The Last Jedi - Actually Widely Hated?
- Thread starter crookeddy
- Start date
You are probably correct. Certainly one aspect I enjoy about TLJ is how people are actually engaging with the material and interpreting the text, rather than just read in to it the ruination of a character.
It is taken for granted now, but ESB is quite honestly as intricately tied to ROTJ as TLJ is to TROS. ESB took a pretty standard, black and white, hero's journey story, and added in more shades of gray. The bad guy isn't just the bad guy. He, in fact, used to be a good guy, and used to be the protagonist's father. Someone that the protagonist only knows about by stories. Suddenly, Luke is faced with a very painful, very real world, morally gray, situation.
Except, in ESB, we don't have the whole story. We have denial and pain but no resolution. Just taking the character through the next big steps in to a larger world. Its only through ROTJ that we humanize Vader more, recognize whom he used to be, and find out the rest of the story.
TLJ, like ESB, takes these next steps. Instead of leaving the character in a static world, it continues the story down from morally gray to incredibly colorful. Luke is faced with a very real moral challenge, and fails. In such failure, he treats himself with such self-deprecation he wishes to die. Doesn't sound very hopeful, but it is incredibly human. Just as Lucas wanted to explore how even the most evil person in the galaxy was once a child, the ST explores the very human weaknesses of heroes.
There is much there to behold, but there is a need to be willing to come beyond the surface level and assumptions from years of SW and look just a little bit deeper.
So if you don't like the movie you don't understand It, and if you like the movie you do?
That's not remotely what I said, is it?
Nope, not what Mr. Nog said at all.
Standard issue ‘your father was zeus’ or ‘that warrior you killed was your dad’ stuff. TLJ really doesn’t have that stuff going on. It attempts to be a sort of siege in space, but it’s less Troy and more ‘waiting for the shops to open while the staff have nipped out’.
Ah, it was so standard that it was considered a great twist at the time...?
Agree to disagree on the rest, of course.
Ah, it was so standard that it was considered a great twist at the time...?
Agree to disagree on the rest, of course.
*shrug*
It was a twist, people didn’t expect it in SF movies/pulp entertainment. The idea it was something fresh and new in storytelling? In the kind of sagas Star Wars was emulating? In the stuff George consciously referred to?
Nah. Not remotely.
Heck. The new one with its Jedi cast of hundreds is already winking back at another Star Wars influence, Dune.
Drawing from these influences is not in any way a bad thing, but TLJ didn’t get it. It just didn’t.
Ok then I misunderstood It, my apologies
You seem to have a HIGH opinion of film critics. IMO most are pretty f*cking dumb.
No, just taking references from other mythology and classic stories, plus psychology.
You seem to have a HIGH opinion of film critics. IMO most are pretty f*cking dumb.
That's a shame. Maybe you're not reading the right ones. The handful of critics that I make a point of reading regularly are without fail intelligent and passionate people who provide wonderful insights into film that enrich my appreciation for the medium itself.
I certainly give far more credence to the consensus from the professional critical community than I do to, say, a bunch of brats on an internet forum. But, that's me.
I see no reason to give credence to anyone in the realm of film in forming my opinion first.
Afterwards, perhaps...but it still comes across as a bunch of brats with opinions on the Internet.
Use to be for me. Became overly long and not that interesting any more.
Nothing stays great forever.
Besides, I'll take their critiques over the whiny crowd any day of the week.
Well, if that's my only options...then, yeah.Nothing stays great forever.
Besides, I'll take their critiques over the whiny crowd any day of the week.
But, I opt to not bother too many YT videos on SW. Too many full of themselves and their opinions on things and it begins to become tiresome after a while. SW Theory became that way, as did Generation Tech. I recommend small doses, if at all.
Cinema Sins is actually one of the few I bother with. Them and WhatCulture.
Cinema Sins was funny for about five minutes. Now it's just painful.
