Why the hate for Disco?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by David Hanley, Feb 21, 2021.

  1. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Oh, ENT got picked to pieces when it was on the air. Trust me. I was here in the forums when it was first on and many of the same critiques and arguments being made against DSC, PIC and LD right now were used against ENT back in 2001 and 2002.
     
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  2. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    This makes me chuckle, sensibly.
     
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  3. zenophite

    zenophite Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I was here and took part in some of that criticism myself. My recollection was that much of it was based on several key things:
    • knee jerk rejection of 'prequel-itis' coupled with the perception that they were violating canon by inventing a 'new' previously unknown Enterprise.
    • fatigue with the Berman (and Braga) era production standard
    • The design of the ship ('Akira-prise')
    Perceptions started to shift when Manny Coto became more central to the production in season 3 and especially 4. I'm not sure i cared as much about inventing a new Enterprise so much as I was hoping that they would leverage the era to show the founding of the Federation in interesting ways. I think they largely squandered that opportunity in season 1, 2 and even 3. Only in season 4 did they get going, sadly too late to save the show.

    All that said it was not necessarily a case of bad writing - just that it had become formulaic in many ways. Discovery on the whole just simply does not tell any interesting stories IMO
     
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  4. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It's hardly unique to Star Trek fandom. Doctor Who fandom is much the same way. Indeed, it was a running joke back in the 1980s that DW fans would hate the new episodes when they aired, but come back to them five years later and judge them to be pretty good and better than the unfair assessment they were given back in the day and that they are much better than the pure crap that's currently airing.
     
  5. Jadeb

    Jadeb Commodore Commodore

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    The mid-1980s episodes of Doctor Who are still pretty awful. Some complaints are legitimate.
     
  6. Vger23

    Vger23 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I've never once judged a show on it's political messaging or leaning. There are plenty of shows that aren't aligned with my own values and sensibilities in terms of their "messaging."

    I either like a show because it's entertaining, or I don't. And there are shows that are wildly entertaining that don't "send a message" that's aligned with where I lean. I don't really care...any more than I care if I have friends or coworkers who have a different way of thinking.

    Unlike so very many people these days, I don't need things to be aligned with my thinking to find value in them and not find them offensive.

    But....I think you're right to some extent here, unfortunately.
     
  7. eschaton

    eschaton Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I do think it's true that some shows and movies attempt to purposefully "trigger" right-wingers who get upset to see non white-male leads - particularly in cases where they fear the product will be critically panned and hope the reverse backlash will lead to greater popularity.

    I don't think Discovery is one of those shows however.
     
  8. TheAdmiralty

    TheAdmiralty Commander Red Shirt

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    Ds9 had a black captain and "strong female characters" and it's probably a close second to TOS in terms of popularity within the fandom. So I'm not buying the "diversity" argument for why it gets hate. I personally don't hate it, it's alright, not as good as the original three shows and better than the lows of Voyager and ENT. But not liking a TV show does not make someone a bigot.
     
  9. Agony_Boothb

    Agony_Boothb Commodore Commodore

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    [QUOTE="TheAdmiralty, post: 13766983, member: 62956] But not liking a TV show does not make someone a bigot.[/QUOTE]

    It does if the issue is due to prominent LGBTQIA characters or taking issue with character traits of an outspoken black woman that wouldn't be an issue if she were a white person. Unfortunately a lot of the online criticism is about Discovery's 'wokeness' and a lot of the criticism directed at Burnham falls into 'uppity negroe' territory.
     
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  10. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I think many live to be offended, on all sides of the political spectrum.

    However, for my money, a show doesn't have to line up with me politically to be entertaining.
     
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  11. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I'd love to agree with you. And I can see why you think this. But what I've seen from some tells me otherwise. Primarily, but not exclusively, from former members of the board who've been banned. Regulars here know who they are.

    The disconnect between how people used to think and how they've thought for the last half-dozen to dozen years is very real. At least in America, society has become both more tolerant and more bigoted at the same time, as polarization becomes more and more extreme. Anyone who thinks this isn't happening is in deep denial. They don't look at things they used to like in the '90s, for instance, in the same way they'd look at things from Today because they rationalize it as, "But that was different!"

    As soon as you hear someone say, "But that was different!", you know they have a disconnect. They can't square how they think now with how they used to think, so they have to set it off to the side or come up with a twisted, swiss-cheese, double-standard rationalization, complete with movable goalposts.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2021 at 12:40 AM
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  12. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Combine those into one and the resentment from those so inclined grows exponentially.
     
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  13. RAMA

    RAMA Admiral Admiral

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    Just a chuckle? I got a chortle.
     
  14. Danja

    Danja Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    The same people who are now singing the praises of Berman & Braga today wanted to impale both of them on pikes back in 2001! :eek:
     
  15. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    After the 2009 movie, I recall reading something the EAS guy wrote and it referred back to Enterprise as "true" Trek and I'm pretty sure I let out loud, "are you kidding me?":lol:
     
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  16. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    EAS is basically the very text book definition of angry old man yelling at the clouds.
     
  17. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    And for stupider reasons than we're seeing now.
     
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  18. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    As a Non-ENT Fan, I can vouch for that. I had to distance myself from ENT Bashers as much as possible for a reason.
     
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  19. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I didn't mind spreading some ridiculous ENT memes and stirring the pot myself but damn, ENT trolls were a dense and rare element.
     
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  20. Dukhat

    Dukhat Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I did like the whole ‘Interregnum’ thing though. ;)
     
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