Time Crack is stupid

[EJA]

Have I mentioned how in a recent episode of SJA, Sarah Jane prevents a probe sent to Mars from transmitting photos of an alien pyriamid back to Earth? Why would she do this, if the Daleks had still attacked en mass not long ago? This, to me, is one of the bigger obstacles to the idea that the invasion was restored in the reset.

 

[EJA]

Take a look at this:

http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/Talkalek_Invasion_of_Earth_(2009)#Still_unwritten_from_time.3F

The person at the end seems pretty positive it's gone forever, and I see no reason not to trust his opinion.

EJA, the person at the end is YOU, and the one before that agrees with you. Of course you trust their opinion!

I'm sorry, let me clarify. The first poster there is me, and then the other person responded. Just to see what would be said, I then typed the next paragraph, AFTER I'd posted the link here. My point was to offer the viewpoint of those who disagree with me.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

Have I mentioned how in a recent episode of SJA, Sarah Jane prevents a probe sent to Mars from transmitting photos of an alien pyramid back to Earth? Why would she do this, if the Daleks had still attacked en mass not long ago?

Because it's a fun story.

 

[Admiral_Young]

Yeah we discussed the SJA. Another example of ignoring or forgetting wide spread alien invasion would be "Aliens of London". The Sycorax invasion, etc. People forget stuff all the time. I read an interview where Michael Bay did for "Transformers 2" at the time where he said people from the first movie have forgotten the events from the fight in the first movie. He used the analogy of media going on to the next big story and people eventually forgetting stuff. It was a crude analogy, but the point is valid. We do forget things. Even on a grand scale. Remember too there was another reset button in placed for The Year That Never Happened. Only the Doctor, Martha, and Jack remember the events of The Reign of the Master if I recall correctly.

 

[DWF]

Have I mentioned how in a recent episode of SJA, Sarah Jane prevents a probe sent to Mars from transmitting photos of an alien pyriamid back to Earth? Why would she do this, if the Daleks had still attacked en mass not long ago? This, to me, is one of the bigger obstacles to the idea that the invasion was restored in the reset.

Because she knows that Sutekh was inprisoned there.

 

[EJA]

Yeah we discussed the SJA. Another example of ignoring or forgetting wide spread alien invasion would be "Aliens of London". The Sycorax invasion, etc. People forget stuff all the time. I read an interview where Michael Bay did for "Transformers 2" at the time where he said people from the first movie have forgotten the events from the fight in the first movie. He used the analogy of media going on to the next big story and people eventually forgetting stuff. It was a crude analogy, but the point is valid. We do forget things. Even on a grand scale. Remember too there was another reset button in placed for The Year That Never Happened. Only the Doctor, Martha, and Jack remember the events of The Reign of the Master if I recall correctly.

I reckon it's easier not to know anything about a couple of explosions and some strange machines running amok in a single city somewhere one day, than to forget day turning into night in an instant, huge planets appearing in the sky, and hordes of Daleks descending in spaceships and blasting everything in sight all over the globe.

And I have to point out, the Year That Never Was scenario was specifically designed to be removed from the series timeline by the end of the story. The Dalek invasion had lasting consequences for everyone.

 

[EJA]

Have I mentioned how in a recent episode of SJA, Sarah Jane prevents a probe sent to Mars from transmitting photos of an alien pyriamid back to Earth? Why would she do this, if the Daleks had still attacked en mass not long ago? This, to me, is one of the bigger obstacles to the idea that the invasion was restored in the reset.

Because she knows that Sutekh was inprisoned there.

Not anymore, he isn't. He escaped from Mars, only to die in a time passage.

 

[DWF]

Yeah we discussed the SJA. Another example of ignoring or forgetting wide spread alien invasion would be "Aliens of London". The Sycorax invasion, etc. People forget stuff all the time. I read an interview where Michael Bay did for "Transformers 2" at the time where he said people from the first movie have forgotten the events from the fight in the first movie. He used the analogy of media going on to the next big story and people eventually forgetting stuff. It was a crude analogy, but the point is valid. We do forget things. Even on a grand scale. Remember too there was another reset button in placed for The Year That Never Happened. Only the Doctor, Martha, and Jack remember the events of The Reign of the Master if I recall correctly.

There's a massive difference between people forgetting or ingoring an event and the event being erased altogether. I think we'll know more once the new season starts as to what's remembered and what's been erased.

 

[DWF]

Have I mentioned how in a recent episode of SJA, Sarah Jane prevents a probe sent to Mars from transmitting photos of an alien pyriamid back to Earth? Why would she do this, if the Daleks had still attacked en mass not long ago? This, to me, is one of the bigger obstacles to the idea that the invasion was restored in the reset.

Because she knows that Sutekh was inprisoned there.

Not anymore, he isn't. He escaped from Mars, only to die in a time passage.

The pyramid is still and so is the chamber he was inprisoned in. And I did use the word inprisoned past tense I know he's no longer there.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

I think we'll know more once the new season starts as to what's remembered and what's been erased.

Maybe they could make a list. And, you know, pie charts.

 

[Admiral_Young]

I think EJA has done that already

 

[DWF]

I think we'll know more once the new season starts as to what's remembered and what's been erased.

Maybe they could make a list. And, you know, pie charts.

LOL!! Well somebody has to say something about what's going on earth presently.

 

[EJA]

Maybe Wilf doesn't remember the Doctor anymore? Poor guy, he was one of my favourite characters.

But hang on: If Davros was swallowed by the Crack, then he never existed, and so the Daleks could never have existed at all....and yet they do, their development is unbroken.

 

[DWF]

But hang on: If Davros was swallowed by the Crack, then he never existed, and so the Daleks could never have existed at all....and yet they do, their development is unbroken.

No self respecting time crack would swallow Davros, besides if one did there'd be no Time War and Gallifrey would still be there.

 

[Admiral_Young]

We're starting to repeat things here. This thread needs to be swallowed by the crack.

 

[EJA]

I'm sorry if I've been hostile to you EJA over the course of our debate...I think the point I've been trying to make is that there are flaws in your view that the Dalek invasion didn't happen. The Doctor KNOWS and remembers that it happened, because he participated in it. If it didn't happen how would HE personally know about it? Trying to retcon something as big as the Dalek invasion and the Stolen Earth is pretty dumb. Does this mean that when we catch up with Jack in Torchwood: Miracle Day he won't remember the Stolen Earth?

No need to apologise. I actually quite enjoy our debates, despite our not often seeing eye-to-eye.

 

[EJA]

the notion that we'd somehow en masse choose to ignore Daleks/planets in the sky etc holds no water.

I'm not 100% behind the idea of the crack, but I praise Moffat for trying to make some sense of the tangled web of Who history/counter history.

I agree with you about people ignoring the Daleks and planets in the sky. As for Moffat trying to make sense of Who's history, I'm sorry, but I have to disagree. IMO, he makes things even more nonsensical.

 

[Photoman15]

I'll state this again. The Big Bang II had to restore the whole original time line, not just what Amy remembers. She has no memory of anything but her town. That would mean only her town or what she's seen on TV or whatever would be brought back. She knows nothing of any alien race (her memories), so if the Big Bang II only restored what Amy remembers, billions of planets would now not exist, billions of races, and for that matter Captain Jack, since she has no memory of him. The BBII had to restore the "memory" of the atoms in the Pandorica (which is what the Doctor said it would do) as the TARDIS explosion happened at all times and in all space.

 

[Admiral_Young]

^ This is what I've been trying to explain but EJA and a few others seem content on holding onto their beliefe that this isn't the case.

 

[starsuperion]

I'll state this again. The Big Bang II had to restore the whole original time line, not just what Amy remembers. She has no memory of anything but her town. That would mean only her town or what she's seen on TV or whatever would be brought back. She knows nothing of any alien race (her memories), so if the Big Bang II only restored what Amy remembers, billions of planets would now not exist, billions of races, and for that matter Captain Jack, since she has no memory of him. The BBII had to restore the "memory" of the atoms in the Pandorica (which is what the Doctor said it would do) as the TARDIS explosion happened at all times and in all space.

I disagree.. it is possible that "most" of the universe was put back together, whilst some minor events that were removed from time are now gone.. the doctor even said that using the atoms and particles trapped in the pandorica could reboot in theory "most" of the universe..

he takes some time to exposition: the light from the Pandorica was a restoration ray, it repaired Amy because it had her DNA but it managed to partially restore the Dalek too. There are millions of atoms in that box, and theoretically, it could restore everything given enough power. Like cloning a whole body using a single cell. They're going to reboot the Universe. The Big Bang 2.

this is the caveat that moffat could use to fix the time lines and continuity in the whoverse..all he need do is site that not all events were rebooted, and thus the universe when reformed, circa BB2, were missing certain things..because those atoms that were in the pandorica did not exist.. or something like that..