It’s meant to be a small vessel.
Unseen TOS....
- Thread starter Warped9
- Start date
I'm not quite done with the Antares yet, but in the interim some thoughts on the Thasian ship that come to reclaim Charlie Evans?
The Thasian appeared on the bridge as most likely a projection that humans could relate to, unless we assume ancient Thasians also looked human. Or maybe they were just accustomed to assuming that image when communicating with Charlie. If we go by what is said in the episode we know that a number of surveys have never found any Thasians despite stories they do indeed exist there on their planet. We know Thasians do exist because they gave Charlie his powers so he could survive. We can suspect that although they might once have had corporeal form they apparently no longer do, OR they do retain corporeal form and they simply choose not to be seen or to interact directly with other lifeforms. Charlie says he "can't even touch them" so that supports no one actually sees a Thasian in the flesh, but only as a projection or maybe even just a voice or through telepathic communication.
Which leads us to their their ship which appears on the viewscreen as a ovoid glow of light. The question is: are the Thasians disguising the true form of their ship or is the ship merely another projected image as yet another way of staying out of sight from other lifeforms?
In the real world putting a glow of light on the screen was quicker and cheaper than actually making a miniature. And it added to the established mystery of the Thasians themselves. It does work as is but, of course, we all might wonder what a Thasian ship could look like. I'm thinking I really don't want to ruin that sense of mystery by coming up with something meh. If beings are so advanced then what could their spaceships possibly look like?
I'm thinking maybe just building on or enhancing the existent basic idea: a glowing ovoid of light with perhaps a little more definite edge to it and maybe a slight hint of detail.
The Thasian appeared on the bridge as most likely a projection that humans could relate to, unless we assume ancient Thasians also looked human. Or maybe they were just accustomed to assuming that image when communicating with Charlie. If we go by what is said in the episode we know that a number of surveys have never found any Thasians despite stories they do indeed exist there on their planet. We know Thasians do exist because they gave Charlie his powers so he could survive. We can suspect that although they might once have had corporeal form they apparently no longer do, OR they do retain corporeal form and they simply choose not to be seen or to interact directly with other lifeforms. Charlie says he "can't even touch them" so that supports no one actually sees a Thasian in the flesh, but only as a projection or maybe even just a voice or through telepathic communication.
Which leads us to their their ship which appears on the viewscreen as a ovoid glow of light. The question is: are the Thasians disguising the true form of their ship or is the ship merely another projected image as yet another way of staying out of sight from other lifeforms?
In the real world putting a glow of light on the screen was quicker and cheaper than actually making a miniature. And it added to the established mystery of the Thasians themselves. It does work as is but, of course, we all might wonder what a Thasian ship could look like. I'm thinking I really don't want to ruin that sense of mystery by coming up with something meh. If beings are so advanced then what could their spaceships possibly look like?
I'm thinking maybe just building on or enhancing the existent basic idea: a glowing ovoid of light with perhaps a little more definite edge to it and maybe a slight hint of detail.
The method of arrival is unusual: the ship just appears, and not totally in the flesh, either. We may choose to believe in cloaking technology. Or in Charlie desperately trying to obscure the heroes' vision till the very last. But we could also choose to believe in a vessel that doesn't move across space in any conventional fashion, and instead simply is there when needed.
Possibly a design that gives no hint of motion, then? No bow or stern, no engines, or perhaps plenty of apparent engines that all point inward, like a giant floating green coronavirus?
Timo Saloniemi
Possibly a design that gives no hint of motion, then? No bow or stern, no engines, or perhaps plenty of apparent engines that all point inward, like a giant floating green coronavirus?
Timo Saloniemi
Interesting tidbit. As I was sketching out concepts I had one I quite liked, but ultimately discarded because from certain angles it echoed Wah Chang’s Romulan Bird of Prey even with nacelles spouting upward rather than outward from the sides even without the “wings.” In some respects it was a bit more elegant looking than the direction I finally took which perhaps was another reason to pass on it. That said conceptually it could serve as the basis for another class of ship—no reason to think there is only one type of merchant design in the TOS universe.
Here we go. I'm looking at perhaps a few small finishing touches, but the objective is to have something that could be convincing as a TOS design.
There are no lights on this model. Everything is painted on as if were to be an actual physical miniature. It could appear onscreen as a long shot as seen on the Enterprise's main viewscreen or perhaps even in the same frame as the Enterprise similar to what was done with the Botany Bay.
I really dig this design, but I do have a quibble. As someone who has built models from wood and plastic and read a lot about the construction of the hero model, I bet Wah Chang or Richard Datin wouldn't like the copper dish in that location.
The model would likely be about four feet long, made mostly of wood and possibly some found objects. The front hull would probably be built from a curved sheet of thin plywood and would be more trouble than it's worth to quickly cut a hole to accept the cylinder shape and adapting a turned wood cylinder to fit around that leading edge really wouldn't be worth the effort.
I would suggest that the lower bulge would be made of a solid block of pine being carved to shape, giving both a solid place to fit a mounting stand to, as well as just being an easy material to work. Also, It would be easy to grab a hole cutting saw (like used for cutting the hole for a doorknob) and bore out a socket in the front end of this structure and mount the cylinder there. This would also reflect the design of the Enterprise model, thus tying the two ships together as being built by the same service.
As for the cylinder itself, I can imagine someone being tempted by the ribbed texture of a soup can rather than taking the time to turn one down from a block. But maybe not.
That's my only suggestion. Other than that, it's perfect!
--Alex
I did think about putting the deflector dish on the large pod underneath, but then I thought about modifying the miniature later by removing everything under the ship to be replaced by something else and I’d be missing a deflector.
The deflector on the bow also makes the design a touch less elegant and somewhat more utilitarian looking.
The deflector on the bow also makes the design a touch less elegant and somewhat more utilitarian looking.
In re: the Thasian ship;
The ship itself may not even be a ship as we know them. It could be a Thasian, or small group of them, just flying out after the Enterprise to retrieve Charlie. We are never told just how powerful the Thasians really are.
The ship itself may not even be a ship as we know them. It could be a Thasian, or small group of them, just flying out after the Enterprise to retrieve Charlie. We are never told just how powerful the Thasians really are.
In contrast with all the problems I had with TOS-R, I thought their Thasian ship was just right.
I always thought it was silly that TOS-R made some sort of structure to an incorporeal ship. Why?
Okay. Which suggests to me there could be some sort of cloaking tech going on. The sensors are detecting something, and that something is visible to the naked eye (or at least the imaging sensors), but it’s not registering on other systems. It sounds similar to what would happen later in “Balance Of Terror.”
So the choice of using a glowing halo of light was not just a quick and inexpensive shortcut to depicting an alien vessel, but a deliberate choice to enhance the mystery of the Thasians.
To that end it seems rather pointless to work up something to “fix” or fill in a blank TOS already addressed sufficiently.
That being the case I’ll add my little tweaks to the Antares…and start thinking about Leo Walsh’s Class J cargo ship.
And after seeing TOS-R’s take on it I’m not impressed.
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Here we go. I'm looking at perhaps a few small finishing touches, but the objective is to have something that could be convincing as a TOS design.
There are no lights on this model. Everything is painted on as if were to be an actual physical miniature. It could appear onscreen as a long shot as seen on the Enterprise's main viewscreen or perhaps even in the same frame as the Enterprise similar to what was done with the Botany Bay.
This is absolutely inspired work.
One thought crossed my mind just now, and it’s a very minor detail. I picture a very harried Wah Chang or Richard Datin slapping this model together at the eleventh hour. Do you think two sizes of registry lettering would be something that would pass the “late and over budget” test? What if you use the same size of lettering on the nacelles as you used on the bow for the registry, and omit the red stripe? It’d be “one less thing” for the hypothetical harried model maker, and the upsized lettering would tie in nicely with Jefferies’ aviation inspirations (big ID letters on the sides of aircraft).
Re: Class J cargo ship Harry Mudd commandeers then loses in trying to escape the Enterprise.
If I recall correctly Spock says the ship is a small cargo ship. On the bridge main viewscreen the ship appears as a distorted or lopsided oval. Do we take what we see onscreen as a starting point or start from scratch? I believe they also say the ship is at extreme range so that can explain not getting a clear look at it.
If I were retconning you could simply use the TAS design of Cyrano Jones’ ship. But we’re pretending it’s still 1966 and TAS is still several years in the future.
If they’re in deep space then Mudd’s ship has to be warp capable. The Fesarius establishes warp capable ships don’t have to have nacelles. Later the Klingon ship will establish nacelles don’t have to be cylindrical. Something to keep in the back of my mind. The Antares has cylindrical nacelles because it’s a Starfleet vessel. The Valiant had space warp rings because it was meant to convey early FTL technology.
If possible I’d like the Class J cargo ship to have a faintly ovoid shape at least in rear elevation to gel with what we presently see onscreen, realizing of course they were making do with what they had back in the day.
If I recall correctly Spock says the ship is a small cargo ship. On the bridge main viewscreen the ship appears as a distorted or lopsided oval. Do we take what we see onscreen as a starting point or start from scratch? I believe they also say the ship is at extreme range so that can explain not getting a clear look at it.
If I were retconning you could simply use the TAS design of Cyrano Jones’ ship. But we’re pretending it’s still 1966 and TAS is still several years in the future.
If they’re in deep space then Mudd’s ship has to be warp capable. The Fesarius establishes warp capable ships don’t have to have nacelles. Later the Klingon ship will establish nacelles don’t have to be cylindrical. Something to keep in the back of my mind. The Antares has cylindrical nacelles because it’s a Starfleet vessel. The Valiant had space warp rings because it was meant to convey early FTL technology.
If possible I’d like the Class J cargo ship to have a faintly ovoid shape at least in rear elevation to gel with what we presently see onscreen, realizing of course they were making do with what they had back in the day.
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I have been giving that some thought as a starting point. I am beginning to have an idea that I’m turning over in my head.
Interesting, looks like a smaller version of the Antares designed above. Perhaps built by the same company, just for civilians, and maybe not as modular as your idea for modifying that Antares design for later ships?First idea.
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