Same, it only looks good if viewed a few ways. I never understood what people saw in it.
USS Enterprise (eventually) on Discovery?
- Thread starter EJD1984
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Same, it only looks good if viewed a few ways. I never understood what people saw in it.
@Mirror Mirror is right. Gender-swapping Kirk would completely change TOS on a fundamental level.
Ugliest ship in the fleet far and away.
There have been extensive (and fascinating!) discussions of this in the Trek Tech subforum, going back years! There have never been authoritative cutaways of the Enterprise interiors, so there's lots of room for speculation about just what exactly fits in where and how.
It's from a SciPub magazine from 1995, and commissioned with TNG in its heyday. Website can be found here.
There's also been a Dragon Models cutaway. So, some interesting details could be seen. Not sure how much more authoritative is desired but it might answer some details:
Well, the thing is, anything like that is a licensed product, and hence unavoidably (gaak, here's that word) non-canonical.
As licensed products go, the first and arguably the most carefully thought-out crack at detailing the Enterprise interiors was obviously the Franz Joseph blueprints in the 1970s... but there are reasons to be skeptical about those, among others the frankly puny deck heights they would entail.
If the goal is to envision the ship's layout in a way that accommodates everything we actually saw of the interiors, it's frankly a herculean task, and it's never really been done (although some fan efforts come impressively close).
To name just one obvious conundrum: do the significant differences between the engine room seen in S1, and the one seen in S2-3, signify an unmentioned refit, or actual different engine rooms in different locations on the ship?
As licensed products go, the first and arguably the most carefully thought-out crack at detailing the Enterprise interiors was obviously the Franz Joseph blueprints in the 1970s... but there are reasons to be skeptical about those, among others the frankly puny deck heights they would entail.
If the goal is to envision the ship's layout in a way that accommodates everything we actually saw of the interiors, it's frankly a herculean task, and it's never really been done (although some fan efforts come impressively close).
To name just one obvious conundrum: do the significant differences between the engine room seen in S1, and the one seen in S2-3, signify an unmentioned refit, or actual different engine rooms in different locations on the ship?
Does it matter? In some versions, the Enterprise has swapable modules, depending on mission configuration.
Even if there was a "canonical" layout, there would still be argument over deck size, spacing and the like.
Still better than the Galaxy class.
I've seen loads of TOS cutaways in my time, all of which put engineering in a different place. One as recent as the Art Asylum TOS Enterprise model box in the 2000's had engineering at the back of the saucer, and the thing in the middle of the room was the very tip of the warp core which ran down the neck.
Even official cutaways can't decide. It really was a terrible example
On-screen, Franz Joseph's blueprints appeared in movies I-III (a deck 7 cutaway showing TOS engineering at the rear of the saucer was a permanent fixture of the damage and repair console) and a less detailed version of Doug Drexler's cutaway appeared in "In a Mirror, Darkly" and they put it on deck 19, ahead of the shuttlebay.
And an inaccurate cutaway also appeared on the TOS bridge turbolift alcove, but that was based on an earlier ship scale before the series proper (and extra windows and a new bridge module)
This is again 'because I say so' style of argument you keep using. Events would not change.
After seeing how They've changed the TOS Enterprise for this show, I've decided for the sake of my own 'head-canon' (and in order to get this show to fit in the grand scheme of things in my mind) all the stuff depicted in the "ENTERPRISE" series has somehow "slightly altered" the Original Series Technology and created a new Trek Universe leading to "Discovery".
(I like the look mostly, Klingon stuff being somewhat of an exception)
For me, the event's in "Broken Bow" are going to be the starting point of this change and even though things play out "almost" exactly as they were shown in TOS, somehow because of the Temporal Cold War, Federation Technology was sped up and this is why "Discovery" is visually different.
Unfortunately TOS has become the "outlier" and even though that's pretty sad, it's the only way I can reasonably explain all the visual changes "in universe" with this series.
I have enjoyed this show so far, but it's very obvious to me that it is never going to 'exactly' lead to the original series I watched as a kid back in the 60's.
(no matter what the Producers say)
And I guess, that's OK since I have no control over it anyway.
<shrug>
(I like the look mostly, Klingon stuff being somewhat of an exception)
For me, the event's in "Broken Bow" are going to be the starting point of this change and even though things play out "almost" exactly as they were shown in TOS, somehow because of the Temporal Cold War, Federation Technology was sped up and this is why "Discovery" is visually different.
Unfortunately TOS has become the "outlier" and even though that's pretty sad, it's the only way I can reasonably explain all the visual changes "in universe" with this series.
I have enjoyed this show so far, but it's very obvious to me that it is never going to 'exactly' lead to the original series I watched as a kid back in the 60's.
(no matter what the Producers say)
And I guess, that's OK since I have no control over it anyway.
<shrug>
I'm not sure what your point is. Drexler's diagram is canon in In a Mirror, Darkly, Part II, and that places main engineering in the secondary hull, aka the engineering hull. This was discussed upthread.
Well Doug Drexler's plans (which according to M-A appeared in 'IAMD') had that as engineering. Those tubes in the back cross each other and go up the nacelles.
But that's technically a retcon.
Here's the scene:
http://ent.trekcore.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=96&page=9
It doesn't get more authoritative than that. Of course, technically, it only applies to the Defiant. But gimme a break....
ENT's Temporal War reached back to WWII and had alien Nazis in the White House, and it was implied that agents across all major worlds were staging similar alterations. That Discovery may depict the heavily damaged remains of the TOS timeline is quite appealing. There's also a madman in the Delta Quadrant with an infinite delete ray, crazy Captain Braxton, angry future Romulans, bitter Borg Queens and god-knows-what-else terrorizing the timeline.
It's Prime, but it's not the Prime we watched for 50 years. Which means essentially, it's a reboot.
Works for me.
The Burnham timeline. 
I prefer to call it the Grimdark Bluniverse, but that works tooThe Burnham timeline.
DISCOverse, here.
"Does it matter" in what sense? This whole discussion tangent began with Cooleddie73 and Noname Given debating the location of the engine room on the original Enterprise. In that particular context, whether we saw just one room or more than one definitely matters.
Drexel's diagram is not a clear and detailed orthographic projection nor a blueprint. It's mostly just an inscrutable brightly-colored mishmash — certainly at the resolution seen on screen in ENT, and frankly even close-up on the internet. To the extent that it's "canon," that's merely because it was something they had available to use when the episode was made, much like various other incomplete or inaccurate cutaways used in other episodes over the years, as King Daniel Beyond has already mentioned. If you think it answers the question of engine room placement, answer this: how does it resolve the issue I mentioned regarding the S! vs. S2-3 engine room(s)?
Yeah, I've long suspected Trek continuity has undergone this kind of "subtle" shift more than once, actually. (Between STIV:TVH and the beginning of TNG, for instance.) I keep meaning to post a thread about this in the "General Trek Discussion" forum one of these days...
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