Which actor is most bitter?

[Nightowl1701]

For the American members: If it helps you picture it, Jimmy Savile was basically the British equivalent of the late, great Dick Clark. ("Top of the Pops" = "American Bandstand.") Now imagine Dick secretly banging (consentually or - often - not) anyone with two legs in sight (legal age or - very often - NOT) for decades with ABC covering his tracks and paying off the cops and you've got the idea. This is a MASSIVE scandal in the UK right now, and several more celebrities from that era (among them "Rock 'n Roll" singer Gary Glitter) may end up facing jailtime due to their associations with Savile.

 

[arch101]

I got the impression T Baker was bitter for years after his run. But, he really seems to have mellowed alot in recent years. On the dvd commentaries he seems to enjoy talking about his day and I even detect a bit of regret at his absence from the fan scene and his losing contact with his co-stars for so many years after his run. He should have a sit-down with Ecclestone.

 

[Marc]

I got the impression T Baker was bitter for years after his run. But, he really seems to have mellowed alot in recent years. On the dvd commentaries he seems to enjoy talking about his day and I even detect a bit of regret at his absence from the fan scene and his losing contact with his co-stars for so many years after his run. He should have a sit-down with Ecclestone.

Bitter or burnt out? 7 years, 41 stories, 172 episodes is fair bit of work

 

[DWF]

I got the impression T Baker was bitter for years after his run. But, he really seems to have mellowed alot in recent years. On the dvd commentaries he seems to enjoy talking about his day and I even detect a bit of regret at his absence from the fan scene and his losing contact with his co-stars for so many years after his run. He should have a sit-down with Ecclestone.

I don't think Eccleston's bitter he's just moved on to other things. And Tom Baker was upset for a bit, but I don't think it was Doctor Who related, he had a hard time finding work after his run on Doctor Who ended but he's since admitted that without Doctor Who he'd be nothing.

 

[diankra]

As DWF said, there's a big difference between being bitter, and just being an actor who's hoping to keep working for another 20 or 30 years, but is worried that typecasting from a big success might get in the way of that. It's also a pretty common thing for stars to relax about talking about their earlier big success once they hit the age when 'normal people' would be retiring anyway (and they realise that being remembered for anything after that long is still a massive achievement): forget about Who, look at Honor Blackman, Leslie Phillips, and so many more.
It probably helps that this tends to be around the point when youngsters who grew up idolizing them become prominent enough in the business to start offering them work...

 

[Marc]

As DWF said, there's a big difference between being bitter, and just being an actor who's hoping to keep working for another 20 or 30 years, but is worried that typecasting from a big success might get in the way of that. It's also a pretty common thing for stars to relax about talking about their earlier big success once they hit the age when 'normal people' would be retiring anyway (and they realise that being remembered for anything after that long is still a massive achievement): forget about Who, look at Honor Blackman, Leslie Phillips, and so many more.
It probably helps that this tends to be around the point when youngsters who grew up idolizing them become prominent enough in the business to start offering them work...

How many people really remember Honor Blackman for her role in Doctor Who though? Took me a few minutes to remember she did Terror of The Vervoids.

Now if you mention Pussy Galore but she wouldn't have the role if weren't for Cathy Gale in the Avengers.

Or have I just illustrated your point?

 

[ROBE]

Pussy Galore the ultimate Bond Girl name.

 

[Starkers]

For the American members: If it helps you picture it, Jimmy Savile was basically the British equivalent of the late, great Dick Clark. ("Top of the Pops" = "American Bandstand.") Now imagine Dick secretly banging (consentually or - often - not) anyone with two legs in sight (legal age or - very often - NOT) for decades with ABC covering his tracks and paying off the cops and you've got the idea. This is a MASSIVE scandal in the UK right now, and several more celebrities from that era (among them "Rock 'n Roll" singer Gary Glitter) may end up facing jailtime due to their associations with Savile.

I think sugesting the BBC covered his tracks and paid off the police suggsts a level of conspiracy that probably didn't actually exist.

Many factors contributed to keeping Savile out of jail, for starters as has been said, some of his actions didn't seem that out of place with prevailaing culture at the time, and even though people seemed to have suspected things, nobody ever seemed to have the proof/will to act, it seems there were isolated complaints to the police but there was never enough evidence to back up what would have been the word of a youngster against a popular tv personality who raised obscene amounts for charity, and I've heard it said that if the police had had the networks in place back then that they had now, things would have been taken further, because isolated complaints to differeing forces would have suddenly tied together and a pattern would have emerged.

A lot of people (ot just in the BBC but in the NHS, the police, government etc) turned a blind eye to what was going on, but it doesn't seem likely there was a huge overarching conspiracy.

 

[Mr Awe]

A lot of people (ot just in the BBC but in the NHS, the police, government etc) turned a blind eye to what was going on, but it doesn't seem likely there was a huge overarching conspiracy.

On the other hand, I'd argue that's the largest type of conspiracy. Such a widespread conspiracy that protecting women and children is a non-starter.

I mean, we're talking about protecting 1000s of women and children, and it's no surprise that no one, anywhere lifted a finger to protect them?! Seriously? That's a huge conspiracy on a societal scale, not a small one.

Mr Awe

 

[OmahaStar]

How many people really remember Honor Blackman for her role in Doctor Who though? Took me a few minutes to remember she did Terror of The Vervoids.

How do you not remember her role opposite Colin Baker?

 

[Mr Awe]

^ Who?

 

[Sindatur]

How many people really remember Honor Blackman for her role in Doctor Who though? Took me a few minutes to remember she did Terror of The Vervoids.

How do you not remember her role opposite Colin Baker?

Heh, I clearly remembered the role of Professor Lasky when I Googled images of "Honor Blackman Doctor Who", but, I had no idea Doctor Who had Pussy Galore, until reading these posts (But, then I'm not a big follower of the James Bond Fanchise)

 

[Starkers]

A lot of people (ot just in the BBC but in the NHS, the police, government etc) turned a blind eye to what was going on, but it doesn't seem likely there was a huge overarching conspiracy.

On the other hand, I'd argue that's the largest type of conspiracy. Such a widespread conspiracy that protecting women and children is a non-starter.

I mean, we're talking about protecting 1000s of women and children, and it's no surprise that no one, anywhere lifted a finger to protect them?! Seriously? That's a huge conspiracy on a societal scale, not a small one.

Mr Awe

I didn't say it was right, or fair, only that it happened, and this is the sort of thing that's happened across the world over the centuries and sadly still goes on today in some areas of the world.

Remember there was no internet back then, if the story didn't make the press people just wouldn't hear about it, and the impression I get is that the press were scared to go after Savile even when rumours surfaced, because he was seen as such a saint of a man by the vast majority.

 

[Captaindemotion]

^And because of the UK's libel laws, which put the burden of proof on the person making the accusation, rather than on the claimant, as is the case with most types of civil action.

 

[diankra]

As DWF said, there's a big difference between being bitter, and just being an actor who's hoping to keep working for another 20 or 30 years, but is worried that typecasting from a big success might get in the way of that. It's also a pretty common thing for stars to relax about talking about their earlier big success once they hit the age when 'normal people' would be retiring anyway (and they realise that being remembered for anything after that long is still a massive achievement): forget about Who, look at Honor Blackman, Leslie Phillips, and so many more.
It probably helps that this tends to be around the point when youngsters who grew up idolizing them become prominent enough in the business to start offering them work...

How many people really remember Honor Blackman for her role in Doctor Who though? Took me a few minutes to remember she did Terror of The Vervoids.

Now if you mention Pussy Galore but she wouldn't have the role if weren't for Cathy Gale in the Avengers.

Or have I just illustrated your point?

Actually, I was referring to the way during the 70s and 80s Honor Blackman would chill up on chat shows if the host tried to talk about The Avengers and Bond. She started loosing up in the 90s, once into her late 60s. Vervoids is just one role she did during the time when she was trying to shake off the Avengers image.

 

[Anji]

From my understanding, the Pertwee-T.Baker feud had something to do with who did the better performance. Keep in mind, I'm in America and at the time the largest bodies of fans were either Baker or Pertwee and maybe they were competing for the fan base? (And then there was Peter Davidson...so sweeet!)

Tom may have had some words with co-stars at the time but none of them expressed any dissastisfaction with him at any of the conventions I attended. Tom may have had problems during his tenure as Doctor because I remember hearing some rumours about him doing some heavy drinking????

As far as Tom being unreasonable, I'd like to tell you he was very nice to me when I met him at a convention. This was back in the early 1980s when he decided that he was going to come out of hibernation and do a convention or two. It was at a small hotel that was so filled with Baker fans they had to spill out into the parking lot to see him.

I was dragged to see Tom because my friends were big Baker fans (I was, of course, the only die-hard Pertwee fan in the bunch) and I agreed to go along. He signed autographs for a good three hours...and was surrounded by women who treated him like he was The Beatles, if you know what I mean??? If I was him I would've gotten sick from all the swooning and giggling going on. But he was totally pro, being very polite and charming, signing every autograph with a hello and a smile.

Okay, so it's my turn to approach the table. I had no idea what to say, I mean, afterall, this guy was not my Doctor, I thought Pertwee did a far better job than he did and what was I going to say to be polite???? He said hello, I put down my poster for him to sign and after he asked for my name there was this awkward moment of silence...I had no idea what to say, but I had to say something. Finally, I just said, "I really enjoyed your performance." He looked up wth a kinda stunned look on his face, stood up, hugged me and gave me a kiss on the cheek. "Thank you, very much indeed," he said really sincerely.

Wow! I was not expecting that.

But I kept my cool and said, "You're welcome." He did do a good job. Not as good as Pertwee, but....

You should've heard the women in that room swoon, including my friend, and well, she never talked to me again because I got a kiss from Baker and she didn't.

Oh, well. He seemed like a really nice guy. It just seemed like he wanted some recognition for his work...and not how cute his curly hair is!

By the way, I really do like Tom, but he's no Jon Pertwee!

 

[Captaindemotion]

^ I believe that Tom has said several times (for what Tom's word is worth!) that it was due to how Jon treated him onset during the transitional/ regeneration scene. Given that Jon had moved on from the role by the time it aired in the US, I really don't see the fanbase being an issue between them.

 

[diankra]

Of course, that would probably simply be an almost unavoidable clash of personal feelings on the day: there's Tom, nervous about his big break (though he'd already been shooting location work for Robot by that point), and Jon, feeling out of sorts with second thoughts as to whether giving up one of the best roles of his career really is such a good move, and so not being the welcoming 'Head of the family' most guest stars report (though not all - he had some foul moods on occasion) just when Tom could do with some reassurance.
By all accounts, Tom was in an even worse mood during Logopolis, but Davison had realised he probably would be, and didn't take it personally. Whereas Sylvester had already mentally moved on and was just enjoying having an unexpected last lap, and Troughton made a point of being supportive to Hartnell, talking to him about his early career and so on while the technicians set up the regeneration shot.

 

[MOSUGOJI]

By all accounts, Tom was in an even worse mood during Logopolis, but Davison had realised he probably would be, and didn't take it personally.

Wasn't there a story going around that when Peter Davison first became the Doctor he approached Tom Baker at a cocktail party for advice? I heard that a drunk Tom Baker replied by telling Peter to "F" OFF! Recently I heard Peter diplomatically say that it was noisey at the party and he couldn't quite make out what Tom had said to him.