Sussman Responds to Cogley!

[PreHensile]

All right. Let's sort through this unfortunate mess, shall we?

From JohnM:
My guess for your age is about 15.
Thanking writers and producers for taking their time to come and talk on a BBS is NOT kissing ass.
Once you graduate High school you might have the intelligence to understand this.
Maybe not.
Kids like YOU ruin all the fun for everyone else.

One flaming warning for JohnM.

From Dr. Bashir
JohnM, I have read enough of your rants and silly posts here in this forum and in TNZ to know you just aren't worth bothering with.

One flaming warning for Dr. Bashir.

From SilveRisa
Dude, I don't know you, but I do know that a) your comments in this thread have nothing to do with the subject of the thread, and are therefore not sanctioned, and b) that is a really offensive comment to make, regarding "special ed" class. Why are you even drawing such a comparison? Don't knock the kids in special ed, they try their hardest every day. But no one's as great as you are, huh? Your atrocious sense of propriety displayed in making such an uncouth comment like THAT one makes you look pretty "special" too, Dr. You ought to matriculate in the "I need my ass kicked" "special ed" class. If they need a prof, just let my know. I'll clear my calendar.

One flaming warning for SilveRisa.


It's extremely scary to see just how easy it is for people to lose any sense of maturity here. How hard is it to just not respond to a post you find laughable, crass or cruel? Sniping back adds nothing but more headaches. Simply put, STOP IT. NO ONE WANTS TO READ IT.

For clarification's sake, I will reiterate the general rule of the board, including this forum...

Discussing show without hostility or personal attacks: Good

Going on snipe hunts, hate fests, and insult sprees: Bad

From Samuel T. Cogley
Rather than kiss his ass, or bash his episode, why not take advantage of the fact that we have the writer's ear and let's really make some intelligent posts and/or commentary? At the very least, let's try to be civil. Let's give a reason to want to come back here, not fifty reasons to make him wish he never showed up here in the first place.

Well said, Sam.

 

[pookha]

maybe a combination of section 31 and a san fran earthquake and fire

 

[flcat]

Posted by Temis the Vorta:

However, there are still those little problems with continuity (with the caveat that there are problems only if you assume Starfleet is not composed of total idiots; I guess strictly speaking, that could be consistent with continuity).

I still can't believe Starfleet wouldn't have a database capable storing the video images of the Borg and allowing future crews to simply use face recognition technology to compare the viewscreen image of that first Borg (in BOBW, right? Long time ago - but somebody did the You Will Be Assimilated routine in that eppy, I'm pretty sure) with all known species and should quickly get a match just on looks alone. It's not like the Borg can be mistaken for anyone else...[/b]

Yes, I'm sure those weird cyborg thingies were considered a great threat by Starfleet. However, I can imagine that they were pushed off the plate by other more pressing matters. Let's see, coming down the road we have looming conflicts with the Romulan Star Empire and the Klingons -- real conflicts with major casualties. Starfleet eventually encounters Blalock and the technilogically advanced First Federation (whose representative consistently threatened to destroy Enterprise during first contact -- corbomite manuever).

Then think about all the other potential threats that Starfleet will face. Let's start with the godlike beings: the Thasians (who seem to have the ability to give humans unlimited mental power - Charlie X), the Organians (who refuse to allow the Federation to exercise its sovereign right to wage a nice friendly war with those distardly Klingons), the Talosians (whose planet definitely ISN'T on the Federation's list of top tourist stops), the Metrons (who introduced us to the Gorn and who were ready to wipe us out if Kirk lost the fight in Arena), the Melkotians (who can make humans think themselves to death - Spectre of the Gun), the Vians (who think humans make dandy guinea pigs - The Empath), and the Excalbians (who bring new definition to the term "too hot to handle").

Also, think of all the other machine races/androids/cyborgs that Starfleet has to keep track of: the androids of the First Ones (what are little girls made of); all those ultra-smart world-dominating super computers (that fortunately tended to exhibit a weakness that allowed James T. Kirk to talk them into self-destruting); the androids of I, Mudd (who were ready to subjugate the Federation to better serve its citizens); and all those pesky evolved and self-aware nanites created by Federation scientists (the Borg nanno probes seem positively tame in comparison).

In light of this, do I think it's possible that a mysterious species, encountered only once during a several hundred year history, might tend to fall off the radar screen? Yes!

 

[JohnM]

Posted by PreHensile:
All right. Let's sort through this unfortunate mess, shall we?

From JohnM:
My guess for your age is about 15.
Thanking writers and producers for taking their time to come and talk on a BBS is NOT kissing ass.
Once you graduate High school you might have the intelligence to understand this.
Maybe not.
Kids like YOU ruin all the fun for everyone else.

One flaming warning for JohnM.

From Dr. Bashir
JohnM, I have read enough of your rants and silly posts here in this forum and in TNZ to know you just aren't worth bothering with.

One flaming warning for Dr. Bashir.

From SilveRisa
Dude, I don't know you, but I do know that a) your comments in this thread have nothing to do with the subject of the thread, and are therefore not sanctioned, and b) that is a really offensive comment to make, regarding "special ed" class. Why are you even drawing such a comparison? Don't knock the kids in special ed, they try their hardest every day. But no one's as great as you are, huh? Your atrocious sense of propriety displayed in making such an uncouth comment like THAT one makes you look pretty "special" too, Dr. You ought to matriculate in the "I need my ass kicked" "special ed" class. If they need a prof, just let my know. I'll clear my calendar.

One flaming warning for SilveRisa.


It's extremely scary to see just how easy it is for people to lose any sense of maturity here. How hard is it to just not respond to a post you find laughable, crass or cruel? Sniping back adds nothing but more headaches. Simply put, STOP IT. NO ONE WANTS TO READ IT.

For clarification's sake, I will reiterate the general rule of the board, including this forum...

Discussing show without hostility or personal attacks: Good

Going on snipe hunts, hate fests, and insult sprees: Bad

From Samuel T. Cogley
Rather than kiss his ass, or bash his episode, why not take advantage of the fact that we have the writer's ear and let's really make some intelligent posts and/or commentary? At the very least, let's try to be civil. Let's give a reason to want to come back here, not fifty reasons to make him wish he never showed up here in the first place.

Well said, Sam.

Whatever

I made a statement. Not a 'Flame'

Ill take it up with the Admin. This is just stupid.

 

[Bears Discover Fire]

Thank you, Mr. Sussman, for taking the time to address us fans. I can't say I cared much for the episode myself, but your deft handling of criticism have earned you my respect. I echo the sentiments of this forum as a whole when I say your prescence here and your explanations are much appreciated and welcomed.

Don't let the grade-school banter in this thread convince you otherwise.

 

[where'sSaavik?]

If you have a problem, John, you need to take it to MA. Let's try to keep this thread on topic. Thanks.

 

[JohnM]

Posted by Bears Discover Fire:
Thank you, Mr. Sussman, for taking the time to address us fans. I can't say I cared much for the episode myself, but your deft handling of criticism have earned you my respect. I echo the sentiments of this forum as a whole when I say your prescence here and your explanations are much appreciated and welcomed.

Don't let the grade-school banter in this thread convince you otherwise.

Well said.

 

[Samuel T. Cogley]

Posted by defenestrated_one:
Agreed. It isn't canon (yet) but it is far more powerful than speculation. Really, I don't think I addressed that well at all. I was never trying to say what the writer tells us doesn't matter.

You're right, you weren't.

I have this terrible habit of starting to respond to one person's post, and then suddenly switching modes to addressing the previous comments that others have made in the thread without announcing that I'm doing so.

In doing so, I unintentionally accuse the original poster of things that he or she never did.

Several of the comments that I made in response to your post were actually made in response to other comments that people had made throughout the thread.

I apologize for the unintended implications toward you in my post.

Still love your username. I threw a "defenestration" into my "Regeneration" review just for you.

 

[Guest]

^Don't worry about it. I'm just glad to know my communicative skills aren't as bad as I thought they were for a bit! Besides, anyone who uses the word "defenestration" (hell, even knows what it means) can't be bad.

Anyway, I do think I was too harsh in my original post - not in the way I worded it but in the ideas. You're response wasn't mean and it made me think. I like things that make me think.

 

[JohnM]

I guess im considered what, A "Gusher"

Ok, fine with me. I love Enterprise and support the hard working people who bring us 1 hour of Trek a week.

If thats ass kissing, Fine. Im an ass kisser.

I think Mr Sussman did a wonderful job writing another great Enterprise episode. He really put the effort into writing a quality episode without screwing up the timeline and people still will argue the point. He even posted the facts and his opinions about the episode weeks before it even aired.

Then Mr Sussman has to start a thread to correct and to inform people who still DID NOT understand the events in Regeneration.
That really sucks. I feel for you Sussman. You did such a wonderful job writing a Star Trek story and then have to come to the BBS and start a thread to correct and inform people who just dont understand.

Thanks for a wonderful story and keep up the good work.

And after looking at the Regeneration ratings poll, Most people agree with me. WE LOVED Regeneration.

 

[Dr. Bashir]

Posted by where'sSaavik?:
If you have a problem, John, you need to take it to MA. Let's try to keep this thread on topic. Thanks.

I might take my warning to the MA. I don't know, I'm tired right now. I was about to rejoin this discussion, (not the argumentative stuff, but the discussion stuff) but then I notice I got slapped with a warning.

I didn't even flame the guy. I simply told him that I had had enough of him and would not further continue. That wasn't flamming, jeez I was the one that put an end to it by refusing to continue. Why did PreHensile give me a warning for that? He called PreHensile a "high school kid". (I don't know if he really is a high school kid, but I'm guessing he's not one, in which case that is a nasty insult to anyone over the age of 18)

The guy flammed away again. I'm surprised you didn't give him a second warning. I'm tired, so I don't know if I want to challenge this, but if that is a flame on my part, that has to be one of the lightest flames ever.

EDIT: whoops, I got you and the other moderator PreHensile confused.

 

[JohnM]

Posted by SammoSammo:
Tiz a pity that Mr. Sussman had to explain what transpired in Regeneration. To us non trekkers, trekkies, whatever, we understood all the above without his having to explain to Mr.Samuel T. It was as plain as the nose on your face while watching Regeneration.

Im glad someone else agrees with me.

 

[Samuel T. Cogley]

Posted by JohnM:
Then Mr Sussman has to start a thread to correct and to inform people who still DID NOT understand the events in Regeneration.
That really sucks. I feel for you Sussman. You did such a wonderful job writing a Star Trek story and then have to come to the BBS and start a thread to correct and inform people who just dont understand.

I hope you don't think I'm picking a fight with you, JohnM, because I'm not -- and if this turns into one, I'll simply bail out rather than add to the nonsense in this thread -- but I really think you are missing the point of what Mike Sussman is trying to do here.

The very first comment in Mike Sussman's post is this:

A very entertaining review, Sam. A couple of clarifications I'd like to make:

Can't you see that he enjoyed the review? He couldn't be more clear about this.

And he isn't an angry, frustrated writer who "has to start a thread to correct and to inform people," as you make him out to be.

It is very clear that he is simply making "[a] couple of clarifications." This couldn't be more plain.

He acknowledges that many of the cuts that were made cause things to be unclear, and many of the other issues are not explained at all. Besides, he leaves the bulk of my review untouched. You can interpret that any way you like, but the fact that he doesn't take issue with the heart of my review -- in fact he finds it "very entertaining" -- should indicate to you that you are way off base with your insinuations on the matter.

Your continued assertions that I "DID NOT understand the events in Regeneration" is borderline trolling, and is not backed up by anything here beyond your own imagination.

Please go back and read Mike Sussman's comments again. I'm sure he appreciates your enthusiasm, but you are adding a tone to his words that is simply not there.

 

[Hbomb]

Posted by JohnM:

Posted by Bears Discover Fire:
Thank you, Mr. Sussman, for taking the time to address us fans. I can't say I cared much for the episode myself, but your deft handling of criticism have earned you my respect. I echo the sentiments of this forum as a whole when I say your prescence here and your explanations are much appreciated and welcomed.

Don't let the grade-school banter in this thread convince you otherwise.

Well said.

Uh, he's referring to you, too.

You really are embarrassing yourself here, JohnM. You'd think a self-proclaimed "gusher" would act a little more sophisticated in his hero's thread.

While you're at it, why don't you tell Sussman about how you tried to sell all the TrekBBS members knock-off NX-01 hats in the first season.

 

[JohnM]

Posted by Samuel T. Cogley:

Posted by JohnM:
Then Mr Sussman has to start a thread to correct and to inform people who still DID NOT understand the events in Regeneration.
That really sucks. I feel for you Sussman. You did such a wonderful job writing a Star Trek story and then have to come to the BBS and start a thread to correct and inform people who just dont understand.

I hope you don't think I'm picking a fight with you, JohnM, because I'm not -- and if this turns into one, I'll simply bail out rather than add to the nonsense in this thread -- but I really think you are missing the point of what Mike Sussman is trying to do here.

The very first comment in Mike Sussman's post is this:

A very entertaining review, Sam. A couple of clarifications I'd like to make:

Can't you see that he enjoyed the review? He couldn't be more clear about this.

And he isn't an angry, frustrated writer who "has to start a thread to correct and to inform people," as you make him out to be.

It is very clear that he is simply making "[a] couple of clarifications." This couldn't be more plain.

He acknowledges that many of the cuts that were made cause things to be unclear, and many of the other issues are not explained at all. Besides, he leaves the bulk of my review untouched. You can interpret that any way you like, but the fact that he doesn't take issue with the heart of my review -- in fact he finds it "very entertaining" -- should indicate to you that you are way off base with your insinuations on the matter.

Your continued assertions that I "DID NOT understand the events in Regeneration" is borderline trolling, and is not backed up by anything here beyond your own imagination.

Please go back and read Mike Sussman's comments again. I'm sure he appreciates your enthusiasm, but you are adding a tone to his words that is simply not there.

I completely understand. He's not here to "add the tone to his words"

Im sure after reading some of the members negative responses he will correct them too.

I know what he was doing . He was filling in the gaps which people didnt pick up on.

And Im also pretty sure he was responding to all the negative Regeneration threads at one time. He just picked your review to post his comments. There's many other threads which pointed out the same thing you did. I doubt he wants to go to every Regeneration thread to explain the events in the story.


So Yes, I do know what Mr Sussman was doing. He really didnt need too do it though.

I understood the episode. Many other members understood the episode and loved it. I dont know why there's a few who do not understand.

 

[JohnM]

Posted by Hbomb:

Posted by JohnM:

Posted by Bears Discover Fire:
Thank you, Mr. Sussman, for taking the time to address us fans. I can't say I cared much for the episode myself, but your deft handling of criticism have earned you my respect. I echo the sentiments of this forum as a whole when I say your prescence here and your explanations are much appreciated and welcomed.

Don't let the grade-school banter in this thread convince you otherwise.

Well said.

Uh, he's referring to you, too.

You really are embarrassing yourself here, JohnM. You'd think a self-proclaimed "gusher" would act a little more sophisticated in his hero's thread.

While you're at it, why don't you tell Sussman about how you tried to sell all the TrekBBS members knock-off NX-01 hats in the first season.

Are you sure? I dont quite think so.

And YES!!! Mr Berman, Braga, Paramount, Bakula, and about 50 BBS members all got the hats.

I didnt know any of the writing team at the time.

Paramount was quite impressed with them considering I got TM rights to make the hats but named different. You can not TM the words "NX-01" Paramount got the TM rights to make the "Crew Hat" and I got TM rights to produce "NX Prototype Hats"

Why cant you just stick to the topic?

If Mr Sussman wants a hat I can always send him one too. Sorry I didnt get you one 2 years ago.

 

[Samuel T. Cogley]

Posted by JohnM:
And Im also pretty sure he was responding to all the negative Regeneration threads at one time. He just picked your review to post his comments. There's many other threads which pointed out the same thing you did. I doubt he wants to go to every Regeneration thread to explain the events in the story.

Actually, it's pretty clear that he was responding to my review, and my review alone.

Note the title of the thread:

Sussman Responds to Cogley!

You can take that however you like, but I, for one, am intensely proud of the fact that he not only went out of his way to read a pretty harsh review of the episode that he wrote, but that he then took the time to come here and put together a well thought-out response to some of the issues I brought up.

Not only that, but he did so with a great sense of humor and a very big attitude about the whole thing.

I stand by my original comments in my review, and I still don't think the episode should have been made, but I couldn't be more impressed about the way Mike Sussman has handled himself with respect to this episode, from well before the episode aired, and continuing well after the fall-out.

So Yes, I do know what Mr Sussman was doing.

I'm sorry, John, but it couldn't be more obvious that you don't.

 

[JohnM]

Posted by Samuel T. Cogley:

Posted by JohnM:
And Im also pretty sure he was responding to all the negative Regeneration threads at one time. He just picked your review to post his comments. There's many other threads which pointed out the same thing you did. I doubt he wants to go to every Regeneration thread to explain the events in the story.

Actually, it's pretty clear that he was responding to my review, and my review alone.

Note the title of the thread:

Sussman Responds to Cogley!

You can take that however you like, but I, for one, am intensely proud of the fact that he not only went out of his way to read a pretty harsh review of the episode that he wrote, but that he then took the time to come here and put together a well-thought out response to some of the issues I brought up.

Not only that, he did so with a great sense of humor and a very big attitude about the whole thing.

I stand by my original comments in my review, and I still don't think the episode should have been made, but I couldn't be more impressed about the way Mike Sussman has handled himself with respect to this episode, from well before the episode aired, and continuing well after the fall-out.

So Yes, I do know what Mr Sussman was doing.

I'm sorry, John, but it couldn't be more obvious that you don't.

Ok, and why do you think he picked yours?? Maybe because you're one of the main members who does it?

He made a thread to address the issues concerning Regeneration. Ok, yes, He said "Sussman responds to Cogley" but dude, he was really responding to all the fans of the show who expressed their opinions in many other threads. Not just to you personally.

Your comments were the same as many other members. He addressed everyone's questions about Regeneration by choosing your review to use.

 

[Samuel T. Cogley]

Posted by JohnM:
He made a thread to address the issues concerning Regeneration. Ok, yes, He said "Sussman responds to Cogley" but dude, he was really responding to all the fans of the show who expressed their opinions in many other threads. Not just to you personally.

Your comments were the same as many other members. He addressed everyone's questions about Regeneration by choosing your review to use.

Never mind, JohnM. Your continued failure to respond to reason, logic, and evidence only confirms my initial fear that I should never have tried to discuss this with you in the first place.

Rather than waste any more time on this, I'm going to just cut you loose and let you continue to do whatever it is that you do.

 

[Classic Fan]

This has nothing to do with this episode as i, like Stewie, am against all things Enterprise.
Just saying...
Great to see you Mr. Sussman.