What Has Discovery Added To Star Trek Lore?

[CorporalCaptain]

Yep, Kirk managed to stumble across three different types. One invented by an human

Plus the android bodies being developed in "Return to Tomorrow."

edit - It wasn't exactly clear what the Losira replicas were in "That Which Survives," but maybe they were androids too. On the one hand they discussed the planetary defenses projecting a replica. But on the other hand, they also talked about magnetic doorways and life readings that McCoy could scan, and physical contact was the mode of attack.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

I think responding to Marsh at this point is an utter waste of time. He literally altered Memory Alpha pages to “validate” his arguments because they were too inconvenient for him. He’s not interested in discussing how DISCOVERY can fit in with the universe as seen in previous shows, he’s only interested in how it deviates from them, and uses that to argue how it’s not “Real Star Trek”.

That’s all I have to say about that.

 

[Lord Garth]

I think responding to Marsh at this point is an utter waste of time. He literally altered Memory Alpha pages to “validate” his arguments because they were too inconvenient for him. He’s not interested in discussing how DISCOVERY can fit in with the universe as seen in previous shows, he’s only interested in how it deviates from them, and uses that to argue how it’s not “Real Star Trek”.

That’s all I have to say about that.

It's unfortunate. I can deal with arguing with people I don't agree with. That's one thing. Someone who goes out of their way to alter Memory Alpha pages ON TOP OF IT is something else.

 

[marsh8472]

I think responding to Marsh at this point is an utter waste of time. He literally altered Memory Alpha pages to “validate” his arguments because they were too inconvenient for him. He’s not interested in discussing how DISCOVERY can fit in with the universe as seen in previous shows, he’s only interested in how it deviates from them, and uses that to argue how it’s not “Real Star Trek”.

That’s all I have to say about that.

How nice of you to say thanks. Since I'm in the minority here while others don't budge with their opinions either, doesn't it waste my time even more so? You don't see me complaining about it. It does help satisfy my curiosity about how people can overlook the problems with Discovery that I see with it.

It's unfortunate. I can deal with arguing with people I don't agree with. That's one thing. Someone who goes out of their way to alter Memory Alpha pages ON TOP OF IF IT is something else.

Not true, but I think that site is dumb for making arguments from authority with. If someone needs to rely on that site as an authority to make a point then the discussion is already over. Wiki sites are supposed to just state facts from other sources and then site those facts. If that's the case then the wiki site should not be necessary as a direct source to quote from and someone could just site from whatever source the wiki is referencing instead. I prefer to research and site the original source where the information comes from. In this case I don't need a site with someone else's opinion on it to tell me how to interpret a scene. http://www.findingdulcinea.com/news...tudents-Cannot-Cite-or-Rely-on-Wikipedia.html

 

[Agony_Boothb]

In this case I don't need a site with someone else's opinion on it to tell me how to interpret a scene.

You were more than happy to alter it with your opinion to win an argument

 

[Locutus of Bored]

Not true, but I think that site is dumb for making arguments from authority with. If someone needs to rely on that site as an authority to make a point then the discussion is already over. Wiki sites are supposed to just state facts from other sources and then site those facts. If that's the case then the wiki site should not be necessary as a direct source to quote from and someone could just site from whatever source the wiki is referencing instead. I prefer to research and site the original source where the information comes from. In this case I don't need a site with someone else's opinion on it to tell me how to interpret a scene. http://www.findingdulcinea.com/news...tudents-Cannot-Cite-or-Rely-on-Wikipedia.html

Trying to prove something is an unreliable source of information by vandalizing it yourself is like trying to convince your wife a town is too dangerous to live in by murdering a bunch of people. The vast majority of contributors to MA are reasonable adults who wouldn't do that, so it's a handful of people who cause problems. You are part of that handful of people causing problems. That is not something to be proud of.

From your article:
— The contributor with an agenda often prevails.
In theory, the intellectual sparring at the heart of Wikipedia's group editing process results in a consensus that removes unreliable contributions and edits. But often the contributor who “wins” is not the one with the soundest information, but rather the one with the strongest agenda.
— Sometimes “vandals” create malicious entries that go uncorrected for months.
Due to the fact that Wikipedia can be edited by anyone with an Internet connection, users can falsify entries. Though in many instances reviewers quickly delete this “vandalism,” occasionally false information can remain on Wikipedia for extended periods of time.

This is describing you. You posted an article describing your own misbehavior.

Also, this is a fictional tech discussion on a Star Trek forum, not a dissertation. Memory Alpha is a perfectly acceptable source of evidence for the factual content of the show, your attempts at manipulating those facts notwithstanding.

Now that we've got that out of the way, everyone else needs to drop it, because Memory Alpha's reliability is not the topic. Stick to discussing what DSC has added to Trek Lore.

Also, no personal remarks at marsh's expense to provoke a response as happened before.

 

[Hythlodeus]

we get a lot more cultural diversity in regards to the Klingons and their houses than we've ever got before, we now know more about Saurians and of the Terrans of the 23th century.
We also learned a lot of the war between the Klingons and the Federation in that decade, were introduced to the Vulcan logic extremists, experienced the date when TOS style uniforms were introduced on the Enterprise, were shown how the imperfect holographic simulations of that era looked like before they were perfected 100 years later, gained more insight into the workings of the Universal Translator and so on and so forth.
In short, a shitload of information was added to the "Lore"

 

[Timo]

Also, we finally know for sure now that the mid-23rd century wasn't all about Jim Kirk and the Enterprise. Although Spock and the Constitution class do feature big...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[fireproof78]

we get a lot more cultural diversity in regards to the Klingons and their houses than we've ever got before

This is something that I thoroughly enjoy the addition of.

 

[Hythlodeus]

This is something that I thoroughly enjoy the addition of.

Agreed, the 'Biker Mice from Mars' version of the Klingons got a little stale over time

 

[fireproof78]

Agreed, the 'Biker Mice from Mars' version of the Klingons got a little stale over time

Indeed, and became highly frustrating as a viewer. Of all the TOS races the Klingons interested me the least during Berman era. Even DS9 didn't make them interesting. It all felt very repetitious and uninspired.

I know I'm in the minority on make up and use of the Klingon language, but I will take that over more discussion over "honor" and the like. I wanted to feel more invested in this alien culture not stereotyping. Discovery did that.

 

[Hythlodeus]

I know I'm in the minority on make up and use of the Klingon language, but I will take that over more discussion over "honor" and the like. I wanted to feel more invested in this alien culture not stereotyping. Discovery did that.

We're in the same boat here. Also, I love the new make up and the usage of subtitles as it helps you immerse more in the feeling that there is a very different, alien, culture

 

[Awesome Possum]

We're in the same boat here. Also, I love the new make up and the usage of subtitles as it helps you immerse more in the feeling that there is a very different, alien, culture

I like that every single house seems to have different looks to their armor showing that each house has their own history and unique sense of styles. There’s more than a few who wear some sort of jewelry over their ridges.

 

[DaveyNY]

It seems that DISCOVERY is giving us more of the TOS MOVIE Klingons than the TNG ones.

 

[Yassa Justice]

we get a lot more cultural diversity in regards to the Klingons and their houses than we've ever got before, we now know more about Saurians and of the Terrans of the 23th century.
We also learned a lot of the war between the Klingons and the Federation in that decade, were introduced to the Vulcan logic extremists, experienced the date when TOS style uniforms were introduced on the Enterprise, were shown how the imperfect holographic simulations of that era looked like before they were perfected 100 years later, gained more insight into the workings of the Universal Translator and so on and so forth.
In short, a shitload of information was added to the "Lore"

Are the houses culturally diverse? In what way?

 

[DaveyNY]

I guess in their own ships and style of fashion.

 

[Timo]

Also, it's sorta fun that Voq never suspects that the old codger Kol-Sha would have nanotech in his facial paint; the twin stun baton seems to surprise him, too. Different Houses might have different technologies and different doctrines for their use.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[MakeshiftPython]

It seems that DISCOVERY is giving us more of the TOS MOVIE Klingons than the TNG ones.

That’s how I always viewed it. Many claim DISCO is just taking a cue from GAME OF THRONES, but the makers have been very adamant about how they wanted to make the show feel more cinematic than previous series have and have been looking back to the movies specifically for that cinematic feel. All the TOS films as well as INTO DARKNESS made heavy use of Klingons speaking their language subtitled.

I’m perfectly fine with it. My only nitpick is the subtitle font, but that’s very minor.

 

[Kor]

Are the houses culturally diverse? In what way?

We've seen how House Mokai is more into underhanded subterfuge to achieve its ends, whereas other houses might not consider that to be "honorable." And House Kor is into that war paint, which L'Rell told Kol-Sha to get rid of in favor of a new cultural conformity. I don't think the paint is just a matter of aesthetics; it probably has a rich background of lore and deep and nuanced significance going back quite a long time.

Kor

 

[Lord Garth]

Indeed, and became highly frustrating as a viewer. Of all the TOS races the Klingons interested me the least during Berman era. Even DS9 didn't make them interesting. It all felt very repetitious and uninspired.

I know I'm in the minority on make up and use of the Klingon language, but I will take that over more discussion over "honor" and the like. I wanted to feel more invested in this alien culture not stereotyping. Discovery did that.

While I liked the TNG/DS9 Klingons, that's specifically 24th Century Klingons. So I'm glad they didn't go this route with the Disco Klingons.

It's also interesting when people say the Klingons have been overused. Once upon a time, that might've been true. But they weren't the main focus since DS9's fourth season in 1996 and they weren't the main focus of a film since TUC in 1991. Not to say they weren't a focus at all in late-DS9, some of ENT, or stray episodes of VOY, but the main antagonist of a season or film? That hadn't been done in a loooooooong time. And, like we've said, the DSC Klingons aren't the TNG/DS9 Klingons.