Spoilers What do you think of Lorca's Arc?

[Saul]

What did you think of Lorca's arc? For those who already know his fate how do you think it played out overall?

He was my favorite character on the show and the most interesting. The further into the season it got the more fascinating he became. According to the producers Lorca wasn't originally supposed to come from the Mirror Universe in Bryan Fuller's original plan.Sure, he plays a flawed human in the time of the Federation but there has to be a few of em out there. Mirror Lorca was fun with spray cheese on top but maybe a more realistic conflict would have been more delectable than the "he's bad because he's from the mirror universe". The mirror arc was fun but Lorca got put away a bit too quickly after his reveal.

 

[Krandor]

I don't think it did. In the end nothing changed really and status quo was resumed. He had this big plan, spend 12 episodes putting it together and directing events of the first 12 epiosdes then just failed and died (supposedly).

I really liked the arc up until the last episode. The ending was not good for me. I hope it isn't really the ending

 

[CorporalClegg]

I think my dog could have written something better.

It started out good, tho.

 

[cultcross]

According to the producers Lorca wasn't originally supposed to come from the Mirror Universe in Bryan Fuller's original plan

If that's the case, it was changed pretty early - Isaacs is saying he was told from day one, so the story changed prior to casting.

Mirror Lorca was fun with spray cheese on top but maybe a more realistic conflict would have been more delectable than the "he's bad because he's from the mirror universe". The mirror arc was fun but Lorca got put away a bit too quickly after his reveal.

I agree with you. I was ultimately left feeling frustrated by Lorca's arc. I enjoyed the character tremendously, as a flawed, interesting human who made ambiguous choices and we didn't really know where his loyalties lay. Isaacs' performance was the icing on that cake, and as I've said elsewhere was my real highlight from season 1.
But then the mirror universe arc began, and I could feel the first little inkling of frustration - I was still holding out hope that this was a misdirect, and Lorca had actually meant to go back in time, or to save the Buran, or something like that. But then the final reveal was - he's MU Lorca and always has been. My reaction to the revelation wasn't excitement, it was a sigh. It was like they'd undone all the work they'd done creating Star Trek a real-seeming, fascinating character. I thought 'well maybe, this is just part of the story. Maybe he will be a rebel with a cause who is just rough around the edges. Maybe he is salvageable as a rogue type antihero character.' But then, Lorca, meet sword. Killed in the best tradition of late Game of thrones, for seemingly no purpose at all.

Overall, then, a big disappointment after a promising start.

 

[Jadeb]

Tremendous waste of potential. The best part of Discovery -- the only part I found really engaging -- turned into a 21st century Bele.

 

[Saul]

I was still holding out hope that this was a misdirect, and Lorca had actually meant to go back in time, or to save the Buran, or something like that.

Great idea! Never thought of that. His actions were part of a plan to save his crew in the past like any good time travel Trek story.

I felt since the mid season break 'Discovery' has gone from mass audience appeal to mass fan appeal with a lot of the stuff they did with the mirror universe. It feels far less like what it planned to be. They ditched what wasn't working and just went hell to leather with stuff that was a big hit in the past ala 'In A Mirror Darkly' - Ent.

 

[eschaton]

The "arc" was a pile of hot garbage. Actually, it was a pretty delicious feast, and then they decided to pour a bunch of hot garbage on the table right at the end.

In some ways, the way the arc worked mirrored (no pun intended) the Ash/Voq arc. Lots of little "hints" were dropped, and it became more and more explicit. However, when the final reveal happened, the payoff just wasn't worth the windup. It was just dealt with in the most on-the-nose manner possible, and then the story moved on.

Only, it was way worse than Ash. Ash was a shitty character who really had nothing other than "mystery" and an unconvincing relationship with Burnham. Thus not much was lost when that arc was over. In contrast, Lorca was marvelously textured in Isaacs' performance, and it turns out that he was the primary actor behind the plot from the third episode until Sunday. Thus the stakes on getting it right were much, much higher. Yet the writers totally whiffed it.

 

[Jadeb]

I felt since the mid season break 'Discovery' has gone from mass audience appeal to mass fan appeal with a lot of the stuff they did with the mirror universe. It feels far less like what it planned to be. They ditched what wasn't working and just went hell to leather with stuff that was a big hit in the past ala 'In A Mirror Darkly' - Ent.

It feels a lot like fourth-season Enterprise to me, which is odd, considering that was a fan-focused last-ditch attempt to sustain a failing show while this is, presumably, an attempt to bring in a wide audience to the CBS streaming service.

 

[guyute03]

I enjoyed it. And I really really thought he was some iteration of Section 31 at first.

 

[eschaton]

It feels a lot like fourth-season Enterprise to me, which is odd, considering that was a fan-focused last-ditch attempt to sustain a failing show while this is, presumably, an attempt to bring in a wide audience to the CBS streaming service.

At one point nearly half of the U.S. population identified as Trekkies IIRC. Obviously a lot of those people were very casual fans, and new generations have grown up with limited exposure to Trek, but it's not like existing fandom is a small audience they have to run screaming from.

 

[GeekUSACarl]

I think Lorca's character came out swinging as the master schemer, ten steps ahead of everyone, but went out like a chump, like Elmer Fudd.

A guy that smart wouldn't end up that stupid. Didn't make any sense for the character.

 

[eschaton]

I think Lorca's character came out swinging as the master schemer, ten steps ahead of everyone, but went out like a chump, like Elmer Fudd.

A guy that smart wouldn't end up that stupid. Didn't make any sense for the character.

Initially I thought the problem with the story this season was that they had endpoints in mind for the different arcs, but had no idea how to get there.

After seeing what they did with Ash and Lorca, I think they were just winging it the whole time. No way you'd whiff it this bad in execution if you actually knew the conclusion you were building towards.

 

[SJA]

The more I examine it the more it irritates me at the lost opportunity! I thought something was up with him back when he couldn't remember his holiday booty call with Cornwall but what annoys me is how in the last two eps he just became a standard villain with all the extra depth and subtext that Isaacs brought to the roll seemingly abandoned! What was the point of all the pained looks that Lorca was expressing earlier eps that hinted at a greater emotional complexity? What happened to the genuine sense of moral ambiguity you thought the character could embody? It seems it was all just misdirection...The more I think about it the more annoyed I get tbh...I still enjoy the show but the MU stuff has left me entertained but emotionally removed ...Oh and another thing...And apologies if this has been discussed but was his room full of war stuff (the Gorn skell) belong to 'Good' Lorca's or 'evil' Lorca's? Did 'good' Lorca collect it or did Evil' Lorca 'just happen to have a suitcase full of alien weapons and corpses on him when his transport malfunctioned? How long was he actually hiding on Discovery for?

 

[eschaton]

How long was he actually hiding on Discovery for?

Lorca lost the Buran some time after the Battle of the Binary Stars. He couldn't have been on the ship any more than six months before Burnham showed up - perhaps significantly less. And those trophies almost certainly were not prime Lorca's, because one presumes all of his junk went up when the Buran was destroyed.

 

[picardjean-luc]

What did you think of Lorca's arc? For those who already know his fate how do you think it played out overall?

He was my favorite character on the show and the most interesting. The further into the season it got the more fascinating he became. According to the producers Lorca wasn't originally supposed to come from the Mirror Universe in Bryan Fuller's original plan.Sure, he plays a flawed human in the time of the Federation but there has to be a few of em out there. Mirror Lorca was fun with spray cheese on top but maybe a more realistic conflict would have been more delectable than the "he's bad because he's from the mirror universe". The mirror arc was fun but Lorca got put away a bit too quickly after his reveal.

Agreed. I like Lorca until the closing minutes of Episode 12 and then Episode 13. Once his identity was revealed he morphed quickly to become a cartoon villain from MU: "I gassed dozens of Emperor's soldiers to death because that's how a Terran officer does in order to advance and gain power."

Total waste of Jason Isaac's time and talent IMHO . However, still holding on to some hope that he'll return as PU Lorca sometime in Season 2....

 

[Timo]

Oh, I have no doubt this is exactly what was planned from day one on. It just wasn't planned in exact detail.

And I can't bring myself to give two shits about whether the arc managed to "surprise" us. There was forward motion, and it was good going, with a good actor doing subtle things while wading knee deep in a school of red herrings.

But I can't see it ending in anything better than this, in anything else but this. We got the morally ambiguous character, a dozen episodes of him. And that was that. We then got to see his beloved "destiny", which was absolutely realistic for the character. In the land of the blind, his shifty and sensitive eyes got him far. In the land of his peers, he had no future - nobody lives, and certainly nobody ascends.

We're done with Lorca now. Which is great about preplanned arcs. No need to drag it on, no need to take risks to see if there could still be something great or interesting about the character. Drop it when you're at the top, and drop it so hard it breaks for good. Long, hard falls down a bottomless shaft are good. Getting fried on the way down is better.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[picardjean-luc]

..Oh and another thing...And apologies if this has been discussed but was his room full of war stuff (the Gorn skell) belong to 'Good' Lorca's or 'evil' Lorca's? Did 'good' Lorca collect it or did Evil' Lorca 'just happen to have a suitcase full of alien weapons and corpses on him when his transport malfunctioned? How long was he actually hiding on Discovery for?

Thanks for pointing this out. Indeed, huge coincidence if MU Lorca happens to bring a suitcase full of 'war trophies' when his transport 'malfunctioned' .

 

[Krandor]

We're done with Lorca now. Which is great about preplanned arcs. No need to drag it on, no need to take risks to see if there could still be something great or interesting about the character. Drop it when you're at the top, and drop it so hard it breaks for good. Long, hard falls down a bottomless shaft are good. Getting fried on the way down is better.

I'm not so sure we are. He fell into a spore powered device through the moon door that is connected to the spore network the same spore network werein we saw a supposedly dead culver. I wouldn't be shocked if he is still alive somewhere inside the spore network

 

[Jadeb]

At one point nearly half of the U.S. population identified as Trekkies IIRC. Obviously a lot of those people were very casual fans, and new generations have grown up with limited exposure to Trek, but it's not like existing fandom is a small audience they have to run screaming from.

Yeah, and I expected they'd write the show in away to invite those folks in. TNG managed it, Star Trek IV managed it, and, more recently, the first JJ Trek managed it. But I can't imagine that they thought non-fans could possibly care about Klingon purity or want to read subtitles about the great houses of the planet Kling, and then we take a long trip into the MU -- a fun-but-silly conceit from 50 years ago -- that was Flash Gordon-levels of campy. It's like they doubled-down on the stereotypes that scare off non-fans. The result feels very inside baseball to me.

 

[Jadeb]

I'm not so sure we are. He fell into a spore powered device through the moon door that is connected to the spore network the same spore network werein we saw a supposedly dead culver. I wouldn't be shocked if he is still alive somewhere inside the spore network

I'd think that sword through the chest would mean he's as dead as you get in Trek.