What are the implications of extra-galactic super AIs?

[dupersuper]

Extra galactic, diminsional, spoons Ai's..
Good reason for the galactic barrier!

Except it didn't seem to be stopping them in Picards season finale...

Wasn't The Doomsday Machine also extra-galactic?

Yes, but not extra-dimensional (and, as the novel Vendetta points out, was barely extra-galactic, as there was no way a weapon that feeds off planets would be able to get here, still powered up, from very far outside the galaxy).

What they had in common was an utterly un-humanlike physiology. One is almost tempted to think that each galaxy at this day and age is under the control of a single superspecies that only allows its own kind to flourish there, and the Milky Way has humanoid overlords (that is, they used to be humanoid and are still fond of that shape) while Andromeda is controlled by somebody who used to look more or less Kelvan (that is, with a hundred tentacles).

I hardly think it's a universal law; the Milky Way just happened to have the Progenitors that nudged evolution on many worlds, the Preservers who transplanted humans, the Skagarans who transported human slaves, who ever kidnapped Amelia Earhart...

I wonder if there will be any repercussions from Soji being cool with pointing extinction at all organic life for a good while there. She doesn't have mind control or Data's emotion chip to fall back on, it was a real decision to nearly wipe out everyone she met during the series

Remember how cute she and Kestra were together? Yeah, she nearly murdered her...

Maybe this is why the Galactic barrier exists? To protect the galaxy from the AI "Federation" Maybe why there was a "Presevers" in the past because maybe in the past at some point, the AI federation came into our galaxy, and we fought them off, and set up the barrier, and the perservers went to work to reseed life around the galaxy??
Just a thought.. The Barrier is just one of those things that is sitting there waiting for a good story.

May I suggest the Q Continuum novels and the third Return of Kirk trilogy of novels?

 

[Charles Phipps]

It does remind me of one of Christopher Bennet's (@Christopher) stories: THE BURIED AGE.

Basically, he had an explanation for why so many millions of year old civilizations that Trekkers are constantly tripping over have been wiped out and aren't hanging around.

The Admonition could explain why Vulcans, Humans, and Klingons are the most advanced-ish race aside from the Borg.

(The Voth make no sense but maybe they could fight off the Berserker/Reapers).

 

[valkyrie013]

I've read the books, I want something Cannon
And the Androids had to create a portal/signal for the Ogdru Jahad err.. Ai's for them to come through. So the barrier is working but we have to do something from this side for them to get through.

 

[fireproof78]

It's not like the barrier hasn't been crossed before. It could simply have been weakened.

 

[Charles Phipps]

It's not like the barrier hasn't been crossed before. It could simply have been weakened.

The Enterprise got through the barrier so its not even that good of one.

 

[RAMA]

One of my theories for the great silence (Fermi Paradox) is that a lot of societies have reached this crux point..the tipping point in Picard and these societies are either wiped out or they simply evolve/change to the point where they are indifferent to outsiders for a long time. Picard has a slightly different wrinkle but along the same lines.

I should read that novel, I went a few years without reading them.

It does remind me of one of Christopher Bennet's stories: THE BURIED AGE.

Basically, he had an explanation for why so many millions of year old civilizations that Trekkers are constantly tripping over have been wiped out and aren't hanging around.

The Admonition could explain why Vulcans, Humans, and Klingons are the most advanced-ish race aside from the Borg.

(The Voth make no sense but maybe they could fight off the Berserker/Reapers).

 

[RAMA]

The Preservers/Progenitors are another wrinkle!! Yes, they could be the wildcard that has kept an Admonition from taking hold in this Galaxy.

Thereby hangs a tale!

RAMA

Except it didn't seem to be stopping them in Picards season finale...



Yes, but not extra-dimensional (and, as the novel Vendetta points out, was barely extra-galactic, as there was no way a weapon that feeds off planets would be able to get here, still powered up, from very far outside the galaxy).



I hardly think it's a universal law; the Milky Way just happened to have the Progenitors that nudged evolution on many worlds, the Preservers who transplanted humans, the Skagarans who transported human slaves, who ever kidnapped Amelia Earhart...



Remember how cute she and Kestra were together? Yeah, she nearly murdered her...



May I suggest the Q Continuum novels and the third Return of Kirk trilogy of novels?

 

[CorporalCaptain]

there was no way a weapon that feeds off planets would be able to get here, still powered up, from very far outside the galaxy)

I don't believe that's so. The machine could just power down and coast for several million years or more through intergalactic space and then wake up once it's inside a new feeding ground. The idea that it could do that isn't more fanciful than the Federation tech we are shown in every episode of Star Trek. The machine's hull is made of un-phaser-able material. Who knows how long its battery might hold a charge capable of re-initializing it back into destroy-and-eat mode?

 

[dupersuper]

I don't believe that's so. The machine could just power down and coast for several million years or more through intergalactic space and then wake up once it's inside a new feeding ground. The idea that it could do that isn't more fanciful than the Federation tech we are shown in every episode of Star Trek. The machine's hull is made of un-phaser-able material. Who knows how long its battery might hold a charge capable of re-initializing it back into destroy-and-eat mode?

Warp bubbles take power to maintain. To coast here it'd be going sublight....which would take millions of years.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Warp bubbles take power to maintain. To coast here it'd be going sublight....which would take millions of years.

Funny, that's what I said:

coast for several million years or more through intergalactic space

 

[RAMA]

It does remind me of one of Christopher Bennet's stories: THE BURIED AGE.

Basically, he had an explanation for why so many millions of year old civilizations that Trekkers are constantly tripping over have been wiped out and aren't hanging around.

The Admonition could explain why Vulcans, Humans, and Klingons are the most advanced-ish race aside from the Borg.

(The Voth make no sense but maybe they could fight off the Berserker/Reapers).

Downloaded on Kindle.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

I wonder:

The Borg vs Species 8472 vs Extra-Dimensional AI Machine Federation

Who wins?

 

[RAMA]

I wonder:

The Borg vs Species 8472 vs Extra-Dimensional AI Machine Federation

Who wins?

Well...both the Borg and 8472 have been neutered somewhat, but the super-pan-galactic AI Machine Federation was simply blocked getting onto the freeway...so I'll give them the edge.

 

[valkyrie013]

That would have been a better ending.. Borg cube vs Chuthulu Ai ... Maybe 1 got thru before the portal ( that is the only way to get thru the barrier)
And been romulans and feds and Borg vs 1 Ai.

 

[Charles Phipps]

If I did want to incorporate it into the larger Star Trek canon:

1. I am presuming these are the things that fixed V'Ger. They are much more powerful than the Borg and have an established compassion for AI. If the original V'Ger probe had a primitive AI consciousness then they would treat it like a poor lost child and up it to Reaper-status.

2. They could be the missing link between the Borg and V'Ger (connected only by theme music so far) with the fact that if the Borg were cyborgs seeking "perfection" then they might have imposed an AI consciousness over the organics to keep them in line.

Which oddly would make the Borg the Synthesis ending of Mass Effect.

 

[RAMA]

Generally, I dislike connecting V'Ger to any other part of the Trek universe, but I could certainly see it's evolution might bring it to the level of the highest order of AI, and these very well might be the ones in Picard.

I dislike connecting the Borg to these other AIs because their sense of "perfection" seems to include a synthesis of the organic and machine at all times. It makes them somewhat unique.

I have speculated before that the Borg may decide at some later date to shed the organic all together, but it seems that they have yet to reach the level of the most developed AIs we've seen.

If I did want to incorporate it into the larger Star Trek canon:

1. I am presuming these are the things that fixed V'Ger. They are much more powerful than the Borg and have an established compassion for AI. If the original V'Ger probe had a primitive AI consciousness then they would treat it like a poor lost child and up it to Reaper-status.

2. They could be the missing link between the Borg and V'Ger (connected only by theme music so far) with the fact that if the Borg were cyborgs seeking "perfection" then they might have imposed an AI consciousness over the organics to keep them in line.

Which oddly would make the Borg the Synthesis ending of Mass Effect.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I am presuming these are the things that fixed V'Ger. They are much more powerful than the Borg and have an established compassion for AI. If the original V'Ger probe had a primitive AI consciousness then they would treat it like a poor lost child and up it to Reaper-status.

I, on the other hand, am presuming that they aren't. There's more than a little circumstantial evidence in TMP that V'ger digitized the machine planet itself. Think about it. The only way we are shown for how images get stored in V'ger's imaging array is the digitization process that completely destroys the object. We are shown it done at three different scales (Ilia, the Klingon starships, and Epsilon IX), and we see the preparations for it happening on a planetary scale at Earth. No other means for the creation of the images stored in there is even discussed.

 

[CorporalClegg]

I, on the other hand, am presuming that they aren't. There's more than a little circumstantial evidence in TMP that V'ger digitized the machine planet itself. Think about it. The only way we are shown for how images get stored in V'ger's imagining array is the digitization process that completely destroys the object. We are shown it done at three different scales (Ilia, the Klingon starships, and Epsilon IX), and we see the preparations for it happening on a planetary scale at Earth. No other means for the creation of the images stored in there is even discussed.

Not to mention it makes the most sense thematically. The process of digitizing all things (and ultimately being completely unfulfilled by it) is the core of V'Ger's existence. This is exemplified by it zapping its would-be creators only to find them to be false gods.

 

[RAMA]

I, on the other hand, am presuming that they aren't. There's more than a little circumstantial evidence in TMP that V'ger digitized the machine planet itself. Think about it. The only way we are shown for how images get stored in V'ger's imaging array is the digitization process that completely destroys the object. We are shown it done at three different scales (Ilia, the Klingon starships, and Epsilon IX), and we see the preparations for it happening on a planetary scale at Earth. No other means for the creation of the images stored in there is even discussed.

One other possibility....

Unlike Nomad, V'Ger was purpose-built (created/grown) from the ground up. While it has to scan it's subjects to analyze them, it doesn't mean it didn't start out with a core memory storage...a sort of base knowledge to build from. It seems likely that it's home planet might be stored there and have significant meaning to itself.

RAMA

 

[CorporalCaptain]

One other possibility....

Unlike Nomad, V'Ger was purpose-built (created/grown) from the ground up. While it has to scan it's subjects to analyze them, it doesn't mean it didn't start out with a core memory storage...a sort of base knowledge to build from. It seems likely that it's home planet might be stored there and have significant meaning to itself.

RAMA

That might have been the case, but it was unsupported directly by anything presented in the film.