^
Very well said.
Very well said.
What is your biggest gripe about fan films.
- Thread starter Data Holmes
- Start date
As a writer and trained actor, what gets me is the often poor quality of acting and writing, granted I know how difficult it is to make these fan film's especially those with sets on loan and special effects etc... time is short and precious and you do what you can, but lesson here for fan film makers, from one film maker to another, before you tread that set, green-screen, call it what you will, practice, practice, practice, do it with the writer, work at the dialogue, time is plentiful before you book your screen test, or set, dialogue has to sound natural, build on the characters, and the relationships.
Go back to Gene Roddenberry's original bible for what the show is about... people, not the starship, or the gadgetry, or technobabble... the people. 'Wagon train to the stars' that's what Gene said, no body gave a hoot about the horse and cart only that it took your favourite characters to the next adventure or story.
With the charcters nailed, then you can bring in the ships, the tech etc... because at least then, we, the viewers, will actually care and be bothered with the characters, and the 'Oh god the thing is going to eat the ship' scenario or whatever your taste may be
will at least work better.
But seriously go back to Gene's original text in describing what Startrek is about and you'll go far
Same with any fan film, be realistic when casting, tell a story, work within your limitations, don't try and run before you can walk because it will look bad, limitations aren't there to prevent you from making a film, it just means you need another way of doing things, be creative, and you'll find you get a better result.
And I'd agree with that as well. I would point out though, that you shouldn't assume people aren't at least trying to fulfill those criteria, simply because they don't always succeed. Knowing what you need to do, and implementing it successfully, are completely different things.
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As much as I might agree with some advice, unless it comes by benefit of experience and with a great dealof resultant specificity then it's pretty useless - along the lines of the Monty Python routine "How to cure the world of all known diseases" or, more simply, the baseball coach's axiomatic advice to "throw strikes and don't give 'em anything good to hit."
BillJ, I think you lack some specifics on what you'd like to see. At least I'm having a hard time knowing what I can do to make our episodes better. I'm reading "lack of character growth" and "don't like the way the gay relationship was handled," and "it lacks in writing, acting, and directing," and "missed opportunities," and "you are disinterested in script content."
From a character growth standpoint, we're kind of limited. We need to have our characters be able to be in their TMP positions when our series is completed, so the character arcs are largely locked in. On the other hand, in "To Serve All My Days' in order to tell a compelling story about Chekov--the kind of story he never got--we had D.C. Fontana write a fine story--one where Chekov dies at the end. He undergoes amazing growth and self awareness in that episode. (And, of course, we got endless grief for killing off the character of Chekov: "How dare we change what we know must happen in the Trek universe!?") Your notion that D.C. Fontana was disintested in her script content seems a little insulting. And I'm confident that David Gerrold would be insulted at the notion that he's disinterested in his script's content. Did you really mean that? Or did you mean that I'm disinterested in our scripts' content--or did you mean James?
Of course, it's possible to tell dramatic stories even when the characters' ultimate outcome is already known. Otherwise it would be impossible to do a mini-series about John Adams or movies about General Patton or about Jesus for that matter. But we have our work cut out for us when our viewers are such "experts" (perceived if not actual) on the characters.
We do indeed need to see the causes of the changes in the Spock/McCoy/Kirk relationship that manifest themselves in TMP. But those changes haven't taken place in the few episodes we've made so far. The relationship-shattering event isn't scheduled to be shown for several more episodes. In the meantime, there are lots of stories to tell in our little series.
I think our Nebula and Hugo award nominations last year for "World Enough and Time" shouldn't be so easily dismissed. I've heard more than once "best episode ever out of ay Trek series ever." I don't know about that; those comments might be overly generous. But I do know that we were indeed nominated for a Nebula and a Hugo. The WSFS membership seems to have a different perception of our productions than you do.
So, what would you do differently to get a Nebula, a Hugo, or more popularity and respect with a budget of $0.00? Other than "do everything better," you seem short on specifics of what you would do differently.
The advice comes from an experienced background.
I'm an actor with 16 years experience, a writer with 8 years, director for 5 and producer for 4 years; that's a huge learning curve, and I don't mean to be arrogant with this reply, believe me in all those years, I got a lot of things wrong, but I've learn't from them. But I agree to the difference -
''Knowing what you need to do, and implementing it successfully, are completely different things. ''
It is a shame when we see what was intended, doesn't necessarily hit all the right notes... I've been there, but I sometimes get the impression some film makers are all too quick to get the product out there without thinking about the spit and polish, checking the material with an outside source, if they wince, then there is something that needs to be adjusted.
I'm an actor with 16 years experience, a writer with 8 years, director for 5 and producer for 4 years; that's a huge learning curve, and I don't mean to be arrogant with this reply, believe me in all those years, I got a lot of things wrong, but I've learn't from them. But I agree to the difference -
''Knowing what you need to do, and implementing it successfully, are completely different things. ''
It is a shame when we see what was intended, doesn't necessarily hit all the right notes... I've been there, but I sometimes get the impression some film makers are all too quick to get the product out there without thinking about the spit and polish, checking the material with an outside source, if they wince, then there is something that needs to be adjusted.
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Nod to Greg, didn't realise you guys got the nominations with the Hugo and Nebula awards, you're doing something right, considering the budget or lack of and the resources you call upon, thats, pretty outstanding, the only way is up, and bigger and better things.
Television and film is a funny business, I still have to beat my head off a wall that a show like Odyssey 5 gets cancelled, sure enough alot of shows have low's and highs, same thing can be said about film, not everyone is going to be appeased, to me as a film-maker if someone likes at least 70 percent of something I produce, then to me that's a success, if there was some aspect of it that got someone's attention. I think the initial gripe here on this thread should specified.
Some fan fic's, those that get the chance to produce a serial version of there idea (excluding the one off's for the moment), will often get someone or everyone's gripe if there is no level of improvement, I won't name productions, that wouldn't be fair, as everyone deserves a chance at hitting the bar, and some have done a pretty fair job of doing that, considering the limitations out there. But I think, when a production fails in acting consistently, or the costuming is below par, the effects look like they're off a Playstation, etc... or the dialogue painful, despite the actors making the best of it, then you have to wonder is it working, in which case the criticism is warranted, but, and I stress this sincerely, criticism should be constructive, and never an insult to the hard working people who put these things together, usually unpaid, and with what little free time they have.
There is no doubt that there are varying degrees as to the level of production that is put out there, some clearly for fun, others because it's a creative passion and that carries importance,of commiting an idea with professionality and ingenuity, something else to bare in mind with this thread, especially when picking up on well known productions.
So what of the one off productions, some times you have to wonder
the you-tube fodder, well they're doing their thing and thats all I will say about that
they're fun, they're a piss about, so cool, why not; but i'm guessing the one's where we are all shaking our head's, with WTF running though our minds, are the ones where they pan out like this --
The cast, they're clearly taking it very seriously, and yes I know we had Wesley in ST.TNG but why the f$$k is he captain of the Enterprise, the costumes looks like ill-fitted sweaters, the bridge looks like it belongs in a computer game circa 1995, and need I go on. Yes these people have heart but when these films are peddled on the net, you're browsing, you come across the site or another that link's it, you're thinking hmmm sounds interesting I'll have a look; you read the brochure it's not quite a ferrari let's be honest our expectation is never that high, so we anticipate, a ford taurus, but after the test drive, we realise we've spent the last 10 minutes driving a Datsun sunny... let me know if I'm warm with this one
Television and film is a funny business, I still have to beat my head off a wall that a show like Odyssey 5 gets cancelled, sure enough alot of shows have low's and highs, same thing can be said about film, not everyone is going to be appeased, to me as a film-maker if someone likes at least 70 percent of something I produce, then to me that's a success, if there was some aspect of it that got someone's attention. I think the initial gripe here on this thread should specified.
Some fan fic's, those that get the chance to produce a serial version of there idea (excluding the one off's for the moment), will often get someone or everyone's gripe if there is no level of improvement, I won't name productions, that wouldn't be fair, as everyone deserves a chance at hitting the bar, and some have done a pretty fair job of doing that, considering the limitations out there. But I think, when a production fails in acting consistently, or the costuming is below par, the effects look like they're off a Playstation, etc... or the dialogue painful, despite the actors making the best of it, then you have to wonder is it working, in which case the criticism is warranted, but, and I stress this sincerely, criticism should be constructive, and never an insult to the hard working people who put these things together, usually unpaid, and with what little free time they have.
There is no doubt that there are varying degrees as to the level of production that is put out there, some clearly for fun, others because it's a creative passion and that carries importance,of commiting an idea with professionality and ingenuity, something else to bare in mind with this thread, especially when picking up on well known productions.
So what of the one off productions, some times you have to wonder
the you-tube fodder, well they're doing their thing and thats all I will say about that
they're fun, they're a piss about, so cool, why not; but i'm guessing the one's where we are all shaking our head's, with WTF running though our minds, are the ones where they pan out like this -- The cast, they're clearly taking it very seriously, and yes I know we had Wesley in ST.TNG but why the f$$k is he captain of the Enterprise, the costumes looks like ill-fitted sweaters, the bridge looks like it belongs in a computer game circa 1995, and need I go on. Yes these people have heart but when these films are peddled on the net, you're browsing, you come across the site or another that link's it, you're thinking hmmm sounds interesting I'll have a look; you read the brochure it's not quite a ferrari let's be honest our expectation is never that high, so we anticipate, a ford taurus, but after the test drive, we realise we've spent the last 10 minutes driving a Datsun sunny... let me know if I'm warm with this one
So, with your acting, writing, directing, and producing experience, your advice is that we hew more closely to Gene Roddenberry's Star Trek Writer's Guide?
Thank you for the suggestion.
Is there any work of yours to which you can point us that we can evaluate and from which we can draw additional guidance? (Your work probably would speak even more loudly than your words on this forum.)
Ah sorry about that was replying to another poster, not you Greg.
Really enjoying the work you guys put together by the way.
Really enjoying the work you guys put together by the way.
Just thought I'd add, I'm no expert at film-making, years of experience maybe, but by no means flawless, I've made mistakes like everybody else, no one can profess to having all the answers, it's a continual learning experience. And no I don't make science fiction, or fan films, just shorts and low budget independent films, rom-coms, comedies, black comedies that sorta thing all I wanted to point out was heck yeah I've made mistakes but I learn't from them if someone said hell that was crap then okay, I made something bad, next time I'll do better.
Making films in the United Kingdom where there is bugger all funding and barely any resources with out someone trying to make a quick buck out of you, just makes you spend the time wisely, cos it can take years to make something happen over here, same as anywhere else, I lost two years in Development and Pre-Production hell on a rom com called 'Tomorrow Doesn't Matter' that didn't get to the filming stage, did I learn from that, hell yeah
Aw nuts, I really don't want to become the ass-hole of this thread
Full credit to the cast and crews that get to put together some of the highest standard of fan films out there, my hats off to you because you pull it together and you're raising the bar, my mere nod of opinion or suggestion goes not to you but to the film-makers that are missing the point of what star trek is about.
That's all I meant by my opinion, so please no offense if anyones taken it the wrong way.
Making films in the United Kingdom where there is bugger all funding and barely any resources with out someone trying to make a quick buck out of you, just makes you spend the time wisely, cos it can take years to make something happen over here, same as anywhere else, I lost two years in Development and Pre-Production hell on a rom com called 'Tomorrow Doesn't Matter' that didn't get to the filming stage, did I learn from that, hell yeah
Aw nuts, I really don't want to become the ass-hole of this thread
Full credit to the cast and crews that get to put together some of the highest standard of fan films out there, my hats off to you because you pull it together and you're raising the bar, my mere nod of opinion or suggestion goes not to you but to the film-makers that are missing the point of what star trek is about.
That's all I meant by my opinion, so please no offense if anyones taken it the wrong way.
As a writer and trained actor, what gets me is the often poor quality of acting and writing, granted I know how difficult it is to make these fan film's especially those with sets on loan and special effects etc... time is short and precious and you do what you can, but lesson here for fan film makers, from one film maker to another, before you tread that set, green-screen, call it what you will, practice, practice, practice, do it with the writer, work at the dialogue, time is plentiful before you book your screen test, or set, dialogue has to sound natural, build on the characters, and the relationships.
Go back to Gene Roddenberry's original bible for what the show is about... people, not the starship, or the gadgetry, or technobabble... the people. 'Wagon train to the stars' that's what Gene said, no body gave a hoot about the horse and cart only that it took your favourite characters to the next adventure or story.
With the charcters nailed, then you can bring in the ships, the tech etc... because at least then, we, the viewers, will actually care and be bothered with the characters, and the 'Oh god the thing is going to eat the ship' scenario or whatever your taste may be
will at least work better.
But seriously go back to Gene's original text in describing what Startrek is about and you'll go far
Same with any fan film, be realistic when casting, tell a story, work within your limitations, don't try and run before you can walk because it will look bad, limitations aren't there to prevent you from making a film, it just means you need another way of doing things, be creative, and you'll find you get a better result.
And I'd agree with that as well. I would point out though, that you shouldn't assume people aren't at least trying to fulfill those criteria, simply because they don't always succeed. Knowing what you need to do, and implementing it successfully, are completely different things.
Well, if the product they keep putting out is always the same, and never improves, they can't be trying very hard, can they?
Well that was kind of my point. Many of us are trying to hit those notes. Sure, we don't always succeed, but we're not blind to the pitfalls, nor are we necessarily ignorant of what needs to be done to tell a good story.
For what it's worth, I'll forgive an awful lot of shortcomings in favour of a good story.
Those who can, do. Those who can't do, teach. Those who can't teach, complain. But fans, they bitch. 
I could sit down and critique all the fan films and give specific points where they fall down; that goes for everything Hidden Frontier to NV/Phase II and even through Starship Exeter -- the latter of which I worked on. They all have flaws, even the best of them (don't even get me started on Exeter's act three Captain's soliloquy), but I'll put the biggest blame on the scripts. The script is the blueprint: it's the layout on the studio floor on which everything is built. When the plan is bad, the resulting structure is twisted and not true.
This is not a critique of fan-film writers per se -- as I've said previously, writing a good, cohesive script is extremely difficult to do -- but there's not a single fan film I've seen that didn't suffer from some dramatic or structural flaw: yes, even D.C. Fontana's.
I suspect part of this on fan films, just like on many professional TV series, is because the writer isn't left to write the best script possible. The writer is asked to include this or that bit of business or that action scene that the producer or director or whoever wants in there. This leads to a series of compromises that often klutzes up even a good story.
Let me toss in a personal example from a few years ago. I was writing a script that I thought was a really cool Star Trek story...political, with real teeth, making social commentary in a hopefully entertaining way. I described the plot to someone else who worked on a high profile fan film, and s/he immediately suggested an action sequence that, while possibly cool, had no place in the story...would violate the point of the story, in fact. Even when I explained why, this person wouldn't be dissuaded. I know for a fact this happens on a lot of fan films, so even when the writer has a great concept, it's often mangled by the "notes" from others on the production.
I'm not trying to say "woe is me" about poor little brilliant authors who suffer at the hands of apish producers, as many fan film scripts are just plain bad, but what happens far too often is that people make decisions in fields that are not their area of expertise. A client who tells the architect to remove that load bearing wall because it would look better is just asking for trouble. People who don't write or are beginners at it don't see how much of a story is supporting structure, and fail to see that moving certain bits around or cutting them out compromises the result.
A good Hollywood example is ending up with a Giant Mechanical Spider. Jon Peters insisted there be a giant spider in Superman Lives, and when that film didn't happen, it ended up in Wild Wild West. Why's it there? Someone in authority thought it'd be cool, so there it is. Does it help the story? Does it make the film better? Fuck no.
I could sit down and critique all the fan films and give specific points where they fall down; that goes for everything Hidden Frontier to NV/Phase II and even through Starship Exeter -- the latter of which I worked on. They all have flaws, even the best of them (don't even get me started on Exeter's act three Captain's soliloquy), but I'll put the biggest blame on the scripts. The script is the blueprint: it's the layout on the studio floor on which everything is built. When the plan is bad, the resulting structure is twisted and not true.
This is not a critique of fan-film writers per se -- as I've said previously, writing a good, cohesive script is extremely difficult to do -- but there's not a single fan film I've seen that didn't suffer from some dramatic or structural flaw: yes, even D.C. Fontana's.
I suspect part of this on fan films, just like on many professional TV series, is because the writer isn't left to write the best script possible. The writer is asked to include this or that bit of business or that action scene that the producer or director or whoever wants in there. This leads to a series of compromises that often klutzes up even a good story.
Let me toss in a personal example from a few years ago. I was writing a script that I thought was a really cool Star Trek story...political, with real teeth, making social commentary in a hopefully entertaining way. I described the plot to someone else who worked on a high profile fan film, and s/he immediately suggested an action sequence that, while possibly cool, had no place in the story...would violate the point of the story, in fact. Even when I explained why, this person wouldn't be dissuaded. I know for a fact this happens on a lot of fan films, so even when the writer has a great concept, it's often mangled by the "notes" from others on the production.
I'm not trying to say "woe is me" about poor little brilliant authors who suffer at the hands of apish producers, as many fan film scripts are just plain bad, but what happens far too often is that people make decisions in fields that are not their area of expertise. A client who tells the architect to remove that load bearing wall because it would look better is just asking for trouble. People who don't write or are beginners at it don't see how much of a story is supporting structure, and fail to see that moving certain bits around or cutting them out compromises the result.
A good Hollywood example is ending up with a Giant Mechanical Spider. Jon Peters insisted there be a giant spider in Superman Lives, and when that film didn't happen, it ended up in Wild Wild West. Why's it there? Someone in authority thought it'd be cool, so there it is. Does it help the story? Does it make the film better? Fuck no.
I agree with you completely, it's why I said it was a shame in my earlier post.
It is frustrating that often a good story does get overlooked due to some shortcomings else where in the production, but to come full circle with this thread, maybe the gripe we should have then, is with the productions that don't appear to have anything good riding on them at all, then again, are we being harsh with this thread. If someone who enjoys there favourite show, film, graphic novel character etc... is passionate enough to put themselves out there and produce fan fiction in the medium of film or web-based television based on the above, then who are we to criticise, at the end of the day they had the balls to do it, the conviction and the creative urge. One of the reasons I enjoy 'making of' extras on independent work, you get an idea of how difficult it is from concept to finished production, I guess the more of us that did that, we might be less quick to criticise and more eager to provide a balanced opinion, on that note, I admit, I stand corrected on a few points.
It is frustrating that often a good story does get overlooked due to some shortcomings else where in the production, but to come full circle with this thread, maybe the gripe we should have then, is with the productions that don't appear to have anything good riding on them at all, then again, are we being harsh with this thread. If someone who enjoys there favourite show, film, graphic novel character etc... is passionate enough to put themselves out there and produce fan fiction in the medium of film or web-based television based on the above, then who are we to criticise, at the end of the day they had the balls to do it, the conviction and the creative urge. One of the reasons I enjoy 'making of' extras on independent work, you get an idea of how difficult it is from concept to finished production, I guess the more of us that did that, we might be less quick to criticise and more eager to provide a balanced opinion, on that note, I admit, I stand corrected on a few points.
Thing is... if you have a piece you wrote, and something like an action sequence will ruin it, or will have no place in the story, just put your foot down, and refuse. It's YOUR work, not theirs. If they want your talents, they go by what you wrote. End of story. This is not Paramount, and no big money is at stake... you have nothing to lose by making a stand. They, on the other hand, have a lot to lose... a fresh story, with a lot of potential.
That's another thing I think a lot of fanfilms suffer from... they try to intentionally make everything visually exciting to the point of it being overkill, in the fear that if we don't see thousands of ships exploding every second, we'll lose interest. We WON'T. Fanfilms should try to do the caliber of storytelling that we seldom got on the TV or big screen. Don't ever sacrifice quality for razzle-dazzle.
That's another thing I think a lot of fanfilms suffer from... they try to intentionally make everything visually exciting to the point of it being overkill, in the fear that if we don't see thousands of ships exploding every second, we'll lose interest. We WON'T. Fanfilms should try to do the caliber of storytelling that we seldom got on the TV or big screen. Don't ever sacrifice quality for razzle-dazzle.
^^^This presumes they don't just do it their way anyway once it comes down to shooting day. And the point is while film is collaboration, writers are often treated as the bottom of the totem pole: indispensable until they turn in the script, after which everyone else decides they can "improve" it. This is not to say that the writer is always right, but their objections are often ignored. So, either you do take your toys and go home, or you compromise. It's just unfortunate that it's expected the writer will compromise first.
Just because some fanfilms are guilty of that doesn't mean they all are.
Compare Hidden Frontier's early efforts with their current work. Or Come What May with Blood and Fire. You can't possibly tell me that The Tressaurian Intersection isn't light years ahead of The Savage Empire. And while I'm painfully aware of Intrepid's shortcomings, I think we've improved hugely since our first effort, and we continue to learn and improve.
DS9Sega, all good points regarding writing. For what it's worth, I never write on a tick box basis. I write for one single reason; to tell a good story. Whether I'm successful is another matter, but I certainly do not set out to simply hit certain marks, or have the biggest explosions, or whatever happens to be flavour of the month at a particular moment.
And just because you mentioned it, I never marginalise writers' opinions, and I always strive to preserve whatever intent a writer may have, because that's something that matters to me.
Exactly. What MY point is... DON'T be the first to back down... make THEM do it for once. You have all the cards. You wrote the script, which is the basis and backbone of the entire story. If you feel honestly that messing with it will harm its integrity, and you don't want to bring the production down, then stand firm. Nothing will be lost... either they will back down, (hopefully) seeing how much you believe in the story, and how much you believe in the production, or they will get someone else to write a more subpar script, and it will visibly show, in the final product. Either way, you win. If your story is not used, hey, at least you have a quality piece of Trek fiction, to post or share elsewhere.
Now, there's a good example of advice absent experience. Not that I've seen it happen myself, but it's vanishingly unlikely that a fan movie would shut down in the middle of production because the writer tried to deny them permission to continue. You can stomp around about the morality of that all you want, but there it is.
In reality, in every situation I've seen everyone involved - including the writer - has enough energy and hopes invested in the movie that they work conflicts out like grownups and come to a compromise they can all live with.
This was not my experience on Starship Exeter, but the situation there is kind of unique and certainly different from a Hollywood production.
The script had shortcomings which I didn't grasp at the time we started shooting. These were exacerbated in a couple of instances by our not winding up at the end of production with all of the coverage that we would have needed to assemble the story exactly according to the script. Things like that do happen in professional productions, especially in television where production is pretty time-limited (Robert Justman wrote that Roddenberry would drive Star Trek editor Bob Swanson crazy by hovering around insisting that he "invent footage that hadn't been shot." Swanson maintained that "a show must be edited based upon what the director shot, not what the writer wrote").
In any event, I was on set for about a third of the time the episode was shooting - helping build sets, running the smoke machine, hot-gluing the turbolift handles back into place when one got yanked off.
So when it became clear that a certain set couldn't be built in the time we needed and dialogue had to be moved to the bridge, I did the rewrite on the spot. When parts of the story had to be restructured during the editing, I was able to participate and in most cases do the final wording of the new dialogue (I could not always contribute meaningfully to the story restructuring itself - I'm a writer, not a director/editor, damn it).
Beyond that, being a contributor to the CG effects and helping to design one of the key props meant that I got to define the visual aspects of the story to a degree that's pretty rare for a writer - as DS9Sega notes, when you're getting paid the producers like you to go cash the check and not come back. When you're a volunteer and you're a producer and you're hovering around backstage flipping a switch on cue so that a red light will blink on an actor's "security board" and you're hanging around rendering spaceship footage for years afterward you've got an opportunity for a lot more input in all stages of production.
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Okay, here's an mp3 someone can use in a fan production, if you like, composed by me and copyrighted. If someone wants to us it, let me know.
http://lcars24.com/7of9.mp3
http://lcars24.com/7of9.mp3
Was this the sickbay swing set?
I've spoken to other writer of fan-films and it's not always done as nicely as Dennis's experience on Exeter. I know for a fact some writers have turned in their script only to have them massively rewritten. It's especially tricky with fan scripts because, let's face it, how many of the writers have a contract? What constitutes work-for-hire when it's a verbal agreement to do work? And if the writer balks and the producers decide to go ahead, what recourse is there for the writer? A lawsuit to stop something that can't make money anyway?
Dennis's story about rewriting on the set is something I've had to do...sometimes ridiculously fast. When I as in Portland, OR doing a 48 Hour Film Project with "Tressaurian" director Scott Cummins, we lost a location, and I had to change the story to end in the current location...which involved reworking many pages of dialog and action in about half an hour (being a 48 hour contest, there was effectively only one shooting day). I grumbled, I bitched, but I did it cause all these other people were committed. The change resulted in the film not being as good as it would have been otherwise, but ya do what ya gotta do.
Anyway, I'm sorry if I derailed this thread off of what is the biggest gripe about fan films, but people who aren't involved and have no practical experience in filmmaking dont really grasp what the pressure cooker is like.
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