Why did the TOS films never bring back Carol Marcus?

[FederationHistorian]

Reading MA recently, I learned how Carol Marcus was omitted from GEN at Paramount’s request. Which is why she did not appear in the Nexus scene and was replaced with Antonia.

It did create a larger question as to why Carol Marcus did not appear in the TOS films again? Compared with David, Saavik, Sarek and Cartwright?

She was not killed off in TSFS, neither in the loss of the USS Grissom or on the Genesis Planet, thereby leaving open an opportunity for her to return in the TOS films. But she never did.

Not in TVH in a cameo beside Saavik. Not in TFF, even though an appearance her probably would have worked with Sybok taking away everyone’s pain, and her as on of his followers. And not in TUC, which is set several years after TWOK and would have been a significant enough time away from Kirk.

Even when considering how her presence could comprise Kirk’s Lone Ranger status, I do not see how a brief cameo appearance would actually compromise that aspect of Kirk.

So, what was it about?

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

I would add that if the original actress didn't want to/couldn't appear, they could even have re-cast her, as they did with Saavik.

 

[Daddy Todd]

Maybe Shatner didn't like Bibi Besch? Maybe Paramount was exercising typical Hollywood misogyny and wanted a Hot Chick instead of a grown woman well past her last f*ckable day?

My guess is Option 2.

 

[CoveTom]

Maybe Shatner didn't like Bibi Besch? Maybe Paramount was exercising typical Hollywood misogyny and wanted a Hot Chick instead of a grown woman well past her last f*ckable day?

My guess is Option 2.

Bibi Besch was 40 in TWOK. It might surprise you to know that 40-year-old women still have sex.

 

[Daddy Todd]

Bibi Besch was 40 in TWOK. It might surprise you to know that 40-year-old women still have sex.

Tell Hollywood. They think 32 is the absolute cutoff.

 

[TheAdmiralty]

These movies just had tons of characters. TSFS would have been the most logical but I think you'd have needed her to replace either David or Saavik to keep it from getting too cluttered having a pair on the planet just works better than a big group. Could have had a cameo in Voyage Home, but again, there's a lot of characters and they had a lot to do in the prologue to that movie with showing how Spock was progressing, closing things off with Saavik and introducing the probe. No reason for her to be in TFF or TUC.

Agree I think putting her in Generations instead of someone we've never seen would have been a better move.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

And then re-casting would make sense, because instead of TWOK Carol and David, we might have younger Carol and little David - Kirk's dream to have been involved in their lives from the start realized in a fantasy world.

 

[tharpdevenport]

Maybe Shatner didn't like Bibi Besch? Maybe Paramount was exercising typical Hollywood misogyny and wanted a Hot Chick instead of a grown woman well past her last f*ckable day?

My guess is Option 2.

Reasonable guesses, if we had seen the woman in Generations, but we didn't.

Is there a deleted scene with her?

 

[CoveTom]

The problem with Bibi Besch is that the scene where she would likely have been, where Kirk talks about the day he told Antonia he was going back to Starfleet, was in Kirk's past. We accept that Kirk looks his current age in that scene, but it wouldn't make sense for Carol to look her current age. It should be the past version of Carol, which Besch would be too old to portray at that point.