a while back about bigger chairs to sit in? That doesn't sound to me like he was kicked out of the one he was already in.

I think there's a lot more to the story than is revealed in internet fora and social media.

Can you imagine the howling if Orci is brought in to run the next TV series? He already has a pretty close relationship with CBS.

 

[JWPlatt]

Someday it will be revealed that Orci stepped down because Paramount wanted "a little less conversation and a little more action" and his script was all conversation full of philosophy, allegory and thinly disguised social commentary.

I wouldn't be surprised if his movies were seen as such by "true" fans in a few years, once we get more "modern" ones in 2028.

There are already accusations against Orci for putting a "truther" agenda into the story of STID. So it didn't take long.

 

[BigJake]

Didn't Orci say something a while back about bigger chairs to sit in? That doesn't sound to me like he was kicked out of the one he was already in.

I'd find it pretty hard to see it as a great career move to bail on your first big directing gig just over a year out from releasing the movie. If he was talking about "bigger chairs to sit in" it sounds like a way of putting a positive spin on what obviously ("great purge" or no, and it's pretty sad that people are running with a random turn of phrase as candidate for the next great HaterConspiracy) is not a great situation.

 

[Jedi_Master]

Didn't Orci say something a while back about bigger chairs to sit in? That doesn't sound to me like he was kicked out of the one he was already in.

I'd find it pretty hard to see it as a great career move to bail on your first big directing gig just over a year out from releasing the movie. If he was talking about "bigger chairs to sit in" it sounds like a way of putting a positive spin on what obviously ("great purge" or no, and it's pretty sad that people are running with a random turn of phrase as candidate for the next great HaterConspiracy) is not a great situation.

I am guessing by haterconspiracy you are referring to nuTrek "haters".

Anyways, Orci has not had the best year, and I for one am happy that he has a much more limited role in nuTrek III.

 

[urbandefault]

Regardless, Orci is producing. Orci is involved in the writing. Haters be dipped, it's happening.

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out, and fun to watch the haters' heads collectively explode.