Spoilers The Flash - Season 3

[Phoenix219]

So... speedforce is like a cloud service?

Yup. Out side of our realm of time, and multiversal it has things like paradox RF, and Barry's dual memories during Flashpoint, and all sorts of other types of omniscient qualities. It may be connected to something 5th dimensional for all we know.... but yeah, thats actually not a terrible comparison to make...

 

[Tuskin38]

Except, in flashpoint wasn't Barry going to loose all his previous memories, not just gain the ones of his FP counterpart?

 

[Phoenix219]

Well, he was adapting to his new world. He wasn't becoming noncorporeal. He had no existance paradox. Both Eobard and Flashpoint Barry were being wiped from existance. Maybe its some sort of survival mechanism

Both Eobard and Savitar have been one with the speed force at some point or another. Wally got some of both worlds memories, even if in (ahah) flashes. Vibe obviously can remember other timelines. I'm willing to chalk it up to some time travel/speed force weirdness and move on.

Did Martin ever start gaining memories of his new daughter on Legends? like real ones?

 

[Timelord79 (he/him)]

Well, he was adapting to his new world. He wasn't becoming noncorporeal. He had no existance paradox. Both Eobard and Flashpoint Barry were being wiped from existance. Maybe its some sort of survival mechanism

Both Eobard and Savitar have been one with the speed force at some point or another. Wally got some of both worlds memories, even if in (ahah) flashes. Vibe obviously can remember other timelines. I'm willing to chalk it up to some time travel/speed force weirdness and move on.

Did Martin ever start gaining memories of his new daughter on Legends? like real ones?

Yes.
At this point he has a full set of memories of her I think.
She is real.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Lily is real, but even killing the adult now, is the prime directive for these hypocrites.

All abborations must be vanquished.

 

[Christopher]

A few thoughts I had on rewatching last week's episode:

I noticed that when Killer Frost created her ice slide, she had one hand extended forward and the other extended back behind her, firing the "frost" effect at the part of the ice that had already formed. I wonder if the idea there was to suggest that she was using some kind of cryokinetic power to hold the slide's shape together and keep it suspended. That doesn't quite satisfy my physics issues with its ability to stay up, but it's something.

Is HR still supposed to be holographically disguising his face when he goes out in public? The idea was supposed to be that only his friends see his true face. So is Tracy seeing his holographic disguise? And what about the future HR from 2024? He seemed to be open about his identity. How did his resemblance to the murderous "Harrison Wells" get resolved?

And how come they still have Savitar's broken-off arm blade in their lab, as we saw in the final scene with HR and Tracy last week? I thought it was drawn back to Savitar's armor, which was how Jesse tracked him down.

 

[Snaploud]

I assume Savitar promised Killer Frost that he would bring Ronnie back. And Savitar probably wants his parents back. This storyline is beginning to remind me of the spear of destiny on Legends.

 

[kirk55555]

Well, that episode was one big waste of time. Outside of the opening minutes, this was basically a filler episode right before the end. An old school clip show would have been about as relevant (and about as entertaining) as this. The adventures of amnesiac Barry were both irritaiting and pointless. This isn't the worst episode of the season (the musical and speed force episodes were worse in my opinion), but it sucked pretty hard.

Also, Caitlyn is really starting to suck as a villain. She needs to get fixed, quickly. Still, I'm excited for the last two episodes. Hopefully this season ends with a bang.

 

[Christopher]

And Savitar probably wants his parents back.

No, he doesn't, because if Barry never lost his parents, he never would've become the Flash, and then Savitar would never exist. Remember, the reason Savitar wants to kill Iris is so that Barry will be grieving and driven enough to create time remnants of himself to fight Savitar, thereby unwittingly creating Savitar. So Savitar/Barry has no interest in saving anyone but himself. Because he was treated as a leftover, aberrant time remnant, as not the real Barry Allen, he basically cut himself off from Barry Allen's life and created a new identity for himself as the God of Speed.


Amnesiac Barry -- or "Bart" -- was fun. Surprising to see such a goofy episode so deep in the big buildup to the climax.

 

[Shinzon4u]

I just can't get excited about these CW DC shows any more.
Arrow's first two seasons were fun, so was Flash's first season. (and part of its second).
But these writers just go round and round and round with the repetitive relationship drama and the shows just run out of steam.

Get Kevin Smith to write and direct a whole season of one of these shows or something. His Flash episode was excellent.

 

[Snaploud]

No, he doesn't, because if Barry never lost his parents, he never would've become the Flash, and then Savitar would never exist. Remember, the reason Savitar wants to kill Iris is so that Barry will be grieving and driven enough to create time remnants of himself to fight Savitar, thereby unwittingly creating Savitar. So Savitar/Barry has no interest in saving anyone but himself. Because he was treated as a leftover, aberrant time remnant, as not the real Barry Allen, he basically cut himself off from Barry Allen's life and created a new identity for himself as the God of Speed.

Savitar said that he wants to control time and that he became bad because Barry's friends ignored him. He also claimed that time rules matter less and less the more you mess with time. It seems to me that step 2 (after killing Iris and making himself possible) is to take control of reality so much that he can rewrite time to give himself parents, friends, etc. but still keep his existence, which would pretty much be spear of destiny plotline 2.0.

 

[Christopher]

Savitar said that he wants to control time and that he became bad because Barry's friends ignored him. He also claimed that time rules matter less and less the more you mess with time. It seems to me that step 2 (after killing Iris and making himself possible) is to take control of reality so much that he can rewrite time to give himself parents, friends, etc. but still keep his existence, which would pretty much be spear of destiny plotline 2.0.

As I just said, that doesn't fit the personality and motivation that was spelled out in the first scene of the episode. He's not interested in Barry's relationships. He murdered Iris specifically so that Barry would be bitter and alone, because that bitterness and solitude are what create Savitar. He's Barry's dark, nihilistic side, the part that grew out of loss and tragedy. He doesn't want to make that loss and tragedy go away, because it's what fuels his entire being. He's a solipsist. He declared himself a god, a being above and apart from all other beings. That is not the kind of psyche that is driven to seek out friends and family.

Besides, even if you were right, Barry rewriting time to restore his family isn't the Spear of Destiny plotline, it's the Flashpoint plotline. This show already did that story at the start of its season, so I doubt they'd repeat it at the end.

 

[Snaploud]

Besides, even if you were right, Barry rewriting time to restore his family isn't the Spear of Destiny plotline, it's the Flashpoint plotline. This show already did that story at the start of its season, so I doubt they'd repeat it at the end.

I suppose it would be a combination of Flashpoint and Spear of Destiny. I referenced Spear of Destiny because, as you also point out, Savitar would be risking his own existence by bringing his parents back using normal time travel rules. The Spear of Destiny was a plotline used to allow Thawne to rewrite time in such a way that also solidified his existence. Savitar would need some way to really mess with the force of time to get living parents and also stay alive.

I can see your point regarding the psyche we see on the screen, but I'm thinking some of it is a deliberate fiction. Savitar has given up playing by the normal rules of time, but he is still basically Barry with the same drives. He may have just convinced himself that none of this has to be real (including Iris) if he can become powerful enough to mold reality to his whim.

 

[Jax]

I don't understand why the time force just allows Savitar to run around messing with time, where are the dam Time Wraiths?

I loved the nods to the name of Bart who is the grandchild of Barry & Iris, right? Also that crystal at the end has more power than THE SUN? really? really?

 

[Tosk]

This season is such a disappointment. I can't recall another show that took such a sudden dive. Maybe Heroes?

I actually can't wait for the season to be over (because I have to finish it, even though I'm not digging it) and I'm not even sure I can be bothered with season 4 at this rate, unless maybe we get a writing staff turnover? Major bummer.

 

[tomalak301]

There was a Voyager reference and this episode reminded me a lot of the episode Riddles. Can someone write a concise version of Savitar's creation because I'm still really confused. Was this the remnant that helped Barry defeat Zoom?

 

[sojourner]

When they first showed that shot of the energy crystal at the end I thought it might be on Earth-38. Then King Shark showed up.

 

[LJones41]

This season is such a disappointment. I can't recall another show that took such a sudden dive. Maybe Heroes?

I actually can't wait for the season to be over (because I have to finish it, even though I'm not digging it) and I'm not even sure I can be bothered with season 4 at this rate, unless maybe we get a writing staff turnover? Major bummer.

You may want a writing staff turnover. I DON'T. I'm enjoying Season 3 just as much as I had enjoyed the previous two seasons. And "Heroes" was never as good as this show, as far as I'm concerned.

If you don't like the show, stop watching it. Hell, I did this with a lot of shows I used to watch. Unless you're like one of those STAR WARS Prequel bashers who constantly complain about how much they dislike the 1999-2005 movies, yet they keep talking about it and watching it.

 

[Snaploud]

The Flash is still the most entertaining Berlanti show, in my opinion. Arrow tends to be on the overly depressing side. Supergirl tends to be overly self-righteous without enough self-awareness. And I mostly watch Legends of Tomorrow for the sheer ridiculousness of the time travel logic (plus the show's healthy dose of cynical humor). The Flash, though, somehow still has enough charm to keep me looking forward to it in my DVR, and I don't feel like the writers have completely given up on internal consistency.

 

[Gryffindorian]

Can someone write a concise version of Savitar's creation because I'm still really confused. Was this the remnant that helped Barry defeat Zoom?

That's what I thought at first too. But this time remnant (TR) was one of the many that Future Flash (FF) created to fight Savitar. Savitar killed them all save for this one, who would later become Savitar himself. It was a closed time loop, as Cisco explained.

I must admit I liked Savitar-Barry. He was so dark, edgy, and bad-ass in a sexy kind of way.