What does marriage mean to you?

[Kestra]

First, the ability to have such a legal relationship is denied to a great number of people who love each other just as much as any heterosexual couple.

Second, such an arrangement gives them financial benefits they haven't earned. It's unacceptable to me that having a piece of paper gives you tax benefits.

I'm with you here. I do believe it's something the government should stay out of. Civil unions for everyone, if they must, and religious ceremonies and "marriage" as something with no legal recognition.

Third, and this is where a lot of people get offended, I believe that it is extremely disadvantageous for a man to get married in the legal sense. Like it or not, a great many marriages end in divorce. Such divorces are typically initiated unilaterally by the woman, taking advantage of the so-called 'no fault' system of divorce which allows the splitting of assets with no need to prove any wrongdoing.

The divorce system in no way favours men, so custody of the children and ownership of the family home is typically retained by the woman.

I believe that men would be better off cohabitating in an 'unofficial' marriage but even then, as others have said, a man can't even do that because eventually the law will say he's married anyway.

I just can't accept a system that allows a man to lose his home and his children without anyone having to demonstrate that he actually did anything wrong.

It was my understanding that at least in the US, common-law doesn't apply in the vast majority of states. I could be wrong about that. The divorce system does favor women, particularly in custody matters. Then again you have people like my sister who got screwed over financially by her marriage and subsequent divorce, or couples like my husband and I where he was actually the one that wanted to get married.

 

[RoJoHen]

I actually didn't realize that common-law marriage wasn't common in most states. I actually always assumed it was legal in Illinois, but apparently it's not.

 

[Hermiod]

It was my understanding that at least in the US, common-law doesn't apply in the vast majority of states. I could be wrong about that. The divorce system does favor women, particularly in custody matters. Then again you have people like my sister who got screwed over financially by her marriage and subsequent divorce, or couples like my husband and I where he was actually the one that wanted to get married.

I believe somebody said it was 11 states, but I don't live in the US.

I can only speak about the majority of cases. In general, it's not the man who gets the house or the alimony when the marriage ends and the vast majority of 'no fault' divorces are initiated by women.

 

[doubleohfive]

Fair enough. I can get defensive about marriage (and pretty much everything else) but I want you to understand that that wasn't the case here. My reaction was about something else.

I get that.

FWIW, I didn't really even want to get married. It was the result of my husband wanting it, family pressure, societal pressure, and eventually seeing some of the benefits of such a union. That's why my husband and I were together seven years before I wanted to get married. As a result I have some conflicted views on marriage.

As others have tried to establish, there's Marriage and then there's Marriage. It's hard for people to separate the legal framework, the sharing of assets and so on and so on from the part where two people love each other and want to spend the rest of their lives together.

It's not the second part I have any problem with at all. My problem is very much with the first.

First, the ability to have such a legal relationship is denied to a great number of people who love each other just as much as any heterosexual couple.

Second, such an arrangement gives them financial benefits they haven't earned. It's unacceptable to me that having a piece of paper gives you tax benefits.

Third, and this is where a lot of people get offended, I believe that it is extremely disadvantageous for a man to get married in the legal sense. Like it or not, a great many marriages end in divorce. Such divorces are typically initiated unilaterally by the woman, taking advantage of the so-called 'no fault' system of divorce which allows the splitting of assets with no need to prove any wrongdoing.

The divorce system in no way favours men, so custody of the children and ownership of the family home is typically retained by the woman.

I believe that men would be better off cohabitating in an 'unofficial' marriage but even then, as others have said, a man can't even do that because eventually the law will say he's married anyway.

I just can't accept a system that allows a man to lose his home and his children without anyone having to demonstrate that he actually did anything wrong.

Hermiod, I'm curious. Given this perspective you have, are you planning on getting married someday?

 

[Robert D. Robot]

I have some relatives and a few friends who did not take their first marriages seriously (neither the emotional/romantic commitment, nor the government's piece of paper), and divorces were the result. Many of them did learn a lesson about more carefully choosing the right partner for such a relationship and/or learning a bit more about how they, themselves, needed to grow up a bit more and look into the mirror with a bit more of a critical eye. Their second marriages seem to have done better.

I also know some other people who were better suited for how they perceived the commitment of marriage from the start and they respected the vows that they had taken, and they are
doing OK. Not to say that there are not challenges, but their relationships are strong.

I know a few others (both male and female friends) who have not done so well in relationships and have progressively gotten fairly bitter and now have little good to say about members of the opposite sex. They now choose only the kind of brief, breezy, crazy, dating relationships that we saw characters on "Seinfeld" involved in, yet are frustrated about how they can't find a "real" person. It gets tiring listening to them, but I do wish them luck. I think they could benefit from borrowing one of those mirrors that I mentioned earlier and learning how to use it properly.

Marriage means different things to different people (as others have said earlier), and that is why there are some many different outcomes. Can you find the person who has the same exact expectations as you?

 

[Adm_Hawthorne]

Didn't the OP ask what it meant to us individually anyway? I don't believe they were looking for one specific definition.

 

[Hermiod]

Didn't the OP ask what it meant to us individually anyway? I don't believe they were looking for one specific definition.

Sure, but a question like this is always going to spark some debate, not just a list of posters and their personal views.

 

[Deckerd]

I'm sorry but every time I read that title I hear Peter Cook as the bishop in The Princess Bride.

 

[propita]

To me, marriage is the bonding of two people in love, and who have recognized that they cannot be apart from one another in soul and body, and join together. It is a commitment made strong from love and trust, a willingness to become one in heart, to make sacrifices for one another, to grow old together, to traverse through life together. Never alone, never unloved.

Ummm....Yeah.

Legally, it is the taking on of legal rights and obligations--which is why I think it should be separated from religious ceremonies completely.

Personally, it's the sharing of lives--and hopefully loves--so that there's always someone you can rely on to be there for you.

Hubby and I lived together for 9 years before marrying. He didn't want to marry; I figured I'd be happier with him umarried than without him. W've shared our lives and had each others' backs for the past 23 years, married or not.

When we did get married, it wasn't particularly fancy. Mom made my dress out of satin she had been given; Hubby wore a suit. Our rings (completely plain bands of white gold) were around $100 each--gold was cheaper then. Flowers were given as a gift from a friend, so I had a bouquet, corsages, and boutonierres(sp?). Mom and Dad were witnesses at the County Registrar Recorder's office. Our wedding dinner for four at Disneyland's Club 33, including a wedding cake, was around $250.

 

[OrionSlaveGirl]

I may sound crazy or like I am living in a fairytale world...but I just want to find the perfect woman(to me), have this perfect day(The wedding) and as I said...Love, Honor & Cherish Her forever(I don't believe death will part us, personally...Love is everlasting. ).

With an attitude like that you deserve to find someone special!

Personally I had the wedding of my dreams, on a budget that some women spend on their dress alone (mine cost $125... it was a white prom dress and nobody knew the difference!).

I could talk about marriage bonds and everlasting love, but to me the best things about being married are having someone to share the good times (and bad) with, someone to cuddle up with and watch movies, go on vacation, eat with, create a family with, etc... that being said, you don't need to be married per say to enjoy these things.

 

[Marie1]

It was my understanding that at least in the US, common-law doesn't apply in the vast majority of states. I could be wrong about that. The divorce system does favor women, particularly in custody matters. Then again you have people like my sister who got screwed over financially by her marriage and subsequent divorce, or couples like my husband and I where he was actually the one that wanted to get married.

I believe somebody said it was 11 states, but I don't live in the US.

I can only speak about the majority of cases. In general, it's not the man who gets the house or the alimony when the marriage ends and the vast majority of 'no fault' divorces are initiated by women.

I was told that in Canada, it's a 50/50 split, even on the grounds of adultery, these days.

 

[Hermiod]

It was my understanding that at least in the US, common-law doesn't apply in the vast majority of states. I could be wrong about that. The divorce system does favor women, particularly in custody matters. Then again you have people like my sister who got screwed over financially by her marriage and subsequent divorce, or couples like my husband and I where he was actually the one that wanted to get married.

I believe somebody said it was 11 states, but I don't live in the US.

I can only speak about the majority of cases. In general, it's not the man who gets the house or the alimony when the marriage ends and the vast majority of 'no fault' divorces are initiated by women.

I was told that in Canada, it's a 50/50 split, even on the grounds of adultery, these days.

Even when the financial input wasn't 50/50 ?

 

[propita]

Third, and this is where a lot of people get offended, I believe that it is extremely disadvantageous for a man to get married in the legal sense. Like it or not, a great many marriages end in divorce. Such divorces are typically initiated unilaterally by the woman, taking advantage of the so-called 'no fault' system of divorce which allows the splitting of assets with no need to prove any wrongdoing.

The divorce system in no way favours men, so custody of the children and ownership of the family home is typically retained by the woman.

I believe that men would be better off cohabitating in an 'unofficial' marriage but even then, as others have said, a man can't even do that because eventually the law will say he's married anyway.

I just can't accept a system that allows a man to lose his home and his children without anyone having to demonstrate that he actually did anything wrong.

Damn, Dude! You sound bitter.

Not having been through a divorce personally, nor having taken a Family Law class, my experience is limited. But your statements seem to blanket all men as the innocent party, while the "bad" woman takes all the benefits of marriage and divorce, despite your repeated use of the word "typically."

I'm not a fan of "no fault," but I realize that many people don't bother to think before getting married. That's a problem with both men and women. And there are far more stories of fathers abandoning their children than mothers--though I totally concede that there are a significant number of men treated unfairly by their ex-wives and the legal system, and women taking unfair advantage of the legal system and/or unfairly screwing over their ex-husband.

 

[scotpens]

. . . many people don't bother to think before getting married.

^ THIS!!!

 

[Robert D. Robot]

Hermiod: "I can only speak about the majority of cases. In general, it's not the man who gets the house or the alimony when the marriage ends and the vast majority of 'no fault' divorces are initiated by women."

Marie1: "I was told that in Canada, it's a 50/50 split, even on the grounds of adultery, these days."

Hermiod: "Even when the financial input wasn't 50/50?"

-------------------------------------------------------------

When Marie1 said that she was told it is a 50/50 split in Canada, wasn't she referring to he proportion of which gender is initiating the 'no fault' divorces, not how the property is divided?

 

[Kelso]

I'll be happy when mine is over. Not eager to try it again.