Spoilers The game changing Voq theory

[Cinema Geekly]

I think they were hoping nobody would figure this out so quickly and I'll give them credit it was super clever but WAY to much of this adds up.

Aside from the conversations L'Rell had with Voq the last time we saw them they were both together. Now a few weeks later we get L'Rell on her own ship but no sight or sound of Voq. However this Tyler fellow is a consort of L'Rell (we are lead to believe that he is forced) but an intimate relationship with Voq and L'Rell was heavily hinted at. You could reasonably argue that everything Tyler did was to curry favor with Lorca and gain his trust. He volunteered to take the beating from the Klingons and he attacked L'Rell. All of this would make Lorca think he's trustworthy.

 

[Tuskin38]

I think they were hoping nobody would figure this out so quickly and I'll give them credit it was super clever but WAY to much of this adds up.

Aside from the conversations L'Rell had with Voq the last time we saw them they were both together. Now a few weeks later we get L'Rell on her own ship but no sight or sound of Voq. However this Tyler fellow is a consort of L'Rell (we are lead to believe that he is forced) but an intimate relationship with Voq and L'Rell was heavily hinted at. You could reasonably argue that everything Tyler did was to curry favor with Lorca and gain his trust. He volunteered to take the beating from the Klingons and he attacked L'Rell. All of this would make Lorca think he's trustworthy.

Considering how devoted Voq was to 'remain klingon'. I think hes a sleeper agent, he doesn't know hes a Klingon.

There was probably a real Lt. Tyler that they took the memories from. Either that or the Klingons added Voq's new identity to all starfleet databases. Because you can be sure Lorca would look him up.

 

[KirkusOveractus]

I think they were hoping nobody would figure this out so quickly and I'll give them credit it was super clever but WAY to much of this adds up.

Aside from the conversations L'Rell had with Voq the last time we saw them they were both together. Now a few weeks later we get L'Rell on her own ship but no sight or sound of Voq. However this Tyler fellow is a consort of L'Rell (we are lead to believe that he is forced) but an intimate relationship with Voq and L'Rell was heavily hinted at. You could reasonably argue that everything Tyler did was to curry favor with Lorca and gain his trust. He volunteered to take the beating from the Klingons and he attacked L'Rell. All of this would make Lorca think he's trustworthy.

I was thinking along these lines as well. The show has been endeavoring to keep tabs on Voq and L'Rell, now all of a sudden we just see L'Rell.

The production has been bent on telling us every move everyone makes, but now no sight of Voq.

And I would think that the producers should be a little bummed that via twitter and online forums that if Tyler is Voq, then they really weren't doing a careful enough job with creating this storyline.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

If Tyler really IS Voq, I hope the writers have the common decency to have him actually be conflicted as to whose side he's on. Not have him all mwa-ha-ha the whole time.

 

[KirkusOveractus]

If Tyler really IS Voq, I hope the writers have the common decency to have him actually be conflicted as to whose side he's on. Not have him all mwa-ha-ha the whole time.

Actually, I would like it if he would stop in a corridor once in a while, look around to make sure no one is there, twirl at his moustache and go, "Mwa-ha-ha!"

 

[Timo]

Faking an identity is quite doable in the Federation - Anton Karidian was created out of whole cloth quite successfully, and everybody knowing he was Kodos the Executioner through solid forensic evidence didn't help with proving that this was the case. Ash Tyler might also be a pure fabrication, then. I mean, military records may need to be forged, but Kodos had to forge civilian ones, and there's no a priori reason to think the former would actually be a tougher nut to crack than the latter.

Of course, adding Ash Tyler could be replaced by crashing large lumps of the Starfleet personnel records with blunt attacks. No telling whether a real Tyler ever existed, then. And nothing pointing specifically at his creation being the purpose behind the database attacks.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Another thing: Since there is a real Javid Iqbal, did he have to give permission to have his name used in the credits for a role he (supposedly) didn't actually play?

 

[GeekUSACarl]

Another thing: Since there is a real Javid Iqbal, did he have to give permission to have his name used in the credits for a role he (supposedly) didn't actually play?

I don't think that's a possibility. I doubt he'd have any say in it, there are some very specific rules on credits and shows, and though I am not so specifically familiar with them to quote, my recollection tells me that's not something he has a say in.

I think he did play Voq, I think the credits saying so is something we should be able to reasonably rely on.,

 

[Charles Phipps]

Another thing: Since there is a real Javid Iqbal, did he have to give permission to have his name used in the credits for a role he (supposedly) didn't actually play?

That logic kind of breaks down with any name possessed by more than one person.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

That logic kind of breaks down with any name possessed by more than one person.

But that presupposes that there is a person, using that name, who really IS playing the role. Even if the name is shared by more than one actor - at least one of them has to be right, doesn't it?

I should think that episode or film credits would not be allowed to flat-out lie about who is playing a character. Even if they can invent a non-existent actor (which I'm sure has happened before), I don't see how they could appropriate a real actor's name for a role they didn't play. Wouldn't SAG have something to say about that?

 

[Charles Phipps]

But that presupposes that there is a person, using that name, who really IS playing the role. Even if the name is shared by more than one actor - at least one of them has to be right, doesn't it?

I should think that episode or film credits would not be allowed to flat-out lie about who is playing a character. Even if they can invent a non-existent actor (which I'm sure has happened before), I don't see how they could appropriate a real actor's name for a role they didn't play. Wouldn't SAG have something to say about that?

We could ask Alan Smithee, I suppose.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ The difference is, everybody knows there is no real Alan Smithee. That is a completely fake name, used by directors who don't want their name on the finished film.

What I'm wondering is, can a real actor's name be appropriated (without their consent) and slapped onto a credit for a role they didn't actually play?

If the real Javid Iqbal is in on this, then of course it all flies out the window anyway. But IIRC, he was not in on it. His Facebook page would seem to confirm that.

 

[Tuskin38]

Depends if hes part of the SAG I'd assume.

 

[jamestyler]

That'd be a dangerous and mental door to start opening. I've got a fairly common name. This guy never asked me if he could use it. I don't think there's any way for me to suggest he stop using my name, nor for him to stop me using mine. And there'll be another ten of us in the years and decades to come.

I also used to perform under a stage name - which was actually the stage name of someone else that I deliberately used. the real guy jokingly offered to fight me for it. We agreed on a dance off. Still waiting for that to happen.

 

[UssGlenn]

Is the real Javid Iqbal in the Screen Actors Guild? If not then SAG wouldn't care, as long as there is no Javid Iqbal in SAG then they should be able to use it as a pseudonym.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

That'd be a dangerous and mental door to start opening. I've got a fairly common name. This guy never asked me if he could use it. I don't think there's any way for me to suggest he stop using my name, nor for him to stop me using mine.

Of course, if the name in question IS common, and shared by many different actors, it'd be harder to require permission for its use.

But how many actors named Javid Iqbal are there, IRL?

 

[Cyrus]

I didn't care about this theory at first but now I am hoping it's true. I also hope they use the augment virus and not surgical procedure or some other thing. And hopefully by end of Discovery most of the Klingons will be human looking, to tie it nicely to TOS.

 

[Cake]

I find it funny that so many people apparently want this "Ash Tyler is Voq" thing to be true that they're accepting the events of Choose Your Pain as confirmation that it's happening even though there's still little to no evidence (not speculation and assumptions) that it's actually happening.

Why else would "Tyler" lie about being a sex slave of L'Rell for months? He couldn't have been as L'Rell was stuck on that big Klingon ship for 6 months. And L'Rell played along. Why should she do this if Tyler was really a prisoner and not Voq? It all doesn't make any sense, if Tyler is not Voq.

 

[jamestyler]

Of course, if the name in question IS common, and shared by many different actors, it'd be harder to require permission for its use.

But how many actors named Javid Iqbal are there, IRL?

Thats the thing - regardless of how unique the name is, if someone could 'grab' the name it'd open the door for anyone to jump on board. And there's be a John Smith who'd ultimately take the piss. It'd be confusing if you didn't know Christopher Lloyd from Christopher Lloyd - but it their names. Someone can't claim copyright on them. It's just a can of unfair worms ready to be opened.

On the name though, if it is connected to Latif's birth name, Javid would likely have as much significance as to why it was chosen. Javid Prime probably got a giggle out of the confusion and moved on with Spyler Javid lies in wait to be updated.

 

[Cyrus]

I find it funny that so many people apparently want this "Ash Tyler is Voq" thing to be true that they're accepting the events of Choose Your Pain as confirmation that it's happening even though there's still little to no evidence (not speculation and assumptions) that it's actually happening.

I agree. This started mostly due to the actor initially being hired to play a klingon and then became a human starfleet officer, and the rest is mostly speculation and not any inside info.

But I also remember that you vehemently opposed the fan theory about William on Westworld, so your track record on this is not good.