Worst command decisions by Captain James T. Kirk

Discussion in 'Star Trek - The Original & Animated Series' started by Gary7, Jun 20, 2017.

  1. Henoch

    Henoch Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    Yes, having trusted people in your command staff is bad. Based on this line of reasoning, Kirk should have transferred his entire command staff off the ship long before STII: The Wrath of Khan.
    Huh? Since when did Kirk do the logical thing. While Spock was suggesting chess and Checkmate, Kirk was playing Poker and bluffing in The Corbomite Maneuver. Remember the odds of success dialog with Spock in Errand of Mercy? No, Kirk doesn't believe in a no-win scenario.

    Spock, following correct logical decisions in The Galileo Seven, repeatively failed.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2019
  2. Gary Mitchell

    Gary Mitchell Admiral Admiral

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    So I had a bad day. I didn't ask to have that happen to me.

    Since that rock fell on me I have to say that standing on my head is a lot easier now.
     
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  3. johnnybear

    johnnybear Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    But friends like to be together!!! :techman:
    JB
     
  4. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    In the unseen missions prior to WNMHGB Gary may have been the ship's greatest asset, saving millions and changing the destiny of countless worlds!
    He just stumbled at the end, is all :whistle:
     
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  5. Phaser Two

    Phaser Two Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    I really wish there was a way to make Kirk look less silly, and Khan smarter, in Space Seed. That keeps it out of my personal top 10.
     
  6. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Not really the first nor last time Kirk would end up looking silly with regards to visitors to his ship though...
     
  7. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    He really has a sense of false security when on board, doesn't he?
     
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  8. Steven P Bastien

    Steven P Bastien Captain Captain

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    The entity that sneaked on board was influencing him to act rashly.
     
  9. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    ...Indeed, the episode is remarkable in not showing our heroes behaving "as themselves" at all. The teaser already features them blindly believing in a nonexistent colony, apparently; they are being led on a leash, till the last liberating laugh.

    The crisis sorta deepens in mid-episode, with McCoy on full Nazi mode, Kirk ordering insane actions, Spock nodding and ushering them on, and the others just flaying around without thinking. There's a bit more coherence to their actions towards the end, but Kirk wandering to the middle of a posse of Klingons with a "Stab me!" post-it on his back is not yet part of that.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  10. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Commodore Commodore

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    I thought it was a feature of the episode that Kirk's actions at first seem not that bad but then seem to cross the line,
    All the while we get a cutaway to the blinking alien.

    I mean who can blame Kirk for wanting to punch a Klingon in the head.
     
  11. Phaser Two

    Phaser Two Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    The tactics of entering the room were fine. The guards were at the door. The Starfleet crew had phasers.

    Interestingly, I don't think Kirk acts irrationally at all in the episode. He and Sulu seem to be completely unaffected.
     
  12. Henoch

    Henoch Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    Kirk sends Riley down to the engineering decks to keep Riley in the dark about the entire Karidian affair and we assume to keep him safe, too. I think Kirk was more worried about what Riley would do to Karidian versus the reverse, even though everyone involved in the affair was being murdered. How does Lenore find Riley alone in the Engine Room in the first place if Kirk's intent is to keep him safe from assassination? Another bad command decision from Kirk.
     
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  13. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    More to the point, if the intent was to keep Riley safe, why was there no Security involvement?
     
  14. Steven P Bastien

    Steven P Bastien Captain Captain

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    So maybe, behind the scenes, Kirk was monitoring the father, but not the daughter because he never suspected her.

    Oh, and if Riley sees the security, then he will suspect something is up.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2019
  15. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Ah, right, I forgot about that part. Though still, putting someone in Engineering by themselves seems likely to engender suspicion all by itself.
     
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  16. Steven P Bastien

    Steven P Bastien Captain Captain

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    true, it did. Riley was wondering what he did wrong. But this could explain why kirk was still unsure. He is monitoring the father, and could not explain how he managed to cause trouble.
     
  17. Henoch

    Henoch Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    If Kirk was monitoring (using 23rd Century Tech!) Karidian, and Riley was almost killed and add in the phaser overload in his quarters, then why didn't Kirk suspect someone else was doing the killing? No, he double downs on Karidian. So, this is yet another mistake by Kirk not to correct his first mistake...(where have we heard that one, before? ;)).

    So, where are the security cameras? Hell, we have cameras on our door bells, now.
     
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  18. Steven P Bastien

    Steven P Bastien Captain Captain

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    Definitely Kirk is making mistakes here, and Spock is pointing that out to him. But, no one is suspecting the daughter. It's almost inconceivable.

    Cameras are not needed. Kirk could have the computer monitor the opening of the door. Or he could have someone watching the door. I'm just suggesting this because if we don't assume this, then Kirk is really both dumb and reckless. We have to give him some credit, and try to minimize his mistakes.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2019
  19. MAGolding

    MAGolding Captain Captain

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    Why do you think that a person that old being a murderer is almost inconceivable?

    How old was Charlie Evans in "Charlie X"? He was said to be seventeen several times. and he caused the Antares to explode, killing twenty persons.

    And what about yeoman Third Class Tina Lawton, said to be Charlie's age, and thus probably younger than Leonore Karidian? She was serving aboard a starship with the power to destroy all life on the surface of an entire planet. And Starfleet had a general order to do, General Order 24. Did she have a plan to lead a mutiny and stop Kirk if he ordered General Order 24 on a planet with intelligent inhabitants? Probably not. She might regret serving about the instrument of an inhabited planet's destruction, but probably not enough to try to stop the captain if he gave such an order.

    So Kirk & co. should have known from experience that people Leonore's age were capable of killing, either sanctioned by their society or against the rules of their society.
     
  20. Jayson1

    Jayson1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Kirk made no bad command decisions. If all those redshirts were better at their jobs they would still be alive.:)

    Jason