Spoilers The Marvels grade and discussion

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by The Nth Doctor, Nov 6, 2023.

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How do you rate The Marvels?

  1. A+

    1.6%
  2. A

    15.9%
  3. A-

    23.8%
  4. B+

    25.4%
  5. B

    6.3%
  6. B-

    6.3%
  7. C+

    9.5%
  8. C

    1.6%
  9. C-

    7.9%
  10. D+

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  11. D

    1.6%
  12. D-

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. F

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Well, when the majority of the narrative is the negative why chance it?

    It's amazing to me the dissonance experienced when seeing all the talk and word of mouth being around poor box office numbers, and lamenting the Disney Plus then wondering why people didn't go see it.
     
  2. Skipper

    Skipper Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'm starting to think that the "superhero fatigue" theory has some merit. And superhero films are truly following the same path as Westerns (but only much faster). And like Westerns after the 70s, the only successful superhero films will be only the exceptional ones or those still capable of surprising in some way.
     
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  3. The Nth Doctor

    The Nth Doctor Infinite Possibilities... Premium Member

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    I care far more about this than yet another post about the box office.

    We don't need or want the constant updates. Let us enjoy the film, the interviews, and other people talking about why they liked the film.
     
  4. The Knappos

    The Knappos Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I think that Disney have hamstrung their box office by sticking to their 3-4 months max til it’s on D+.

    Back in the day (yes, I’m old) you had a theatrical run of however long then you had to wait 6-9 months (at least) for rental and 12-18 months for retail.

    That deliberate scarcity creates hype and demand for each window/method of release.

    Cutting off their nose to spite their face.
     
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  5. TerryTrek

    TerryTrek Captain Captain

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    That's a reflection on the appeal of the films themselves.

    Put something great out, people will flock to see it.

    It can't be forgotten that everyone went out (in the midst of Omicron) to see Spider-Man NWH in Winter 2021.

    The box office will never be strong, unless they are putting out films that people want to see.

    2024 is destined to be another mediocre year, with only perhaps Deadpool 3 and Joker 2 as the summer blockbusters that have billion potential.

    Nothing to do with the pandemic, or streaming lol. They just need better 4 quadrant offerings.
     
  6. TerryTrek

    TerryTrek Captain Captain

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    Guardians 3 still did 845M Worldwide, tied with many Phase 3 films. Shows there is still an audience hunger for good Marvel films with characters that people actually care about.

    To go directly from that, to The Marvels flopping at historical levels (perhaps the biggest financial failure in the genre if it can't crack 100M) is very telling about where mainstream audience interest is.

    Yup. Blade Runner was a cult classic with niche appeal. 2049 needed a much smaller budget to turn a profit, as the film would never be a 4th quadrant hit.

    You certainly have a much higher opinion of "The Marvels" than I, lol.

    And the box office failings and lack of appeal for "The Marvels" are fair discussion.
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2023
  7. DarKush

    DarKush Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The Marvels doesn't deserve this fate. I thought it was an enjoyable film, but not a must-see film. It was more run-of-the-mill. Sometimes the internet or mass audience turns on a film and people seem to enjoy bashing it. This summer it was The Flash, and before that, arguably Shazam! Fury of the Gods, and last year it was Morbius and Black Adam. Marvel has generally avoided getting this kind of treatment, though The Eternals was met with a big yawn, Love & Thunder caused ripples of disquiet, and Quantumania was ragged on, so there has been a growing displeasure with superhero films and content. I'm iffy about superhero fatigue setting in. I still think it's more of an issue of quantity over quality. Across the Spider-Verse and Guardians of the Galaxy Volume 3 both did well this year, and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles made respectable box office.

    I think Disney might be getting the message that less is more. Unfortunately, they got to contend with Sony who are putting out Madame Web, Venom 3, and Kraven all next year I believe. And even though they aren't MCU films, they still have the Marvel logo, and could tarnish the brand more if they flop. Disney needs to find a way to build back up mass audience trust in the brand. If they can't, they should start making cheaper films and Plus content for the more dedicated MCU fan base that's still out there.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2023
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  8. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    ^ That sounds too much like common sense.

    Agreed. The pandemic has been a ready excuse for recent movie failures, instead of admitting that maybe, just maybe a film was unappealing / creatively challenged / terrible. In the case of The Marvels, which critic / box office financial analyst is citing the pandemic effect for its failure?

    ...and the mainstream audience was not invested in a single element of The Marvels--but it takes a bit of honesty to admit there are legitimate reasons why the film is such a historic disaster.
     
  9. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Thing is... I can just wait for this to come to Disney+. It'll only be a few months.
     
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  10. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Yup.

    Audiences are given choices now. How dare they decide to watch it at home?
     
  11. Noname Given

    Noname Given Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The quickness to streaming availability has hurt the MCU, DCEU and other films imo.

    When it was 10 moths to a year, there was more of a reason to hit a theater to see something even if you were mildly interested.

    Waiting 3-6 months for Streaming isn't that big a wait for most people. (I myself would probably have gone to see The Flash and Matrix: Resurrections in a theater if that was the case. And I would have gone to Black Widow too if it hadn't been released concurrently to Streaming, although I did wait on Streaming until there wasn't the extra fee on release day.)
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2023
  12. Tosk

    Tosk Admiral Admiral

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    There are three superhero movies in the top ten box office for 2023, and a whole bunch of 2023 bombs weren't superhero films. I'd argue it's not superhero fatigue, it's cinema fatigue. People are more picky now, across the board.
     
  13. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I really think this has been a big part of the downturn in the overall box office the last couple years. With so many people having big expensive entertainment set ups that rival the theaters, they're not going to be as quick to go to the theater when they already know it'll on Disney+, Paramount+, Peacock, ect. in just a few weeks.
     
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  14. JoeZhang

    JoeZhang Vice Admiral Admiral

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    So that explains a general decline but this film does not represent a "general decline" - it is breaking records in how bad its box office is - compared generally or against other MCU films.

    In box office terms it died on it's first Friday and we are just watching the zombie shuffle on for contractual reasons. If you divide its box office against number of screens and a reasonable amount of viewings it is playing to empty screens in some places.

    Why is a different conversation but this is not just general decline.
     
  15. Mage

    Mage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I have a very busy life, often work 6 days a week. I don't really have time for a social life, so knowing that a lot of movie will be available for streaming 3-4 months later, like you said, makes it easy for me to not feel bad about missing a movie in theaters.
    Plus, people are assholes so going to the theaters sucks anyway.
     
  16. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Same. Also the high rate of inflation (20% for my area) means I don't spend money I don't have to.

    The theater is a luxury not a need.
     
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  17. Mage

    Mage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Same. I miss my cinema buddy though. She and I would go often, especially to superhero movies. But both the movies and the location are just disappointing.
     
  18. TerryTrek

    TerryTrek Captain Captain

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  19. JoeZhang

    JoeZhang Vice Admiral Admiral

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    At 77.9% or 78%, it ties with Steel (1997) for the biggest Superhero film drop-off.

    Edit: wait, Variety says 79%, which means it beat Steel and is the biggest second-weekend dropoff for a superhero film in history!
     
  20. TerryTrek

    TerryTrek Captain Captain

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    Yeah, I've never seen anything like this.