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"Uh'll be back." - Another Terminator for Arnie

Robert Maxwell said:
Myasishchev said:
Deckerd said:
It might be silly but the idea of a robot not realising it's a robot and then taking on big nasty mean robots is so cool I forgive its silliness. It reminds me of something... no, it's gone, like tears in rain.
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The underlying idea was pretty all right.

But addressed to all: T3 rocked socks, damn it. I really don't understand why it was disliked.
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I really enjoyed T3. I'm not sure why it gets so much flak. It didn't do anything really novel with the franchise but it was a lot of fun and the ending really sold it. I think some people don't like it because it basically pulls the rug out from under the end of T2, which is a fair criticism, but I try to take each film as its own entity.

Salvation had some good idea but the narrative structure was bizarre and senseless. It was supposed to be about Marcus Wright, but getting Bale as Connor reshaped the whole story and turned it into something else entirely. I think it could've worked if it was meant to be mostly about Wright, mostly about Connor, or mostly about Reese, but trying to make it about all three of them just made for a muddled mess. Reese was the only one that seemed like a real character, and his significance to the story was primarily as a plot device! Connor was bland and uninteresting, as a character, and Marcus just seemed confused through the whole movie. :lol:
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I've said it before and I'll say it again. Connor was so unsympathetic in that movie that I was shouting 'you're killing the wrong guy' by the end. I understand he was supposed to be hard-nosed and tough but making him an arsehole was a step too far.
 
Call me skeptical, but I think Judgment Day would have made for a good "2012" movie. But then my standards aren't very high when it comes to that sort of thing.
 
Despite it's reputedly greater popularity, I had a "meh" reaction to T2 as well.

While T2 does have something to say beyond T1, in the realistic nuclear holocaust imagery, in the idea that Ahnald can be reprogrammed to be good, and in that clubbing mental health professionals can be really, really fun, its climactic structure mirrored that of the first film so much (assembly line versus steel mill) that to me it felt like T1 again but with a bigger budget.

I agree with the coolness of T1. It's a science fiction milestone that has influenced my thinking, although really in about the same way that Frankenstein should.

Of course, no discussion of the coolness of The Terminator can be complete without mention of Ellison's lawsuit, can it? Just from having watched The Outer Limits: Soldier, I agree that there is a similarity there. Whether it constitutes grounds for a lawsuit, or whether there were other relevant factors, I don't know. I find less of a similarity with Demon with a Glass Hand. Due to the gag order, of course I don't know any of the real details, including whether similarity to Demon was actually alleged. However, in my opinion, the man versus machine theme, which is a central part of the Terminator story, was not derived from either of those Outer Limits episodes.

Edited to add: According to http://jamescameron.blogspot.com/2010/12/harlan-ellisons-terminator-lawsuit.html, no lawsuit was ever actually filed. It was only contemplated.
 
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I will see this if only to watch Arnie ham it up again. I don't care if it is groundbreaking or even that good. The first was a good film. After that, they were silly adventure movies of progressively diminishing quality. Sort of like The Planet of the Apes.
 
Robert Maxwell said:
Myasishchev said:
Deckerd said:
It might be silly but the idea of a robot not realising it's a robot and then taking on big nasty mean robots is so cool I forgive its silliness. It reminds me of something... no, it's gone, like tears in rain.
Click to expand...
The underlying idea was pretty all right.

But addressed to all: T3 rocked socks, damn it. I really don't understand why it was disliked.
Click to expand...

I really enjoyed T3. I'm not sure why it gets so much flak. It didn't do anything really novel with the franchise but it was a lot of fun and the ending really sold it. I think some people don't like it because it basically pulls the rug out from under the end of T2, which is a fair criticism, but I try to take each film as its own entity.
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I used to enjoy Terminator 3 the first few times I saw it, and I even own the DVD (though I can't remember the last time I pulled it out). I came across it on TV a few months ago, though, and holy God, I thought it was execrable. Just a low-rent remake of Judgment Day with a slightly creative ending.

What I also don't get is why they paid Nick Stahl to play the person that Edward Furlong is in real life. I, for one, would be rather convinced by Furlong playing a guy who steals drugs from vet clinics.
 
After "Salvation"? Fuck yes, I'm happy he's going to return.

T3 has grown on me over the years. My only real problem with it anymore is the horrible casting of pretty much everyone but Arnold.

Welcome back, old friend.
 
The horrible casting was one of my major problems with the movie too. Nick Stahl was just horrible.
 
Robert Maxwell said:
I really enjoyed T3. I'm not sure why it gets so much flak. It didn't do anything really novel with the franchise but it was a lot of fun and the ending really sold it. I think some people don't like it because it basically pulls the rug out from under the end of T2, which is a fair criticism, but I try to take each film as its own entity.
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That's exactly the point, T3 basically pissed all over T2, which in my opinion effectively ended the story. That, plus the fact that T3 was basically an (inferior) remake of T2 didn't help it much.

That said, T3 wasn't THAT bad. At least it wasn't the waste of time that Salvation was.
 
Timby said:
What I also don't get is why they paid Nick Stahl to play the person that Edward Furlong is in real life. I, for one, would be rather convinced by Furlong playing a guy who steals drugs from vet clinics.
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You really don't see the danger in hinging the success of a hundred-plus million-dollar effort on someone with known drugs and police problems? Come now.

And Stahl was excellent, the best Connor performance so far, though young Furlong did very well also.
 
CorporalCaptain said:
Whether it constitutes grounds for a lawsuit, or whether there were other relevant factors, I don't know. I find less of a similarity with Demon with a Glass Hand.
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Cameron supposedly did some boasting to a reporter on set about "just lifting some stuff from 'Outer Limits'" that had an impact on the case. Regardless of how someone standing back from it might evaluate the similarities of the stories, that kind of behavior would have been a gift from God to the lawyers. :lol:
 
Yeah, Stahl was actually pretty excellent in the role. Bale was as lifeless as the John Connor character's inclusion in Salvation was pointless. T3 certainly had issues, but it wasn't complete shit like Salvation. The truck chase sequence alone was worth the price of admission and the dark-ass ending was genuinely surprising.
 
Dennis said:
CorporalCaptain said:
Whether it constitutes grounds for a lawsuit, or whether there were other relevant factors, I don't know. I find less of a similarity with Demon with a Glass Hand.
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Cameron supposedly did some boasting to a reporter on set about "just lifting some stuff from 'Outer Limits'" that had an impact on the case. Regardless of how someone standing back from it might evaluate the similarities of the stories, that kind of behavior would have been a gift from God to the lawyers. :lol:
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Thanks, Dennis.

I've updated my post to indicate that the lawsuit was only contemplated, and not actually filed.
 
Robert Maxwell said:
RandyS said:
TheSeeker said:
The horrible casting was one of my major problems with the movie too. Nick Stahl was just horrible.
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He was better than Christan Bale, who, while making an excellent Batman, stank as John Connor.
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Bale made me hate John Connor, which I did not think would be an easy feat.
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If John appears in T5 I would certainly prefer Stahl to Bale in the role. Of course I would also prefer Eddie Furlong, Thomas Decker or even Andy Dick in the role to Christian Bale. He was a fine Batman but he was ass as John Connor.
 
I don't understand this. He was essentially the same character. Well, more Batman than Bruce Wayne, but still. Same intensity. Same cadence in his YELLING.
 
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