Lower Decks has not mentioned the Romulan evacuation. At all. And Memory Beta isn’t a valid canon source. All we know is that the evacuation fleet and Utopia Planitia was destroyed in 2387.
Was Sela pointless?
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Lower Decks has not mentioned the Romulan evacuation. At all. And Memory Beta isn’t a valid canon source. All we know is that the evacuation fleet and Utopia Planitia was destroyed in 2387.
The point being made is....
"Isn't it weird that the Romulans aren't mentioned at all in Lower Decks when they have a lot going on in the 2380s, oh, and one Romulan in Particular."
The evacuation fleet was destroyed in 2385.
The Romulan Sun blew up in 2387.
Building a fleet that can shift billions of Romulans, massive colony ships that can hold 10s of thousands of refugees a piece, might have taken decades, even with a synth labour force tirelessly chipping in, but the timeline only gave us 5 years according to novel.
Nero is a bit of a putz though if the Federation built an evacuation fleet that was destroyed by terrorists, and he still blames them for the "boom".
I liked all the main women in Season 1 as a kid, including Tasha. Looking back at it later, I understood more of why: Deanna was the heart, Beverly the brain, and Tasha the spirit. She showed that a woman could be brave and capable without losing her vulnerability. When she died, it was a truly shocking moment in TV history, regardless of the off-screen reasons behind it. And then for her memorial to be done via hologram, it was almost like seeing an angel, regardless of anyone's opinion regarding such matters. So when Data's connection to Tasha was brought up every so often, we were reminded it was more than a one-night stand. There was truly something special about it, for both of them.
Denise's return in Season 3 was a welcome one, and one of my favorite scenes in the whole series is when she says, "If I am to die in a Starfleet uniform, I want it to mean something." As for Sela, I saw her as more of a wounded child, her hatred fueled not by a lust for power but by an internal struggle with both sides of her heritage. She was proud to be Romulan, but the way Denise played it, you could see Sela truly loved and missed her mother - she was just desperately trying to hide it with anger.
Denise's return in Season 3 was a welcome one, and one of my favorite scenes in the whole series is when she says, "If I am to die in a Starfleet uniform, I want it to mean something." As for Sela, I saw her as more of a wounded child, her hatred fueled not by a lust for power but by an internal struggle with both sides of her heritage. She was proud to be Romulan, but the way Denise played it, you could see Sela truly loved and missed her mother - she was just desperately trying to hide it with anger.
Dude's unhinged.
And I’ll ask again: what does any of that have to do with Sela?
Her home and job were in turmoil during approximately the era of Lower Decks.
Her story could have easily overlapped with their story.
Except that’s not true. Romulus is fine in 2380. And we know zero about Sela or her job since “Unification.” She could be executed by 2380, or she could be the Emperor by 2380. Or washing dishes at Romulus’s equivalent of Red Lobster, for all we know. But since she never appeared in LDS and most likely never will, it’s irrelevant to the discussion.
I would agree she was not pointless, just not used to her potential. I can't think of many reasons why it had to be her in Unification, any Romulan could have been in her place really
I think they could have added more a personal slant to her plan in Redemption to. To me her main drive to sabotage the Klingon-Federation alliance is part of shunning her human side, for herself and to show others around her she is all Romulan. What if it was a slight against her Mother too? To undo the result of her sacrifice could be seen as an act of further revenge against her
It would have been interesting too if Tasha really was kept alive somewhere. I'm sure there would be enough of a 2-parter back then with Picard kidnapped by Sela and somehow meeting Tasha. And as it's TNG they would have to have rescued her, can't have her die 3 times :P
Quite a few ways they could have expanded on Sela after her reveal. Its just a shame her last actions on screen were to make a complete mess of her own plans.
I think they could have added more a personal slant to her plan in Redemption to. To me her main drive to sabotage the Klingon-Federation alliance is part of shunning her human side, for herself and to show others around her she is all Romulan. What if it was a slight against her Mother too? To undo the result of her sacrifice could be seen as an act of further revenge against her
It would have been interesting too if Tasha really was kept alive somewhere. I'm sure there would be enough of a 2-parter back then with Picard kidnapped by Sela and somehow meeting Tasha. And as it's TNG they would have to have rescued her, can't have her die 3 times :P
Quite a few ways they could have expanded on Sela after her reveal. Its just a shame her last actions on screen were to make a complete mess of her own plans.
Shinzon also decided to blame Earth and lots of other things that sodding Earth had nothing to do with. It's another popcorn-shovin' trope, either to show the villain being a nutter and thankfully something Earthy is conveniently around the corner as a reference point, or it's to get the audience to pee their pants* over Earth's imminent line of fire and is about to be attacked, which seems less likely. Granted, a flick set in the 23th or 24th century and Earth being the focal point as if 21st century Earth is going to be just like 24th's... at least the Borg had a proper reason to mosey on over to Earth (to cultivate some shiny new drones and more rapidly expand their more perfect "race" with... is a gestalt really a race? Find out in the next exciting episode of "Staaaaaaaar Trek, The Next Generation", aka "I, Borg"!
)* their collective pants, but the Borg element had to be said before "collective"
Shinzon also decided to blame Earth and lots of other things that sodding Earth had nothing to do with. It's another popcorn-shovin' trope, either to show the villain being a nutter and thankfully something Earthy is conveniently around the corner as a reference point, or it's to get the audience to pee their pants* over Earth's imminent line of fire and is about to be attacked, which seems less likely. Granted, a flick set in the 23th or 24th century and Earth being the focal point as if 21st century Earth is going to be just like 24th's... at least the Borg had a proper reason to mosey on over to Earth (to cultivate some shiny new drones and more rapidly expand their more perfect "race" with... is a gestalt really a race? Find out in the next exciting episode of "Staaaaaaaar Trek, The Next Generation", aka "I, Borg"!
* their collective pants, but the Borg element had to be said before "collective"
Shinzon should have gone after the Nexus, a few years earlier, or invested in gollum technology, or submitted to (temporary?) assimilation by the Borg.
Would the Queen have been into a younger, hotter, version of her husband?
"Earth is in danger!" is a deeply tired trope as far as Trek goes. If they weren't going to do it in a movie as game-changing as the '09 film, which went as far as to destroy Vulcan, then they surely weren't going to do it at any other time.
It's like any "the ship might be destroyed!" episode. You can care about the events that lead the ship to be endangered, but we all know that in a random episode the ship (probably) isn't going to be destroyed by the end of the episode.
It's like any "the ship might be destroyed!" episode. You can care about the events that lead the ship to be endangered, but we all know that in a random episode the ship (probably) isn't going to be destroyed by the end of the episode.
Well, they tried to avert that trope in generations and put an unknown unseen planet in the danger (instead of the Earth or the Enterprise) and that movie sucked
edit Sela at least went after Vulkan
edit Sela at least went after Vulkan
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I always wonder when I see this comment: does that take away the drama? Because I always found the drama came from the actors and their reactions, not necessarily thinking Earth is probably going to be destroyed.
Would people still watch if Earth was destroyed in Star Trek?
That's not why GEN sucked. The E-D was destroyed, and substituting Earth for V3 would just mean there would be a lot more ships present to destroy the BoP, do something to neutralize the threat of the Nexus and make it even more ridiculous that the E-D could be destroyed.
I hated the whole Sela story arc. I loved that Yesterday's enterprise seemed to give Tasha the heroic death as the warrior she was.
If the stories were taut and atmospheric. Most of Trek didn't revolve around Earth to begin with, and it's Earth in the future - we can't relate to Earth of the future at all. Indeed, when the baddies blew up Earth in Enterprise, it was easy to laugh off because it'd be returned and temporal war fiddly stuff... Trek was already burnt out by then and it was also a prequel. It's like making a prequel to "Mork and Mindy" where Mork apparently wasn't sent by Orson to bugger off to study Earth as big big plot tension. Meh. But prequels were never my thing.
The Voyage Home finds a decent enough way to involve Earth in the present, as a hook to make it feel relevant, and even then it's about using a Klingon ship (which is now laid out as a Federation one*) to U-Haul back some whales from 300 years in the past. At least we got that "nucular wessels" line - should have had Florence Henderson cameo in that scene and double up on the comedy and say "Wessonality? That's in the grocery store over yonder, in Alameda. My son Greg works there."
* How many schematics did the Federation know of this ship design at the time?
As I said, I think the key is to have a strong story surrounding the threat to Earth.
But it also doesn't have to be Earth; I just think the fans feel more of a connection to Earth than any other planet TPTB could choose (even Vulcan, heh).
In GEN there's something chilling about the way Data almost offhandedly notes that V4 is home to millions of people who will be killed if Soran succeeds. Just because we've never met them and know almost nothing about them doesn't mean they don't matter.
I'll disagree with the above post and say that I thought the destruction of Earth was shocking in "Twilight", even as we surely knew it would be reset by the end of the episode. It set the stakes for the events of the episode, but perhaps more important is what we see become of the human race, and the sad foreknowledge we have that Ceti Alpha V will prove to be no refuge at all.
Veridian III definitely was a better location. Not just because Trek means going "out there".
Every time Earth was used as a plot point in the TNG movies, it had at least that one reason to suck:
Generations: They already did the thrill of being in Earth's solar system at the start, where no other ship was properly available, and everybody knew who the El Aurians were, somehow. How those ships got to the Sol solar system by the seashore there after the Borg assimilated their homeworld also begged too many questions... plus, Guinan would have been better off with electric candles...
First Contact: Something about the Borg going into Earth's past to assimilate the future despite arriving in the present before going back in time just for the cheap thrill of killing off drones needlessly... then again, if they had won then the Enterprise's future wouldn't have transpired so those drones would never have died... unless they came from the 1701-D, in which case it starts to get a little more complex...
Insurrection: No Earth in sight, but it didn't stop the movie from sucking anyhow.
Nemesis: Ostensibly insane, instead of using Earth as a generic crowd-pleasing plot device as locus of action for the climax, Shinzon's whiplash plot motivation change from going after his Romulan captors to destroy Earth because somehow Picard is responsible for everything the Romulans did, including creating him in the first place... wasn't really believable or compelling.
Trek IV did Earth the best, but it was still tangential and by then everyone cared about Kirk's homeworld, even if it wasn't ours.
I don't think Sela should have been Donatra, but I think it would have been cool if Sela had been working with her and had a couple of lines. Or she got her face melted off in the opening scene of Nemesis.
I don't know about her on DS9. For me, I was really happy with T'Rul on DS9 so I would have liked to have seen more of that character, especially after Seska got killed off and Martha Hackett was freed up. A dark part of me wishes she filled Cretak's role and got the same fate, ending up in a cell on Romulus. Bashir getting someone he's known for four years thrown in jail versus Bashir getting a character's he known for two episodes and played by two different actors thrown in jail.
But also, fuck Sela. Fuck her and the piece of shit Vulcan ship she flew in on. 5000 people to invade a whole planet? Give me a break! Is it the human DNA that made her this stupid? Can we do something about it? Bring back Tomalak!
I don't know about her on DS9. For me, I was really happy with T'Rul on DS9 so I would have liked to have seen more of that character, especially after Seska got killed off and Martha Hackett was freed up. A dark part of me wishes she filled Cretak's role and got the same fate, ending up in a cell on Romulus. Bashir getting someone he's known for four years thrown in jail versus Bashir getting a character's he known for two episodes and played by two different actors thrown in jail.
But also, fuck Sela. Fuck her and the piece of shit Vulcan ship she flew in on. 5000 people to invade a whole planet? Give me a break! Is it the human DNA that made her this stupid? Can we do something about it? Bring back Tomalak!
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