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[JonnyQuest037]

There’s nothing nefarious about a 50-year-old memory. My memory plays tricks on me about things less than a decade ago. It’s one of the reasons why the police interrogate people immediately. Over the course of hours your memory can change how things went down.

Yeah, and memories can change over time, especially if you've been telling a particular story over and over for decades. It's human nature to start unconsciously embellishing things to make for a better story. From what I understand, Nichelle Nichols' famous MLK story has evolved over the decades from her thinking to herself, "What would Dr. King say?" to her getting a phone call from MLK, to her meeting MLK at some event where he talks her out of leaving TOS. George Takei remembers some cut lines in an unrelated scene in TWOK as "Sulu's promotion scene" and thinks that William Shatner intentionally gave flat line readings to sabotage Sulu's big moment, when in reality, Shatner was likely just playing Kirk's depression at the beginning of the movie. But good luck convincing Takei of that at this point.

I commonly interview people about stuff they did 20 to 30 years ago in my freelance writing career, and people's memories can vary a lot. Some folks are as sharp as ever and can recall all sorts of details, and some people only vaguely remember the circumstances, or conflate two different things that happened years apart. That's when you have to do research to confirm the facts of the situation as best you can.

 

[FormerLurker]

From what I understand, Nichelle Nichols' famous MLK story has evolved over the decades from her thinking to herself, "What would Dr. King say?" to her getting a phone call from MLK, to her meeting MLK at some event where he talks her out of leaving TOS.

I still get skeevy when I hear about this. I heard Nichelle Nichols relate this story in 1986, and again in 2014, and there was very little different in the two versions, nearly thirty years apart. She has been relating this story as one of meeting MLK since she was (to be blunt) a PR hack for NASA in the '70s, and has therefore been telling it for 40-45 years. If she started out saying she wondered what he would say, she wandered through that dreamscape in record time.

What I find myself wondering is, why are so many people so dismissive of the idea that not only could she have met MLK at an event with celebrities present, but that he not only knew who she was, but also felt she served as a role model for people of color? Why is that implausible to impossibility?

 

[JonnyQuest037]

What I find myself wondering is, why are so many people so dismissive of the idea that not only could she have met MLK at an event with celebrities present, but that he not only knew who she was, but also felt she served as a role model for people of color? Why is that implausible to impossibility?

I'm only dismissive of the idea if there's absolutely no documentation of it ever happening. And if Nichols started out telling the story a different way in print, that's pretty strong evidence that it happened closer to how she initially related it. And personally, I think that Dr. King generally had bigger fish to fry than whether or not Nichelle Nichols continued on Star Trek.

And if you first heard her tell the MLK story in 1986, that's about two decades from when it allegedly happened. Plenty of time for it to have morphed into its current form.

I'm not saying that it never happened, but I'm dubious at best. I look forward to @Harvey eventually tackling this one on Star Trek Fact Check.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

In this article on SyFy.com, Nichols says that she resigned from TOS on a Friday, met Martin Luther King at an NAACP fundraiser at UCLA on a Saturday, and took back her resignation the following Monday. She also says that it was towards the end of the first season when she was considering leaving the show, so this would be sometime in early 1967.

So that gives us a fair amount of information to work with. Surely there's some kind of documentation of the event, right? A contemporary newspaper article or a write-up in the UCLA school paper? And I'd imagine that there have to be at least some photographs from it, right? I certainly can't recall ever seeing a picture of MLK and Nichols together. Now, that doesn't mean that it never happened, but you'd think that somebody at the event might've caught them on film together, even if it was just in the background of a photograph or something.

And considering that King was assassinated on April 4, 1968, by Nichols' own account that leaves only about a year available where they could have possibly met. We could stretch the available time frame, give Nichols the benefit of doubt as to forgetting some of the specifics decades after the fact, and see if there are any events in the L.A. area where they could have met between 1966 and 1968. I'd imagine that King's life is fairly well-documented at this point, and we could find evidence of where he was day-to-day for most of the late sixties.

Does anyone know if this incident is mentioned in any biographies of Dr. King? I don't want to tear Nichols down or say that she's intentionally lying about it, but I honestly don't think I've ever heard this story from a source that wasn't Nichols. When did she first tell the story? Was it in her Ebony interview?

EDIT: Looking through the story again, another detail that strikes me is Nichols talking about leaving TOS for Broadway. This is another potential area of investigation. Did she have a definite offer to do something on Broadway circa 1967, or is she just talking about the direction she would've liked her career to go in at the time?

EDIT 2: Nope, she didn't tell the MLK story in the Ebony article, which is more of a photo feature than an in-depth interview and is cover dated January 1967. So if the meeting happened, I think it's a safe bet that it happened after that date. Because, c'mon, how could you not mention that when you're getting interviewed by Ebony?

 

[Donald G]

While we are on the subject of photos, anyone know where this image comes from:

Whose is this woman supposed to be? And what are they holding? They look like flashlights with color filters.

The image is featured on the Star Trek Comics Checklist and is listed as being from a British fanzine: https://www.startrekcomics.info/uktosstripsbooksmags.html

TREK was not a British fanzine. It was edited by Walter Irwin and G.B. Love and produced in Texas.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

OK, I just decided to see if Snopes has ever looked into the Nichelle Nichols/MLK story, and apparently they have not. But my friend Brian Cronin did look into it at his Entertainment Urban Legends Revealed site, and he concluded that a likely date for the meeting would have been Saturday, February 25, 1967 at the Beverly Hills Hilton. It was not at an NAACP event, however.

And I wrote Snopes summarizing what I've uncovered so far, asking if they'll look into it. I'm now very interested in finding out when and where Ms. Nichols first told the MLK story in print, and if it has grown in the telling over the decades. Hopefully they'll tackle the question one of these days. I'd love to find out what sort of documentation exists on this.

 

[Harvey]

OK, I just decided to see if Snopes has ever looked into the Nichelle Nichols/MLK story, and apparently they have not. But my friend Brian Cronin did look into it at his Entertainment Urban Legends Revealed site, and he concluded that a likely date for the meeting would have been Saturday, February 25, 1967 at the Beverly Hills Hilton. It was not at an NAACP event, however.

And I wrote Snopes summarizing what I've uncovered so far, asking if they'll look into it. I'm now very interested in finding out when and where Ms. Nichols first told the MLK story in print, and if it has grown in the telling over the decades. Hopefully they'll tackle the question one of these days. I'd love to find out what sort of documentation exists on this.

@Maurice if only someone was researching this...

 

[Maurice]

OK, I just decided to see if Snopes has ever looked into the Nichelle Nichols/MLK story, and apparently they have not. But my friend Brian Cronin did look into it at his Entertainment Urban Legends Revealed site, and he concluded that a likely date for the meeting would have been Saturday, February 25, 1967 at the Beverly Hills Hilton. It was not at an NAACP event, however.

And I wrote Snopes summarizing what I've uncovered so far, asking if they'll look into it. I'm now very interested in finding out when and where Ms. Nichols first told the MLK story in print, and if it has grown in the telling over the decades. Hopefully they'll tackle the question one of these days. I'd love to find out what sort of documentation exists on this.

@Maurice if only someone was researching this...

[Consults lengthy spreadsheet] This seems familiar...

@Harvey and I have dug deep into this, pulling up over 100 newspaper clippings, compiling every detail in every account of hers we've been able to find, etc. There are some inconsistencies we can easily ignore because memory, but others not so easy to. I don't want to go into much detail at this point because we're still chasing down some sources and you could easily draw a potentially incorrect conclusion from the information we have minus that.

The one thing I will say is that to date we've been unable to locate a single mention of King's influence on her in any interview with her prior to 1979. If anyone has a line on one we'd love to see it.

 

[MAGolding]

TREK was not a British fanzine. It was edited by Walter Irwin and G.B. Love and produced in Texas.

Yes.

I just checked and don't have an issue with that cover. But I found an image of the cover online:

https://hubpages.com/entertainment/Trek-The-Magazine-for-Star-Trek-Fans

According to that picture it is issue number 7, dated February 1977 42 years ago.

 

[JoseNoodles]

Ah, so they only republished British Star Trek comic strips. They weren't British themselves. Got it.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

The one thing I will say is that to date we've been unable to locate a single mention of King's influence on her in any interview with her prior to 1979. If anyone has a line on one we'd love to see it.

Thanks for the teaser, at least. Again, looking forward to seeing what you uncover on it!

 

[BK613]

Again you’re assuming she had the dates in her head. She could have just remembered they were around the same time. Ya know?

I'm not assuming anything. I am positing that she was remembering a meeting with her agency (the THEY in "They said") when she said she choose the movie over the series. Which I think is reasonable since leaving town to film the movie would have made her unavailable if the series came about any earlier than it did. IOW, I am saying that before ST dropped her, she dropped ST.

 

[Harvey]

Desilu had an option on Andrea Dromm for 12 months after her contract was signed, not the six that she remembers.

Presumably, Desilu was consulted when she did the movie, although I don't have any paperwork confirming that.

EDIT: A fuzzy addendum (fuzzy in my photo of it, I mean) to her Star Trek contract I didn't notice until now indicates that Star Trek's option on Dromm was in 2nd position to any contractual agreement she might have made for The Russians Are Coming, The Russians Are Coming. So, she was already closing in on the movie when her Desilu contract was signed. Interesting. Still doesn't change the fact that Desilu dropped her, though.

2nd Edit: A definitive answer might be found in the Mirisch Company records. These are held by UCLA, but inaccessible until Walter Mirisch dies (he is 98 and still kicking as of this writing).

 

[BK613]

@Harvey So do you have some dates to offer (when AD's contract was signed, etc) or a timeline when all these events took place? None of that information was in your otherwise excellent write-up of the situation.

As for Desilu dropping her, I never disputed it.

 

[Harvey]

@Harvey So do you have some dates to offer (when AD's contract was signed, etc) or a timeline when all these events took place? None of that information was in your otherwise excellent write-up of the situation.

That piece was written several years ago. I've gotten more information and a better understanding of the documents since then. I should really update some of my older material at some point, but who has the time?

Anyway, here's a rough timeline...

July 13, 1965 - contract sent to Andrea Dromm's agent for her client's signature (the contract and a rider covering The Russians Are Coming, the Russians Are Coming! have the same date).

July 19-22, 1965 - Andrea Dromm films her scenes for Star Trek's second pilot.

August 20, 1965 - Ed Perlstein (Desilu business affairs) follows up with a letter to Dromm's agent (Ina Bernstein at Ashley Famous Agency) looking for a signature and return, since the project had been completed at that point. Presumably her contract was signed without any further issues, since there is not other correspondence on file about the issue.

August 23, 1965 (in Box Office Magazine, p. W-3) - "Andrea Dromm, that pretty blonde 20-year old girl featured on the TV commercials sponsored by National Airlines, has been signed to make her screen debut in 'The Russians Are Coming, the Russians Are Coming," the contemporary comedy with launched producer-director Norman Jewison's multiple-picture contract with the Mirisch Corp. UA will release the film."

January 3, 1966 - Syd Cassyd's Hollywood Report in Box Office reports that Norman Jewison has completed The Russians Are Coming, the Russians are Coming! and is at work on his second picture for the Mirisch Company.

March 23, 1966 - contract sent to Grace Lee Whitney for her signature for her role on Star Trek

April 11, 1966 - Roddenberry writes to Dromm (spelled "Droom" -- whoops) via Ashley Famous to inform her that although the series has been picked up by NBC, her option will not be. Paul Fix and James Doohan receive almost the exact same letters from Roddenberry indicating their options will not be picked up on the same date.

May 23, 1966 - First day of rehearsals for "The Corbomite Maneuver"

May 25, 1966 - Variety reviews the completed film of The Russians Are Coming, the Russians Are Coming!

 

[BK613]

@Harvey Thanks that clarifies many things. I can see I was way off base in terms of the timing but still find it interesting that TRACTRAC film was in the primary even as AD did the pilot.

 

[f14peter]

Higgins would have made a great badmiral. I can just picture the Enterprise being chased by a couple of Dobermans in space suits every time Kirk breaks the Prime Directive.

And "Khan...did you see the sunrise this morning?" BLAM! would have been a lot more badass than " KHAAAAN! "

.

<<<<<<<
Look immediately to your left and up a little ...

 

[marlboro]

Very cool!

 

[MAGolding]

Ah, so they only republished British Star Trek comic strips. They weren't British themselves. Got it.

I don't remember seeing reprinted British Star Trek comic strips in any issue of Trek. Trek published a lot of original articles of different types, and the best, more or less, were reprinted in a series of Best of Trek books.

 

[JoseNoodles]

The website I linked to says they reprinted some British Trek comic strips in black and white.