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Warner bros announce superhero films through 2020

Leto earned his Razzie. I couldn't help but laugh at all his behind the scenes 'method acting' for a 'performance' that was barely seen in the final cut. And what little we did see was laughed at by critics and audiences, and not in a good way.

It doesn't surprise me that WB wants to do another version of Joker on the side. They're probably worried about the brand/IP damage to the character after Leto, after all the goodwill and popularity that Ledger/Nolan brought to it.
 
Meh. Yet another DC film I have no interest in. I didn't bother with Suicide Squad (ranging from it looked like crap to overt misogynistic tendencies the film clearly had) and Leto's Joker looked awful from what little I saw in the trailers.
 
^ Leto's Joker is, in spite of his protestations to the contrary, the first iteration of the character to be genuinely in love with Harley...

Which is horrifying. The Joker abuses Harley. It's obscene to try to romanticize that, especially in the wake of the revelations about Weinstein, Cosby, etc. The Joker is a psychopathic narcissist who's incapable of caring for anyone but himself. Harley is just a plaything to him, and the tragedy of Harley is that she mistakes that for true love.


Leto earned his Razzie. I couldn't help but laugh at all his behind the scenes 'method acting' for a 'performance' that was barely seen in the final cut.

I agree. In both Suicide Squad and Blade Runner (the only roles of his I think I've seen), I found his performance to be blatantly affected, broad, and artificial, the exact opposite of the kind of naturalism and believability that method acting is meant to achieve. So all that work he supposedly put into "creating" his characters just seems like an excuse for self-indulgence.
 
Which is horrifying. The Joker abuses Harley. It's obscene to try to romanticize that, especially in the wake of the revelations about Weinstein, Cosby, etc. The Joker is a psychopathic narcissist who's incapable of caring for anyone but himself. Harley is just a plaything to him, and the tragedy of Harley is that she mistakes that for true love.

The relationship between Leto's Joker and Robbie's Harley is psychologically destructive to the nth degree, but it's not the demeaning and one-sided "abuse fest" as portrayed in other mediums, which is why there's more narrative ground to be mined in it.

It's very much a severe case of Stockholm Syndrome, but with the twisted devotion going both ways instead of just from the abusee to the abuser.
 
There's no fucking way Suicide Squad's Joker "genuinely loves" Harley. He's devoted to her... as his dog, his object, his property.
 
I was skeptical back when one standalone Joker movie was happening, but now that two separate ones are apparently in the works I'm taking that as confirmation that neither will actually happen. :p

Also, could we stop romanticizing a clearly abusive and manipulative relationship?
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I'm starting to wonder if Scorcese was really interested in doing an actual "Joker" movie to start with or if he just wanted to do a Psychotic Gangster film and figured he could hijack the Joker character to do that and gain an built-in fandom. That's why he wanted to use his own actor instead of working with Leto and the DCEU...he didn't want to have to "play by the rules" and have whatever story he was thinking be a part of a larger Universe.

Seems to be a problem with "Auteur" directors. They don't want to have to play with others. Edgar Wright had the same problems because he didn't want to work by the MCU's release schedule and kept sitting on his hands and then didn't want his Ant-Man movie to be linked to the MCU at all.
 
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First Affleck was made a producer

Then Margot Robbie is apparently a producer on a Harley spinoff and a Gotham Siren's movie

Now Leto?

Is WB that desperate to keep the talent incase they run away?


Even aside from how underwhelming I found Leto as the Joker (or as the guy in Blade Runner 2049, for that matter), I don't know if it's a good idea to build a movie around the Joker. He's the quintessential villain, the unstoppable antagonist for the hero to fight. What can you really do with him as a solo character? Just show him being evil and killing a bunch of people? Where's the story?

Depending on what adaptation or origin alot can be done before he becomes the Joker

Martin Scorcese(if true) could do wonders with the mobster side of things and struggling family man aspect.

Just adapt "The Killing Joke"

It would be very tragic to see this man turn into the Joker

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I actually liked Leto's Joker, but even I don't really think he'd work as a movie's lead.
I think at this point DC/WB must just have a big dart board with all of the DC characters on it, and when they throw a dart they announce that the character it hit will be getting a movie.
If they were going to do a spin-off based on one of the Suicide Squad characters besides Harley, I would have much rather gotten Deadshot.
 
t this point DC/WB must just have a big dart board with all of the DC characters on it, and when they throw a dart they announce

To be fair, none of these are officially announced, it's all "inside sources tell us..."
 
directe3d by someone who has only done mediocre horror sequels, at least.

You know who else was an obscure horror director before jumping into big-time tentpole films? Peter Jackson! Now, I don't have any interest in Jackson's horror work (except for maybe The Frighteners, more for Michael J. Fox than anything else), but Jackson's Lord of the Rings trilogy is a masterpiece. There's also not a lot on Sam Raimi's pre-Spider-Man resume to indicate that he would be a great comic book movie director. Heck, Thor is my favorite Marvel movie and who would have figured that Kenneth "Shakespeare-guy" Branagh had the action chops to pull that off. So I tend to keep an open mind about these sorts of things.

And Superman III and Supergirl are far purer distillations of Silver Age DC storytelling style and its unapologetic goofiness, and actually work pretty well if you approach them with that mindset.

Ahhhh, Superman III. You know, I used to have Richard Pryor's "I just came directly from the Pentagon" speech memorized and could recite it on cue. ... I don't know why I did that... :shrug:

Spielberg is one of my favorite directors so I'm thrilled he's doing a DC movie, but I'm a little disappointed he's going with a group of characters I'm not familiar with. I would have loved to see what he could have done with a character like Superman, The Flash, or Green Lantern.

I think Spielberg is on the right track. Frankly, Batman & Superman have been done to death and I don't really have much interest in the other upper-tier DC characters like Aquaman, Cyborg, the Flash, Green Lantern, Hawkman, Martian Manhunter, Power Girl, etc. I'm not a big comic book reader but the DC properties that tend to interest me (at least from a concept and/or design aspect) tend to be a little bit deeper cuts. I'd rather see movies about Swamp Thing, Zatanna, or Amethyst, Princess of Gemworld.

I'd definitely watch an Old Batman movie starring Keaton (and directed by Tim Burton!)

Agreed! At least about Keaton. I'm not sure about Burton. I haven't really been impressed by anything that he's done since Big Fish. (Granted, I haven't yet seen Big Eyes or Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children.)

You know what would be funny? If Ben Affleck directed a Batman movie with Michael Keaton. Affleck directing & starring in a Batman movie at the same time was never going to happen. Directing a movie of that scale is a herculean effort on its own. If he tried starring in it at the same time, he'd be dead within a week! But I'd still like to see Affleck direct a superhero movie. If he were going to direct a Batman movie, might as well have him work with the best.

BTW, I'm really glad that Jake Gyllenhaal shot down those rumors of him playing Batman. I never liked that idea. I've said it before, but I think that, if they can't get Affleck (or Keaton) back, they should just leave the character alone for a little while and develop the rest of the DC universe, including extended members of the Bat-family if they must.

And the Rock's Black Adam???? Seems like a mess that he was excluded from. Shazam (unless it is a teaser final scene, and the Black Adam movie shows his origin and a battle with Shazam)

Agreed. I mean, Black Adam is traditionally a VILLAIN. Granted, our modern pop-culture often tends to take popular villains and soften them into heroes(ish), i.e. Harley Quinn, Loki, Venom, Spike from Buffy the Vampire Slayer, etc. Heck, that's the entire premise of Suicide Squad. But I'm not sure how you make Black Adam a hero without first establishing him as a villain. (Maybe the Venom movie will show us a blueprint for that but frankly it looks terrible.)

How far along are they on Suicide Squad 2?

Last I heard, they were going to start shooting it this fall. They were going to do it sooner but it got pushed back because of Will Smith's schedule on other movies like Aladdin and Gemini Man. And now I'm not sure if it's going to get further derailed thanks to Margot Robbie doing Birds of Prey instead. (And can someone please explain to me how it makes any damn sense that the Harley Quinn spin-off is turning into Birds of Prey instead of Gotham City Sirens?!?!)

Is this just to keep Leto happy?! Because I remember him being pretty pissed when Scorsese's Joker origin movie was announced.

I don't see why Warner Bros. would feel quite so obligated to keep Leto happy. It's not like he's an integral part of what they're doing. I mean, I don't think he really needs to be in Suicide Squad II, it's been ages since we've heard anything about the Joker/Harley Quinn movie, and I thought I heard stuff about how Margot Robbie never wanted to work with him again anyway. Personally, I love Leto's version of the Joker and I kinda want him to show up in The Batman but I don't think he's irreplaceable.

I'm starting to wonder if Scorcese was really interested in doing an actual "Joker" movie to start with or if he just wanted to do a Psychotic Gangster film and figured he could hijack the Joker character to do that and gain an built-in fandom. That's why he wanted to use his own actor instead of working with Leto and the DCEU...he didn't want to have to "play by the rules" and have whatever story he was thinking be a part of a larger Universe.

Firstly, Scorsese doesn't need to hijack any built-in fandom to make a gangster movie. Martin Scorsese gangster movies command their own fandom.

Secondly, has Scorsese even gone on the record about his involvement with this movie, like, at all? Maybe it's more a matter of Todd Phillips really wants to make a Joker movie but DC isn't really interested in working with the Hangover guy, so he's puffing up the project by involving Scorsese's name. (Reminds me of the 1996 Doctor Who movie where Steven Spielberg was involved as a producer during the very early stages, bailed because he didn't like any of the scripts, and the remaining producers hid that fact from FOX, Universal, & everyone else for as long as they could.)

Seems to be a problem with "Auteur" directors. They don't want to have to play with others. Edgar Wright had the same problems because he didn't want to work by the MCU's release schedule and kept sitting on his hands and then didn't want his Ant-Man movie to be linked to the MCU at all.

Have we ever gotten the skinny on what about Wright's Ant-Man would have been different from the movie we got?
 
So apparently Aquaman is opening up around the same time as Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse, Transformers: Bumblebee, Mortal Engines, and Mary Poppins Returns. There definitely isn't room for all those films to succeed. Though another flop for the DCEU after JL can't be good.

Cheering for Spider-man and Bumblebee though.
 
There's no fucking way Suicide Squad's Joker "genuinely loves" Harley. He's devoted to her... as his dog, his object, his property.

You must've watched a completely different movie than I did, because the reciprocal love in the Joker/Harley relationship - f-ed up though it is - is blatantly obvious.

We can debate whether or not it was a good idea for the film to make that relationship one of reciprocal love, but that is the direction in which they went.
 
Right, because that went so well the first time they did it...




Was that a tragic story? Hell, yes. Could Jared Leto do it justice? I profoundly doubt it.

What was the first time they did "The Killing Joke" ?



So apparently Aquaman is opening up around the same time as Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse, Transformers: Bumblebee, Mortal Engines, and Mary Poppins Returns. There definitely isn't room for all those films to succeed. Though another flop for the DCEU after JL can't be good.

Cheering for Spider-man and Bumblebee though.


I think Mary Poppins Return will be the big winner. Aquaman and Bumblebee will tie for second place.

Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse will do okay in third place.

I have no confidence in "Mortal Engines" From the trailer it looks very cliche.
 
The animated movie.

I actually watched that for the first time recently, and the first half hour is not just problematic in the way it portrays Barbara Gordon, it also simply sucked. It had nothing, absolutely nothing to do with the rest of the movie. With the Joker being the big star of the movie, it's mind-boggling that he isn't even mentioned until a third of the movie is over. I actually re-wrote a better first act in my head while I was watching the actual first act.
 
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