tng blueprinting WIP
- Thread starter AnyStar
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i surprised myself this morning!
EVERY other Trek ship ive done this to i have always had problems working in the deck footprints, usually getting the saucer and secondary portions to meet up etc...
i hadnt messed with the lower portion of the secondary yet, but when i cut in the rest of the decks this morning the only adjustment i had to make was moving the lower "turtle shell" and lower edge of the rim&wing portion down about 6 inches
when i was done i was almost afraid to start counting, but yep! all 42 decks acounted for right on the nose
here's a rather gigantic render of the cutaway
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/zz153/AnyStarModeler/Galaxy/221_d1-001_cutaway.png
EVERY other Trek ship ive done this to i have always had problems working in the deck footprints, usually getting the saucer and secondary portions to meet up etc...
i hadnt messed with the lower portion of the secondary yet, but when i cut in the rest of the decks this morning the only adjustment i had to make was moving the lower "turtle shell" and lower edge of the rim&wing portion down about 6 inches
when i was done i was almost afraid to start counting, but yep! all 42 decks acounted for right on the nose
here's a rather gigantic render of the cutaway
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/zz153/AnyStarModeler/Galaxy/221_d1-001_cutaway.png
Regarding the main shuttlebay door. Are you sure there isn't enough room for it to roll up like a segmented garage door?
From the picture of the model you posted, and the top view of the Whitfire plans, it seems like there's enough room. Also, the shuttlebay 1 image here:
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/scans/galaxy1.htm
Just askin.
From the picture of the model you posted, and the top view of the Whitfire plans, it seems like there's enough room. Also, the shuttlebay 1 image here:
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/scans/galaxy1.htm
Just askin.
what my research came up with was that there is basically no way for it to roll up, i just got in so i'll post some of the pics later that led me to that conclusion.
but yes on the Whitefire and Sternbach plans it does look like they were making some sort of acknowledgement of this with the way they tried widening the lips of the sidewall at the opening.
who knows though! maybe once i get those pics posted later on we can come up with a solution!
but yes on the Whitefire and Sternbach plans it does look like they were making some sort of acknowledgement of this with the way they tried widening the lips of the sidewall at the opening.
who knows though! maybe once i get those pics posted later on we can come up with a solution!
ok, i went through all my references and picked a few views that demonstrate my conclusion about the main hangar doors.
bear with me, its a pic heavy post! i shrunk them all down to about 800pix tho
i was going to mark up the pictures too, but decided its better to let you make your own assumptions.
and just a note in case you never considered it, but to roll up like a garage door, the back or top end of the door will move almost all the way to the bottleneck just aft of the sensor strip.
this first look really says it all, even though its the 8foot crash saucer from Generations. since it is the most recent of the models built. but not only that, its the best dead above shot i have.
there is no perspective problems from camera angle, and its dead giveaway that there is just too much wedge there for any movement at all.
next a couple pics from the 4foot model (even though as yet i havn't been basing any of my drawing on this model)
now a little camera perspective comes into play with these, especially the head on shot, but everything is still clearly visible.
before i get to the 6footer pics i want to put this one in, its the large scale hangar miniature. i forget what episode it was created for, but this picture was the clincher for me. its is wholly obvious they actually squared off the entire outer edge to 90º in order to roll up their door
now for some close-ups of the 6footer that ive been basing this on. i tried to pick images that focus on the fact that the doors go all the way to the edge, and still show the wedge shape as well
the only 2 solutions i see are either roll it down underneath the hangar floor itself, or split it accordion style like this
.
am i wrong?
bear with me, its a pic heavy post! i shrunk them all down to about 800pix tho
i was going to mark up the pictures too, but decided its better to let you make your own assumptions.
and just a note in case you never considered it, but to roll up like a garage door, the back or top end of the door will move almost all the way to the bottleneck just aft of the sensor strip.
this first look really says it all, even though its the 8foot crash saucer from Generations. since it is the most recent of the models built. but not only that, its the best dead above shot i have.
there is no perspective problems from camera angle, and its dead giveaway that there is just too much wedge there for any movement at all.
next a couple pics from the 4foot model (even though as yet i havn't been basing any of my drawing on this model)
now a little camera perspective comes into play with these, especially the head on shot, but everything is still clearly visible.
before i get to the 6footer pics i want to put this one in, its the large scale hangar miniature. i forget what episode it was created for, but this picture was the clincher for me. its is wholly obvious they actually squared off the entire outer edge to 90º in order to roll up their door
now for some close-ups of the 6footer that ive been basing this on. i tried to pick images that focus on the fact that the doors go all the way to the edge, and still show the wedge shape as well
the only 2 solutions i see are either roll it down underneath the hangar floor itself, or split it accordion style like this
.
am i wrong?
No, you're not wrong.
Maybe it all rolls up on a big spool just inside the entry...
Maybe it all rolls up on a big spool just inside the entry...
Wow, those are some great reference shots!
No, not saying you're wrong. It just seems like the intent was that it rolls up and the amount that it may not fit perfectly doesn't seem like enough to have to change it to having it go down into the floor instead.
Unless I'm missing something, which is entirely possible, your top view doesn't seem to match the model in the "flared out" areas at the aft end where the doors touch the floor.
I'm going to make that area in 3D using the Whitfire plans and those images as reference and get back to you.
Maybe like April says, they roll up, or maybe the segments stack on top of each other somewhat to allow it to fit, like the segmented doors in the cargo bay of 1701-refit need to.
If I come up with anything useful, I'll post it.
No, not saying you're wrong. It just seems like the intent was that it rolls up and the amount that it may not fit perfectly doesn't seem like enough to have to change it to having it go down into the floor instead.
Unless I'm missing something, which is entirely possible, your top view doesn't seem to match the model in the "flared out" areas at the aft end where the doors touch the floor.
I'm going to make that area in 3D using the Whitfire plans and those images as reference and get back to you.
Maybe like April says, they roll up, or maybe the segments stack on top of each other somewhat to allow it to fit, like the segmented doors in the cargo bay of 1701-refit need to.
If I come up with anything useful, I'll post it.
honestly i hadnt even considered that option, i would hope that the size of that door however would preclude that. IMO it would seem too flimsy wouldnt it? i'll play around with that and see what i come up with though!
i have a ton of refs on it, every angle on those doors looks different, but i'll be happy to share what i have if you are wanting to work one up in 3d.
my own cg modeling skills are still in their infancy 
also i didnt mention a change ive made in my plans concerning that area, it may be why it looks funny to you.
the floor of the hangar (where the saucer flatens out at the back) came out in an odd spot once it was all together, right in the middle of decks 4 and 5, so i moved it further aft to meet the floor of deck 5
i also worked a spool in there ro represent April's suggestion, i didnt make any measurements yet, but that represents a 1' thick door, spooled to 12' diameter.
btw, the shuttlecraft in the image is NTS, its still just the size i eyeballed it in at for the earlier pics. its a little on the small side!
before i get to the 6footer pics i want to put this one in, its the large scale hangar miniature. i forget what episode it was created for, but this picture was the clincher for me. its is wholly obvious they actually squared off the entire outer edge to 90º in order to roll up their door
Not that it's relevant...but the episode was Cause and Effect. What might be relevant is this clip at the 3:50 mark.
sweet! ty
i think i even have this episode in my tivo from a rerun a few weeks ago, i cant believe i missed that part!
honestly i hadnt even considered that option, i would hope that the size of that door however would preclude that. IMO it would seem too flimsy wouldnt it? i'll play around with that and see what i come up with though!
i have a ton of refs on it, every angle on those doors looks different, but i'll be happy to share what i have if you are wanting to work one up in 3d.
also i didnt mention a change ive made in my plans concerning that area, it may be why it looks funny to you.
the floor of the hangar (where the saucer flatens out at the back) came out in an odd spot once it was all together, right in the middle of decks 4 and 5, so i moved it further aft to meet the floor of deck 5
i also worked a spool in there ro represent April's suggestion, i didnt make any measurements yet, but that represents a 1' thick door, spooled to 12' diameter.
btw, the shuttlecraft in the image is NTS, its still just the size i eyeballed it in at for the earlier pics. its a little on the small side!
I would leave the deck where it's shown on the model. There is nothing that says a deck can't change in height and it allows you to have a taller deck below for the hangar.
i did consider some kind of ramp before it gets to the hangar door, but honestly with only using those plans as a guide to get the slope on the saucer itself, the problem can be an error in that just as easily.
when i reach one of these obstacles my instinct is to always fall back and look at it from a designers perspective and KISS it.
(Keep It Simple Stupid!) haha
holiday's are over, so back at work on this today!
been adding misc greebles and other goodies in today, also i have decided to go with the roll-top option. and once i worked in the revised door it looks like a better match to the model in any case yay. i also shortened how the roof part cuts back towards the bridge by about 15', it was just too wide before.
the flare from the outer edge in to the door still looks a little wide to my eye, but in the end it should be more accurate.
been adding misc greebles and other goodies in today, also i have decided to go with the roll-top option. and once i worked in the revised door it looks like a better match to the model in any case
yay. i also shortened how the roof part cuts back towards the bridge by about 15', it was just too wide before.
its time to worry about those escape pod hatches at the saucer/neck separation seam.
as mentioned earlier they are changed to "equipment hatches" on all the plans, but the model has actual pod hatches there
its clear that pods wont fit inside, but should i change them or leave it as shown on the model???
the numbering of all the hatches is also random, and only a handfull of numbers used, but i began numbering mine in order today. just out of habit i went clockwise from top to bottom, but i'm going to reverse that. i dont like the way the numbers end up reading from right to left.
.
as mentioned earlier they are changed to "equipment hatches" on all the plans, but the model has actual pod hatches there
its clear that pods wont fit inside, but should i change them or leave it as shown on the model???
the numbering of all the hatches is also random, and only a handfull of numbers used, but i began numbering mine in order today. just out of habit i went clockwise from top to bottom, but i'm going to reverse that. i dont like the way the numbers end up reading from right to left.
I went back and watched that episode, and I would love to see a TNG Remastered replacing all the FX with CG versions - oh, that would be amazing in HD!
there's actually a thread discussing that over in the TNG area
http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=91561
it seems there are too many obstacles to overcome, given the technology used in filming. TNG was shot and edited on videotape. and as such a conversion to HD, as well as remastered FX is unlikely
i can only imagine what it would look like if the entire series had that beautified quality of Generations...
http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=91561
it seems there are too many obstacles to overcome, given the technology used in filming. TNG was shot and edited on videotape. and as such a conversion to HD, as well as remastered FX is unlikely
i can only imagine what it would look like if the entire series had that beautified quality of Generations...
there's actually a thread discussing that over in the TNG area
http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=91561
it seems there are too many obstacles to overcome, given the technology used in filming. TNG was shot and edited on videotape. and as such a conversion to HD, as well as remastered FX is unlikely
i can only imagine what it would look like if the entire series had that beautified quality of Generations...
That's not entirely true. TNG was edited on video, but shot on 35mm.
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