What are your thoughts about seeing the prime universe again?

[Captain of the USS Averof]

– But things are not as they teach us... For the world is hollow, and I have touched the sky.

– Forgive him for he was an old man, and old men are sometimes foolish.


I'm sorry. For some reason that just came to my mind. Carry on!

 

[jaime]

No, it really doesn't and never has. They get the broad strokes right, sometimes.

That would be the fairly well part of what I said. And some of those broad strokes...aren't very broad.

 

[jaime]

Not anything more than Enterprise has done. Or TMP, for that matter.

And there is no "real" Star Trek. All make believe.

What...I have to ask...is incompatible with the past in TMP? Klingon noggins aside.

 

[BillJ]

What...I have to ask...is incompatible with the past in TMP? Klingon noggins aside.

The fact we're suppose to believe that this is the same visual universe as TOS. They shoehorn in the refit, but there is nothing visually left of TOS. Nothing. Beyond basic shapes and the arrowhead badge, you wouldn't know they were part of the same universe based on the look.

Many folks see TMP as a reboot of TOS, with TWOK wiping that away and starting over yet again.

 

[uniderth]

Not anything more than Enterprise has done.

Exactly why the most recent Star Trek series ended in 2001.

And there is no "real" Star Trek. All make believe.

Star trek is real. I've been watching it for years. I can't imagine there being this large a fan base for an imaginary television/movie franchise.So when I say, not part of real Star Trek, I am both referring to the universe and the franchise.

I would respectfully ask you to name those elements that you believe are incompatible.

Kelvin's design - way too large to be consistent.
Khan's ethnicity - clearly Khan was fundamentally different.
Delta Vega - Completely different position.

There's probably more, but I've never seen the films so I'm just gleaning what I can from the internet.

 

[BillJ]

Kelvin's design - way too large to be consistent.

We saw exactly one class of ship from the time period. So making any judgements from that is beyond foolish.

Khan's ethnicity - clearly Khan was fundamentally different.

Plastic surgery.

Delta Vega - Completely different position.

I grew up in Norwood, Ohio. There's about a dozen different Norwood's in the US. Star Trek has like eight different Rigel's. Not seeing an issue.

There's probably more, but I've never seen the films so I'm just gleaning what I can from the internet.

So, you really don't have a fucking clue.

 

[Trekkin]

There's probably more, but I've never seen the films so I'm just gleaning what I can from the internet.

Always a terrible idea. Leads to much in the way of ass-biting.

Now excuse me, I must return to the 'Worst Thing About Discovery' thread.

 

[Captain of the USS Averof]

Always a terrible idea.

Now excuse me, I must return to the 'Worst Thing About Discovery' thread.

I thought this was the 'Worst Thing About Discovery' thread! There's another one?

 

[uniderth]

So, you really don't have a fucking clue.

I know enough to know that Star Trek doesn't need a reboot. Additionally I couldn't care less about the adventures of a reboot Kirk and crew. So I dump JJ and his films out the airlock.

But I was asked for reasons why the Kelvin couldn't be part of real Star Trek and I gave those reasons.

Always a terrible idea. Leads to much in the way of ass-biting.

That's fine. But I don't have to smoke cigarettes to know they would be detrimental to my health. Likewise, I don't have to watch a film to know whether its something I want to invest my time and money into. I've voted with my dollars. And to paraphrase Malcolm Reynolds, I may be on the losing side, but I'm not convinced it's the wrong one.

 

[jaime]

The fact we're suppose to believe that this is the same visual universe as TOS. They shoehorn in the refit, but there is nothing visually left of TOS. Nothing. Beyond basic shapes and the arrowhead badge, you wouldn't know they were part of the same universe based on the look.

Many folks see TMP as a reboot of TOS, with TWOK wiping that away and starting over yet again.

Every actor came back, and the designs are in keeping with time passing. I think that's a case of fan over sensitivity. Series do that all the time with less story time passing. On the bright side, you can take solace in Uhuras earpiece. Maybe a transporter rounded.

 

[Dukhat]

Kelvin's design - way too large to be consistent.
Khan's ethnicity - clearly Khan was fundamentally different.
Delta Vega - Completely different position.

There's probably more, but I've never seen the films so I'm just gleaning what I can from the internet.

The fact that you haven't actually seen the films, yet feel entitled to judge them, throws your credibility out the window and just makes me take you even less seriously.

But to play devil's advocate here, I will respond to your three points.

1. There has never been any canon information regarding the size of Starfleet vessels from the 2230's. Since we have never seen any ships from that era previously, you cannot logically state that the Kelvin is "way too large to be consistent."

2. Khan was genetically altered to look different by Admiral Marcus (head of Section 31.) You would have known that had you actually seen the movie.

3. The Delta Vega from ST09 was not the same Delta Vega from "WNMHGB." Because, you know, there can only be one planet in the entire galaxy called "Delta Vega."

I know enough to know that Star Trek doesn't need a reboot.

It most certainly did. Berman-era Trek died when ENT got cancelled. And Trek would have stayed dead had it not been for the Abrams films revitalizing it, being hugely successful both financially and critically. The fact that we're even getting a new show was due to the success of the films. But by all means keep living in denial.

 

[Trekkin]

But I don't have to smoke cigarettes to know they would be detrimental to my health

Critiquing art is a science now? With a verified method for testing 'real Star Trek' (or 'good movies'), you'd have to wonder why so many movies fuck it up.

But seriously, did you just hold up frigging medical science as an example for why 'argument from ignorance' is a good idea? You just made science cry.

Likewise, I don't have to watch a film to know whether its something I want to invest my time and money into.

Sure. Your choice. Whatever.

However, it has absolutely nothing to do with what we were actually discussing. Which was this:

I
But I was asked for reasons why the Kelvin couldn't be part of real Star Trek and I gave those reasons.

When you choose to argue about something, it's best to have an informed position (which you do not). Otherwise, you have that pesky 'You don't actually know what you're talking about' issue, which usually leads to eventual humiliation.

The whole entire object of the game) is to kill, just to kill, and the more you kill the higher the score."
— Lieutenant Colonel Dave Grossman on Doom

 

[Mudd]

There are elements of the JJ movies that make them incompatible as a branch off of real Star Trek.

There are elements of TOS that make them incompatible as a branch off of real Star Trek. So what?

TV Trek needs a reboot, and it's getting one.

 

[Mudd]

Are you sure about that?

One would have to be blind or...something...not to see the resemblances.

 

[Ovation]

Exactly why the most recent Star Trek series ended in 2001.

Wrong. 2005. But maybe you simply made a typo.

Star trek is real. I've been watching it for years. I can't imagine there being this large a fan base for an imaginary television/movie franchise.So when I say, not part of real Star Trek, I am both referring to the universe and the franchise.

Well, the franchise is ongoing--the third film since the 2005 cancellation/hiatus of the franchise is still in theatres and there is a new series coming out. As it is produced by the IP owners, it's all "real" (going by your own definition, among others).

You can dislike elements of the franchise; ignore them to your heart's content. You cannot define those unliked and ignored elements as anything but "real Star Trek", though. Your preferences do not trump reality.

 

[urbandefault]

Star trek is real.

Sorry, it's all made up stuff filmed and distributed to make money for GR/Desilu/NBC/Paramount/Viacom/CBS. It isn't real. And as we've learned from watching STIV, "nothing unreal exists."

 

[Trekkin]

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Someone was gonna do it.

– But things are not as they teach us... For the world is hollow, and I have touched the sky.

– Forgive him for he was an old man, and old men are sometimes foolish.


I'm sorry. For some reason that just came to my mind. Carry on!

Um...you do remember that the 'crazy' old guy was actually right, and the woman poo-pooing him was being completely duped by the person feeding her information?

I think your subconscious is trying to shoot your foot. Might want to be wary of it.

 

[Awesome Possum]

I like to pretend that Nero was a diehard Prime universe fan. He only kills Capt. Robau after hearing the stardate. But it wasn't because he went back in time, he wanted the confusing format from the other shows that's just random numbers that usually progress based on a measurement that was never explained.

Also I really don't care if the show is in the Prime universe or Kelvin universe because Star Trek is fiction and none of it really matters. I'm interested in the stories and characters, not the box they put them in.

 

[TRON JA307020]

No, it really doesn't and never has. They get the broad strokes right, sometimes.

They have done a pretty good job especially since there have been over 600 episodes and several movies. That's a lot of screen time to keep exactly right. Shows like DS9 honored TOS and kept the continuity pretty tight as well as keeping in continuity with TNG and Voyager. Honestly sometimes you sound like you hate Prime Trek.

 

[TRON JA307020]

One would have to be blind or...something...not to see the resemblances.

The NuTrek Enterprise has several similarities to TMP Enterprise. Just because the Discover and Kelvin have similarities doesn't mean that this show is going to be compatible with NuTrek. Its obviously goin gto follow the Prime timeline buyt will look different because it has to engage newer viewers and to make it look like TOS may scare them away so they will have to make it look closer to NuTrek in design of computers and interior look. A kid with a IPad will not be interested in a interior of a ship that looks like TOS. With that said its still Prime so no one really cares.