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Spoilers The Story & the Engine grade and discussion thread

How do you rate The Story & the Engine?


  • Total voters
    21
Having now watched it (I knew the earlier bit about the meaning of the barbershop to the Doctor from spoilers) I really enjoyed this. I also disagree with the comparison of Omo with the Brigadier since the Doctor never really had the "this is someone I can hang out with and feel safe" vibe with Alistair, even (or perhaps especially) during his exile - the closest we got was Battlefield. In fact, just hanging out with old friends for the hell of it is something the Doctor never does, until the bigeneration and Ten 3.0 having Sunday lunch with Clan Donna (at Fifteen's urging). This is new, and good - the Doctor SHOULD address their mental health, even if there's occasional backsliding. Mopey Ol' Time Git was getting a tad boring...

I just like the idea of the Doctor having friends he pops into. And ones that carry across regenerations. By Mawdryn Undead at the very least, that’s what the Brig is to the Doctor. Or the Paternoster Gang. Sort of… stationary long term companions.
 
I just like the idea of the Doctor having friends he pops into. And ones that carry across regenerations. By Mawdryn Undead at the very least, that’s what the Brig is to the Doctor. Or the Paternoster Gang. Sort of… stationary long term companions.

Mawdryn Undead is a poor choice - the Brig is fucked up at that point BECAUSE the Doctor never visits! Battlefield is a better case (though I note even there the Doctor chooses the task that will keep him in the kitchen away from having to chat to the Brig and Ancelyn as they do their share of the chores - this is MY go-to for parties where I'm a wallflower so I know the move well).

Paternoster are a better case - though they seem locked into the "mental health support" role more obviously than the "mates chatting in the pub/football ground/gym/barbershop" way presented here. They're the mates you ask to crash with because you're having a mental health crisis. Omo's is the place you go to decompress to make sure the crisis doesn't happen (today).
 
Mawdryn Undead is a poor choice - the Brig is fucked up at that point BECAUSE the Doctor never visits! Battlefield is a better case (though I note even there the Doctor chooses the task that will keep him in the kitchen away from having to chat to the Brig and Ancelyn as they do their share of the chores - this is MY go-to for parties where I'm a wallflower so I know the move well).

Paternoster are a better case - though they seem locked into the "mental health support" role more obviously than the "mates chatting in the pub/football ground/gym/barbershop" way presented here. They're the mates you ask to crash with because you're having a mental health crisis. Omo's is the place you go to decompress to make sure the crisis doesn't happen (today).

Yeah, but Mawdryn Era is also Five Doctors era. Him and the Second on their Death Zone hike…

I like the idea of Omo being this. And it’s a shame they (a) don’t go into detail about the past Doctor or (b) leave it open for a return by a future Doctor. That alone is a powerful image, a Doctor, no longer black, maybe no longer even a man, coming to his mates for a haircut and dude just knows it’s him, gives haircut. It especially works well *because* it’s not an Afro hair specialist salon in Streatham, but Lagos. A bustling capital.

But, Omo threw him under a bus, got forgiveness, then retired and went back to his Mrs. A shame. Can you imagine a world where every new Doctor were not wondering about Cybermen or Daleks, or if they’re gonna hook up with the PMC Unit — but when they’re gonna go get their hair cut?

Omo’s actor could have been quids in too.
 
Yeah, but Mawdryn Era is also Five Doctors era. Him and the Second on their Death Zone hike…

I like the idea of Omo being this. And it’s a shame they (a) don’t go into detail about the past Doctor or (b) leave it open for a return by a future Doctor. That alone is a powerful image, a Doctor, no longer black, maybe no longer even a man, coming to his mates for a haircut and dude just knows it’s him, gives haircut. It especially works well *because* it’s not an Afro hair specialist salon in Streatham, but Lagos. A bustling capital.

But, Omo threw him under a bus, got forgiveness, then retired and went back to his Mrs. A shame. Can you imagine a world where every new Doctor were not wondering about Cybermen or Daleks, or if they’re gonna hook up with the PMC Unit — but when they’re gonna go get their hair cut?

Omo’s actor could have been quids in too.

The Brig retired and still got adventures with the Doctor. Offscreen, but hey, stories don't care about the medium... we got a whole story about how trying to trap stories in ONE medium is a BAD thing.
 
The Brig retired and still got adventures with the Doctor. Offscreen, but hey, stories don't care about the medium... we got a whole story about how trying to trap stories in ONE medium is a BAD thing.

TV is sort of Who’s natural home though — even if I think it’s best era for stories was the wilderness era and the books — and the positivity of that idea just seems a shame to have missed out on. But hey. Maybe he decides not to retire, or him and his Mrs emigrate and set up a new barber shop somewhere the Beeb can afford the location shoot for. She can have a restaurant next door, and people wonder why only one delivery dude/dudette gets the food there hot and on time.
 
It's worth noting that the "six word story" by Hemingway ("For sale: baby shoes. Never worn." is widely considered apocryphal (at least, that it was Hemingway who told it) - AKA just another story.

Probably for the best if it is — otherwise the Doc just claimed to have been why he wrote it.
 
Gave this one an 8. It had some problems but I was generous given the courage to tell a story set mostly in a Laos barbershop about the power of stories

The ideas and setting were interesting and entertaining, however some problems with the story.

A key adage of stories is "show don't tell." And this had way too much telling. The backstory of Abby, backstory of the Doctor and Omo, the backstory of the Doctor and Abby, the backstory of the barber, etc. All that telling took out much of the potential impact.

I also was unsure why the Doctor got so pissed off at Omo. That seemed out of left field. It's not like Omo made the Doctor go there. The Doctor went there on his own and there was no way Omo could stop him. And, yes, Omo wanted the Doctor there but he didn't make it happen.

The solution was too easy. The Doctor told a short story of his life and whammo. Did he really even need to get to the brain/heart thing to do that. Could've done that on the chair, making that whole runaround unnecessary.

But it was a nice different type of story.
 
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Lots of telling while standing in front of the unused backstory display device.

Personally this lost me at the premise. I was never going to like an episode about a story-powered mechanical spider on a mission to kill the gods and remove storytelling from the world that uses haircuts as part of its operation. It earned itself a place at the bottom of my rankings the moment the writer came up with the concept. That's just my taste in stories.

And I was pretty bored too.

I gotta be honest, this has been my least favourite season of Doctor Who in the last 20 years, worse even than the Whitaker seasons. Even more annoying is that everyone else seems to be liking it a lot, so I'm in the minority on this one!
 
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That was very original and ambitious, and it was great to see Jo Martin but...it just didn't quite work for me.

Maybe a second watch is in order.

And also, if it was the Renegade Doctor who met Abby, then how can Fifteen remember her?

Nice to see Fifteen get angry though.
 
Good story but I wasn't impressed by the execution at all. At the start it looked like we were going to get animation during all the stories then they episode just...forgot that? The Doctor's story about Belinda just had standard flashbacks. Then the Doctor, Omo and Abby spend what seems like 20 minutes of endless exposition explaining the story to us and there's not only no animation but no flashbacks! Just a 3 people talking in the room and lots of surprised reaction shots from the 4 babershop regulars. Just the most boring way possible to tell the story.

Belinda didn't seem to react at all to learning that the Doctor has died and been reborn multiple times and seeing hs previous regenerations.
 
It was good.

I need to rewatch this one.

Lots of stuff happened that I'm fairly certain I didn't catch in my initial watch.
 
The flashbacks and animation only happened when people were in the chair getting their hair cut, and they weren't when they were talking about that stuff.
Sad firstly because we're in a period we NEED reminding of that.

Sad secondly because - and I'm SURE this was not the author's intent - it is dangerously close to the "if you don't like it here, go back to X and be with your own kind!*" hate that Reform, MAGA et al. spew...

*: yes, I know the Doctor isn't actually Nigerian.
As nice as it was to see a place like Lagos that we don't see in these kind of shows often, I'm not sure if there was really anything about it that required it to be set there. It could have easily been set in a predominantly Black neighborhood at least in the US, I'm not sure if that's as big of a thing in other countries, and it really wouldn't have changed the story.
I liked it, it's always nice to see a story deal with Gods who aren't Greek/Roman, Norse, or Egyptian, and I like the idea of The Doctor having a place where he can just go and relax with a friend.
I have to admit, I had a little bit of trouble understading the bad guy and some of the other characters with the accents. Who exactly was the bad guy supposed to be? All I caught was that he wasn't the gods and he made the web the spider was walking on. And I missed some of Anansi's daughter's story, did her father bet her in a game with the Doctor and when she won she refused to take her like she was supposed to?
 
I have to admit, I had a little bit of trouble understading the bad guy and some of the other characters with the accents. Who exactly was the bad guy supposed to be? All I caught was that he wasn't the gods and he made the web the spider was walking on. And I missed some of Anansi's daughter's story, did her father bet her in a game with the Doctor and when she won she refused to take her like she was supposed to?
He was a mortal who gather the stories and made sure they were told.
Yes she was a "prize" in a bet between the Doctor and Anansi.
 
As nice as it was to see a place like Lagos that we don't see in these kind of shows often, I'm not sure if there was really anything about it that required it to be set there. It could have easily been set in a predominantly Black neighborhood at least in the US, I'm not sure if that's as big of a thing in other countries, and it really wouldn't have changed the story.
I've read many articles and stories by Black Americans or Canadians or whoever who've been to Africa and been almost overwhelmed by the feeling of suddenly no longer being a minority but being like everyone around them, and no one looking at them as something different. I don't imagine it's even close to the same thing as being in a predominantly Black area in a country like Canada, the USA, or the UK. But I grew up being part of almost every majority group in Canada, so I haven't had that experience and wouldn't dismiss someone who has.
 
I was thinking more about just the barbershop, I wasn't really thinking about that part of it.
 
I really liked this one. But I'm big on mythology and stories about stories.

This may be why I liked it more than I otherwise might, I admit. Especially as it’s fits right in with all the wilderness years stuff so well.
 
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