Sure. And in the future they might design starships in art deco style.
USS Enterprise (eventually) on Discovery?
- Thread starter EJD1984
- Start date
The TMP novelisation (TOS was itself a fictionalised account of Kirk's real missions) and the "refit" of the ship into a shape that is generally similar but actually every single thing is changed from the inside out. Also the Trials and Tribble-ations model and the CGI in Enterprise - which are more detailed than the original 11 footer, with panel lines etc.
Remember the days of letterboxing? You didn't know anybody who said "what are these black bars for?"
That's the type of media consumers that are out there.I've even worked retail and seen a case where someone had returned a DVD for being in widescreen. Yeah, really.
Yet there's a loud, grumpy contingent of fans (who would supposedly be the ones swayed by the "fanwank" that's supposedly) who are raging with popped-out veins over the aesthetic changes made to their precious Star Trek.
Kinda pokes holes in the whole "this series only appeals to hardcore fans" argument, no?
Exactly. Fanwank is season four of Enterprise - stories highly dependent on continuity, drawing heavily from previous episodes, and invoking nostalgia in viewers.
DIS doesn't really do this.
Yup. It also seems to me that the same people that say Enterprise really started getting good in the last season are the same people that will take hot steaming dumps on Discovery.
Clearly, Discovery cannot be as fanwanky as some would suggest, otherwise the canonistas wouldn't be so up in arms.
How do you make your font size larger? I've always wanted to do this. Please tell me!I'm sorry, but you are COMPLETELY wrong. Its first most important function is to RESPECT CANON! And by that I mean align to whatever I personally consider canon (Axanar), disregard anything I don't (DSC), despite what the actual stewards of the franchise say is canon. To do otherwise is violating the HISTORY of Star Trek. Because fiction can have a set in stone history, right? See. If after meeting the requirement outlined above, and not ever contradicting a one-off line spoken 52 years ago, THEN if it manages to entertain, we're in business.
And the VW bug(incredibly popular. Totally retro) as well as the thunderbird and those Chevy trucks/SUV's that I don't know name of. I would go so far as to say that these cars have been very influential on the last few years of auto design.
@Mirror Mirror
Knock, knock.
Honestly? It does it all, but worse.
The appeal of the Mirror Universe - a premise that this late in the day makes no logical or narrative sense more sophisticated than a 1963 Superman comic book - is 100 percent fanwank. Vulcans with beards! We must have a familar Vulcan with a beard! Also, women who are depraved perverts by way of being both powerful and bixesual...or really, just sexual.
Trekkies love the MU almost as much as they love the Pavlovian stimulus of the Courage fanfare...maybe only a little more than they love hearing that shields are down to 40 percent.
I need to reread that novel. There are apparently a lot of interesting bits that showcase GR's attitude about TOS.
"Discovery is terrible because it changes thing!"
"Discovery is terrible because it doesn't change enough!"
Which one is it?
Whichever one works for the person trying to rationalize their dislike, apparently.
"TFA" was too much of a re-hash! ARGGRHRHRHHHHHGGGHHH!!!!! TEH SUX!!!!
"TLJ" was waaaay too different! NOT MY STAR WARS! EEGGHGHHHH!!! #FANRAGE!!!!
Sound familiar?
Nah, the peculiar inanity of this show is that it's entirely pitched to the existing fan base at the same time it's finding new ways every week to piss parts of that fan base off.
Of course, Enterprise did the same thing. These later productions all suffer from the Roger Debris effect.
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I knew I had heard it before!
It's not possible. They're not even trying, just like the D-7. Just like the Klingons all being bald, having more ridges than ever and ignoring the Augment Virus. Just like the 3D holograms while Pike's original ship had a paper printer.Yeah, it's never been implied in canon, we just have some behind the scenes quote from Roddenberry regarding TMP.
So anyway, for those of us who follow the old definition of canon, as canon stands now, the ship goes through three refits.
This ship in 2254:
Becomes this by 2256:
Then becomes this by 2266:
Then finally becomes this in 2270:
I guess it's possible. I just wish they had kept the nacelle pylons straight, then it would have been pretty much perfectly acceptable with a bit of head justification. As it stands now, they replaced the entire warp engines twice, with the second refit going back to straight pylons.
In the Discoveryverse, this is how the D7 battlecruiser, the Klingons and the USS Enterprise always looked. in TOS, they were different.
I think it does have visable weapon ports
Prime Universe.
Just because something looks different, doesn't make it a separate universe. Visuals are the cover, the story is the important part. As long as the Visuals don't alter the story they're fine.
Prime Universe.
Just because something looks different, doesn't make it a separate universe. Visuals are the cover, the story is the important part. As long as the Visuals don't alter the story they're fine.
The sizes of the ships has been altered also, which would have a huge in-universe impact and makes it impossible to reconcile them. The city of Paris is totally different, which would make any story where someone had to traverse it entirely different. I've already debated with everyone to death the holographic technology issues.
There's no chance they'll be able to do another Star Trek Encyclopedia without having to segregate Discovery entries in the same manner they have the Kelvin universe ones. Ergo, not the same world.
At the very least, you have to acknowledge that it's an understandable position to take.
Except for the Kelvin Universe they've clearly said it *is* an alternate timeline/universe.
CBS has said that this is the prime universe, therefore this is how the Enterprise looked, at least at this point in time. If Discovery has enough seasons to the point where it either flows into TOS or even mildly overlaps it and the Enterprise still looks that way..then that's how the Enterprise looked then in canon.
Your refusal to accept it doesn't change the fact that what CBS says, goes..it just means your opinion doesn't reflect the "official history" as it were.
G
Gonzo
Guest
They could have tweaked the D7 like they did the Enterprise and it could have been amazing.
Would love to have been a fly on the wall when it was all being discussed and decided upon and exactly what the reasons were.
Sounds almost like you're saying TOS isn't the Prime Universe
My standpoint isn't that CBS won't always say it's prime and market it as such (I did a poll months ago, 10% of whom said they'd cancel their subscriptions if the TPTB said it wasn't prime, and they want to keep every subscriber they can get), just that common sense says it obviously "really" isn't.
G
Gonzo
Guest
I think they are just going to play it safe and not say anything further about it.Sounds almost like you're saying TOS isn't the Prime Universe
My standpoint isn't that CBS won't always say it's prime and market it as such (I did a poll months ago, 10% of whom said they'd cancel their subscriptions if the TPTB said it wasn't prime, and they want to keep every subscriber they can get), just that common sense says it obviously "really" isn't.
I would have been happier with ENT if the season 4 fanwank was spread out over the entire run. It was too much for one season.
DISCO is guilty of fanwank. The list of captains Saru looked up is entire fanwank. The Enterprise showing up is fanwank. The mirror universe episodes and Defiant were fanwank. Having Sarek being an essential character is fanwank, along with having Michael be Sarek's ward and Spock's foster sister. Tribbles, Gorn skeletons, Harry Mudd... all fanwank.
TNG and VOY both went 7 seasons without going to the Mirror Universe.
OK, maybe it's not all "fanwank." Maybe fanwank is more a threshold. It's seasoning, like salt. Too little and the series is bland. Too much and it's unpalatable. Us fans like, appreciate, and have come to expect nods and tie-ins to what has come before.
DISCO is guilty of fanwank. The list of captains Saru looked up is entire fanwank. The Enterprise showing up is fanwank. The mirror universe episodes and Defiant were fanwank. Having Sarek being an essential character is fanwank, along with having Michael be Sarek's ward and Spock's foster sister. Tribbles, Gorn skeletons, Harry Mudd... all fanwank.
TNG and VOY both went 7 seasons without going to the Mirror Universe.
OK, maybe it's not all "fanwank." Maybe fanwank is more a threshold. It's seasoning, like salt. Too little and the series is bland. Too much and it's unpalatable. Us fans like, appreciate, and have come to expect nods and tie-ins to what has come before.
The more I read through the last few pages of this thread, the harder it's become to resist posting this (and so I'm not anymore) re the word "fanwank":
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