What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by Amasov, Jun 20, 2020.

  1. Gul Sengosts

    Gul Sengosts Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Art can also make you think without evoking much emotions, or do other things. But I don't think The Visitor was meant to be viewed dispassionately. I see little point in criticising it for not doing something else than what it set out to do.
     
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  2. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I would hope that people would approach art with both thinking and feeling. But, maybe I'm giving too much credit to my fellow humans...:vulcan:
     
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  3. Ianburns252

    Ianburns252 Captain Captain

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    I think the term "make you feel" is being used too literally here.

    Feeling is not just about emotion for me - to combine both of your ideas I would suggest that something could make me feel inquisitive or curious and lead to me thinking about why it was created in such a way etc etc which is still about feeling but maybe not in the overly emotional manner that is usually assumed to be the meaning.

    I hope that kind of makes sense
     
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  4. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    "Feeling" is perhaps too abstract. It isn't just drawing out emotion, but also generating empathy about the characters, what they are experiencing in the moment, and how I would react. It's a multilayered process that adults tend to overthink while children are more genuine in their responses.
     
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  5. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Melodrama is all about eliciting emotional responses (through the use of exaggerated characters and extreme situations), but it is hardly above criticism. And, in fairness, nor is it wrong to enjoy it.

    Melodramatic is "The Visitor's" middle name.
     
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  6. Ianburns252

    Ianburns252 Captain Captain

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    I thought it was Lafayette...
     
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  7. Oddish

    Oddish Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Technically, we never find out Melanie's middle name. But we know she was played by Garak's kid.
     
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  8. Farscape One

    Farscape One Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The title of the episode also refers to Ben, as he essentially is an infrequent visitor in Jake's life due to the accident.

    Hence why Ianburns252 said Lafayette.

    (Wonderful thing about certain titles... they hold multiple meanings within the same episode.)
     
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  9. at Quark's

    at Quark's Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    To make people think, reflect on new possibilities.

    Art can generate an emotional response for sure, but that which only generates an emotional response (and does not broaden my horizon) I do not consider art. But that's a personal stance, of course.
     
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  10. Farscape One

    Farscape One Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I would disagree with that. What about music that brings out emotions?

    I'm probably the last person to say anything about art, but I think can not only make you think but also make you feel. Art reminds us we are human.
     
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  11. Oddish

    Oddish Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That is a good point! :techman:
     
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  12. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    If I had things my way, I would do two things:

    1. I would immediately declare that the different depictions of the 23rd Century are a result of the Temporal War. The version we see in TOS existed before the changes due to the Temporal War, and it continues to exist in its own parallel timeline. The version we see in SNW and Early-DSC exists after the changes due to the Temporal War. If people don't accept SNW or DSC over that and wouldn't even be willing to meet half-way with a compromise like this, then they weren't really with those shows to begin with.

    2. I would retcon the cause of The Burn. Su'Kal didn't really cause The Burn but whoever actually did made it look like Su'Kal did in case someone ever came close to finding out the truth. Su'Kal would be both a misdirect and the true mastermind's scapegoat. Only because I think what caused The Burn was so stupid.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2023 at 11:18 PM
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  13. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon Stealer of all the cookies in time and space Premium Member

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    I don't feel that way, I felt Su'Kal was a very TOS kind of story in the mold of things like Charlie X which was what I thought while watching it, and after all this is an opinions thread.
     
  14. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Admiral Admiral

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    Not really, they're both distinct stories and both great, for different reasons.
    Probably too late on that as they're already started adapteding elements of it.

    With the computer being naming themselves Zora, and someone in Season 3 referring to the Federation as with the same name Craft did, V'draysh.
     
  15. Paul755

    Paul755 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I’ve come to think of the Short Treks as something that sounded good in theory/on paper but for the vast majority failed in execution. There are a few…like Calypso or the one with Mudd that were good. But then you have the one with the Tribbles which was such a waste of H. Jon Benjamin or the “Children of Mars” which was just kinda there. The less said about Ephrim and DOT the better.

    A parallel timeline similar to what you suggest is the way I’ve viewed it since the Discoprise first graced the screen in Disco S1. Something akin to the alternate realities Worf traveled thru in “Parallels.” So I would totally accept that the temporal war was responsible. But I would have the divergence happen like right after The Cage.

    I think the cause of the burn is kinda dumb too. Having him be a scapegoat is a good idea. But instead of it being sinister just have it be a frame job by Starfleet because an experiment they were conducting went awry.
     
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  16. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon Stealer of all the cookies in time and space Premium Member

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    Ephrim and Dot was fun and so cute
     
  17. at Quark's

    at Quark's Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'd reply the same way. Before I would call music art, it has to be beyond my current capacity to fully understand it. Make me stretch a little to understand / grasp more every time I listen to it. If it only evokes emotion and does nothing more, I won't call it art.

    Same for other categories. A pretty picture that does nothing more than being pretty isn't art to me. A melodramatic movie without deeper layers isn't art to me.

    That doesn't mean I don't enjoy such music or such a picture at its time though.

    And I reiterate that a lot of good art does evoke a powerful emotional response in me. But it has to do more than that.
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2023 at 8:32 AM
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  18. Tallguy

    Tallguy Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'll see your Alternate Timelines and raise you Previously on Star Trek from If Memory Serves. I see this as both a statement that this is All the Same Thing as well as an acknowledgement that "This is a TV show and we're filming the episodes more than 50 years apart."

    Is it fair that we get a new "interpretation" of the same ships, sets, uniforms, and aliens from Star Trek every time JJ gets a pimple while the Millennium Falcon is reproduced down to the last kit-bashed Panzer greeblie whenever we see her? Probably not. Maybe there is an alternate timeline where that didn't happen.
     
  19. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon Stealer of all the cookies in time and space Premium Member

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    At the end of the day does anyone really, truly care that much about such things. I mean yes the most anal fans will stew endlessly over such details because that's the way they're wired. But I look at these shows as my entertainment and as long as they keep me happy all is right with the world and I won't fuss with every single detail or minutia inside.
     
  20. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Yes.

    My controversial opinion for the day.
     
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