The Delta Flyers now covering DS9

[Crewman6]

Yeah on good episodes they often either misunderstand things, get hung up on minor issues or make ridiculous suggestions. Here they mostly avoided those pitfalls and instead pointed out clear flaws and made sensible suggestions as to what could have made it better.

Exactly. The episode was so dumb even the Delta Flyers hosts couldn't get it wrong.

Though I did find it amusing that, given they usually complain we don't see enough Cirroc they pretty much nothing positive to say about his role here.

Ha. True.

It's so frustrating that there are painfully few episodes that showcase Jake and yet Cirroc got stuck with this turd. And the best Jake episode of them all (The Visitor) barely has Cirroc in it at all!

 

[ananta]

Exactly. The episode was so dumb even the Delta Flyers hosts couldn't get it wrong.

Ha. True.

It's so frustrating that there are painfully few episodes that showcase Jake and yet Cirroc got stuck with this turd. And the best Jake episode of them all (The Visitor) barely has Cirroc in it at all!

I know, right? Maybe we won’t hear the complaints at not enough Jake for a while. (Not that I don’t agree he deserved more material). Wait until they get to season seven and he barely utters five words all season.

 

[VDCNI]

So a good TV episode, For The Cause, was paired with a, mostly, good episode of the podcast.

I hadn't heard Penny Johnson interviewed about DS9 before so possibly this is old news for some people but her comments about her and Avery Brooks realising their chemistry was so off the charts they had to limit their off screen interactions for the safety of their respective marriages were fascinating. Overall she was a complete delight.

The regulars were mostly in check this time. Garrett of course got things wrong, suggesting Kasidy was the first black female captain and maybe even the first female captain in Star Trek when if course it was Madge Sinclair in the Voyage Home. It seemed like he had looked this up but maybe he just read a bad AI summary.

Fair enough they don't have a fans knowledge of facts like that but when he suggested Kasidy first appeared in season 1 or Armin thought this episode was setting up the Marquis for Voyager you do have to wonder about these guys memories.

The only really rage inducing moments were when Armin yet again questioned Odo's involvement in Starfleet activities. It's been 4 years now and Kira and Odo have consistently been treated as part of the station command staff in line with the Starfleet characters so surely you should have got that by now and no Robbie we don't need extra dialogue in every episode to explain that!

 

[Tosk]

Wait until they get to season seven and he barely utters five words all season.

To reply to you as though you're being literal: Jake may not get an episode of his own in season seven but he has plenty of lines in at least four episodes.
(Image in the Sand, Shadows and Symbols, Take Me out to the Holosuite, and It's Only a Paper Moon.)

To take you in the spirit of what you're saying: Yeah, Jake didn't get much of substance to do in the final season.

 

[no2catsuitKira]

It's been a while since I posted, but just going to give my $0.02 on the podcast. I generally find Armin's commentary annoying. The Voyager guys do too much at times, particularly Harry.

 

[Crewman6]

So a good TV episode, For The Cause, was paired with a, mostly, good episode of the podcast.

It was a very enjoyable episode and Penny was an absolute delight.

I hadn't heard Penny Johnson interviewed about DS9 before so possibly this is old news for some people but her comments about her and Avery Brooks realising their chemistry was so off the charts they had to limit their off screen interactions for the safety of their respective marriages were fascinating.

I found that revelation hilarious.

The regulars were mostly in check this time. Garrett of course got things wrong, suggesting Kasidy was the first black female captain and maybe even the first female captain in Star Trek when if course it was Madge Sinclair in the Voyage Home. It seemed like he had looked this up but maybe he just read a bad AI summary.

Yeah, it was pretty ridiculous. Plenty of female captains in Trek before then. And Kasidy was just a private captain, not a Starfleet officer.

Fair enough they don't have a fans knowledge of facts like that but when he suggested Kasidy first appeared in season 1 or Armin thought this episode was setting up the Marquis for Voyager you do have to wonder about these guys memories.

Yeah, I think they even mentioned the date of when Voyager premiered. This episode was long after that and was certainly not at all part of "setting up" the Maquis for Voyager. That was accomplished already in the episode called, fittingly enough, "The Maquis", which these guys previously discussed in detail!

The only really rage inducing moments were when Armin yet again questioned Odo's involvement in Starfleet activities. It's been 4 years now and Kira and Odo have consistently been treated as part of the station command staff in line with the Starfleet characters so surely you should have got that by now and no Robbie we don't need extra dialogue in every episode to explain that!

Yup. Those arguments are really growing tiresome. He even wonders why Odo is involved in the investigation about the Maquis operative on the station at all. Uh, dude is CHIEF OF SECURITY, of course it's in his purview.

On occasion, the show does strain credulity in these areas, but most of the time it works perfectly and Armin seems to not realize that, in a TV show, you sometimes bend reality ever so slightly in order to showcase your main characters. You'd think someone with a 40 or 50 year long career as an actor would get that. But, nope, it's as if he's watching his very first TV show ever each time out of the gate.

 

[ananta]

To reply to you as though you're being literal: Jake may not get an episode of his own in season seven but he has plenty of lines in at least four episodes.
(Image in the Sand, Shadows and Symbols, Take Me out to the Holosuite, and It's Only a Paper Moon.)

To take you in the spirit of what you're saying: Yeah, Jake didn't get much of substance to do in the final season.

Yeah, I was being more than a tad hyperbolic. Jake was horrendously undeserved by the final season though. I’m glad at least he got the final shot with Kira.

Enjoyed the “For The Uniform” discussion; Penny was an absolute joy. I love that episode; so well done and Avery is superb in particular.

I enjoyed Terry and Garrett discussing “To the Death” and an appearance by the wonderful Jeffrey Combs. Robbie, though…when he doesn’t like an episode his energy flatlines and it’s as though somebody has died. TTD is flawed, mainly the rushed conclusion and some dodgy fight editing, but in no way is it a 5. The characterisation is just way too much fun and the performances awesome. It’s just such an entertaining episode.

 

[Crewman6]

Yeah, I was being more than a tad hyperbolic. Jake was horrendously undeserved by the final season though. I’m glad at least he got the final shot with Kira.

Enjoyed the “For The Uniform” discussion; Penny was an absolute joy. I love that episode; so well done and Avery is superb in particular.

I enjoyed Terry and Garrett discussing “To the Death” and an appearance by the wonderful Jeffrey Combs. Robbie, though…when he doesn’t like an episode his energy flatlines and it’s as though somebody has died. TTD is flawed, mainly the rushed conclusion and some dodgy fight editing, but in no way is it a 5. The characterisation is just way too much fun and the performances awesome. It’s just such an entertaining episode.

I've only listened to half the episode, but Robbie started out by saying he doesn't like it and you can always tell.

Looking forward to the Combs interview for sure, though.

I think the episode is....just okay. It does accomplish the writers' goal of fleshing out the Jem'Hadar, though. But Clarence Williams is absolutely excellent as the Jem'Hadar first and, with the possible exception of Ramata'klan rom "Rocks and Shoals", is easily the most truly compelling Jem'Hadar they ever gave us. I'd give it more than a "5", though.

 

[VDCNI]

Yeah Robbie seems to be criticising it for not going down the standard Star Trek route with Starfleet and the Jem'Hadar coming to some kind of understanding when the point of the story is that even though there may be moments when it looks like they have common ground at the end of the day the Jem'Hadar will still kill you without mercy when ordered to.

He also doesn't like romps i don't think, didn't he also have issues with Civil Defense, where sometimes the writers gloss over the details in places in order to up the pace. Where he thought a station set B Story was going to fit I don't know!

Oh well Terry and Garrett seemed to get the point of the episode at least. Nice to hear from Jeff Combes as well.

 

[Tuskin38]

im a several episodes behind, on Hard Time. But I can’t believe we’re 4 seasons in and they still haven’t realized Majel does not voice DS9’s computer.

Garret reads the credit for Judi Durand at the start as computer voice, and they’re all very confused lol. Then later on Robbie assumes she was the prison voice.

Funnily enough Judi did voice the federation/starfleet computer in various video games in the 90s/2000s.

 

[ananta]

I’m just about done with Robbie’s downvoting. He wanted to give The Quickening lower than 5. I’d ask if he’s even SEEN his own show, but obviously he has. Starting to think he genuinely doesn’t care that much for DS9 for whatever reason. Thank goodness for Terry’s enthusiasm. The Quickening was a superb episode with some nuanced writing and stunning performances. Ekoria’s death breaks me each time I watch.

 

[VDCNI]

You're kidding me.

For what possible reason could he have that negative a view of The Quickening!? It has more drama in it than seven seasons of Voyager.

Lately his understanding and instincts around the writing and stories have often been completely wrong.

 

[ananta]

You're kidding me.

For what possible reason could he have that negative a view of The Quickening!? It has more drama in it than seven seasons of Voyager.

Lately his understanding and instincts around the writing and stories have often been completely wrong.

I’m not even really sure, other than he disliked the writing and directing and just nitpicked over silly minutiae, such as the fact the episode was set over a number of weeks (something I liked). While he comes across a pleasant guy, I’ve started finding him a little annoying and conceited in his views. Just because he’s a producer now he seems to have quite rigid views about storytelling, when I think he misses the point quite often. Some of his suggestions are quite dumb. He seems to want a b-story just about every episode, including this one. Terrible instinct; a b-story would have absolutely taken away from the emotional intensity of the main storyline. And there’s only 42 minutes to tell a complete story as it is. But Ho hum.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

I’m not even really sure, other than he disliked the writing and directing and just nitpicked over silly minutiae, such as the fact the episode was set over a number of weeks (something I liked). While he comes across a pleasant guy, I’ve started finding him a little annoying and conceited in his views. Just because he’s a producer now he seems to have quite rigid views about storytelling, when I think he misses the point quite often. Some of his suggestions are quite dumb. He seems to want a b-story just about every episode, including this one. Terrible instinct; a b-story would have absolutely taken away from the emotional intensity of the main storyline. And there’s only 42 minutes to tell a complete story as it is. But Ho hum.

There was a b-story. Quark hacked the station's computer. It was friggin' funny.

ETA: If I were to be generous, he isn't enjoying the podcast, doing it mostly for Garrett. He should quit.

 

[VDCNI]

I’m not even really sure, other than he disliked the writing and directing and just nitpicked over silly minutiae, such as the fact the episode was set over a number of weeks (something I liked). While he comes across a pleasant guy, I’ve started finding him a little annoying and conceited in his views. Just because he’s a producer now he seems to have quite rigid views about storytelling, when I think he misses the point quite often. Some of his suggestions are quite dumb. He seems to want a b-story just about every episode, including this one. Terrible instinct; a b-story would have absolutely taken away from the emotional intensity of the main storyline. And there’s only 42 minutes to tell a complete story as it is. But Ho hum.

One thing is for sure the more this has gone on the less inclined I am to watch any show he has produced.

Maybe it is boredom of the podcast, it does seem to be recently he has misunderstood episodes more or made odd, and often conflicting suggestions for 'improving' them.

 

[ananta]

ETA: If I were to be generous, he isn't enjoying the podcast, doing it mostly for Garrett. He should quit.

I think you hit the nail on the head. It would explain a lot. The podcast must make them some nice pocket money, if you see what some people pay for the higher tiers, but he’s not passionate about it and most weeks now is pretty much phoning it in. He only seems to light up if they have another Trek guest. But I don’t think he can really be bothered with the series itself and it sadly shows. There are obviously things he’d rather be doing.

 

[VDCNI]

I started listening but had to have a break. I mean how do these guys cope with watching TV normally.

Garrett - they should have looked alien, how did they know Bashir and Dax were not from their planet.

Robbie - yes they could have been all green or something.

Oh I don't know, maybe they knew because they didn't have the same facial marks of the Blight as everyone else on the planet!!!!

Terry and Robbie, it was confusing what Kira said, I thought they were all going to hide in the nebula.

Well apart from the fact that it was clearly stated in dialogue that Kira was leaving them on the planet.

And only a third in there have been many other similarly stupid comments.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Ok, this episode gave me my new signature!

Theory: RDM is acting like Berman. His experience of Star Trek is Berman hanging over his shoulder, so he thinks he needs to act just like Berman.

 

[Crewman6]

I’m just about done with Robbie’s downvoting. He wanted to give The Quickening lower than 5. I’d ask if he’s even SEEN his own show, but obviously he has. Starting to think he genuinely doesn’t care that much for DS9 for whatever reason. Thank goodness for Terry’s enthusiasm. The Quickening was a superb episode with some nuanced writing and stunning performances. Ekoria’s death breaks me each time I watch.

There are a few odd structural hiccups in the episode, owing to the fact that they have no B story to cut away from and often have to just to a time jump in the same location.

So it's a little jumpy in spots.

Big friggin' whoop. An extremely minor issue with an otherwise very, very good episode.

Robbie definitely loses the forest for the trees often.

I had the same thought about Voyager. Given his often deeply unfair negativity, I can't imagine how he made it through 7 seasons of Voyager. If he were consistent, he'd have to rate 90% of the episodes of that show as a 3 or lower.

 

[Crewman6]

I started listening but had to have a break. I mean how do these guys cope with watching TV normally.

Just wait until you hear Armin talk. He acts like he has never seen a TV show sometimes with his braindead nitpicks.

Garrett - they should have looked alien, how did they know Bashir and Dax were not from their planet.

Robbie - yes they could have been all green or something.

Oh I don't know, maybe they knew because they didn't have the same facial marks of the Blight as everyone else on the planet!!!!

What no one seemed to figure out was that if the Blight victims had green skin or alien appendages, it would have distracted from the focus of the episode, which was that these people all had a terrible, degenerative disease. Any additional makeup beyond the "blight" markings would have gotten in the way.

Terry and Robbie, it was confusing what Kira said, I thought they were all going to hide in the nebula.

Well apart from the fact that it was clearly stated in dialogue that Kira was leaving them on the planet.

This was baffling. It's not remotely unclear what the plan is.

And only a third in there have been many other similarly stupid comments.

Par for the course.