STSNW's episodic storytelling or STD and STP's Serialized Seasons

[Captain Jollydark]

There's a lot of words/phrases I would use to describeTNG.

" The best Star Trek..."

Ins't one of them.

I have my issues with STD, but the to bad ratio for the first 52 episodes is better than the entire 178 episode run of TNG.

For me TNG in general has very low rewatch value (And its the same with PiC). Yes the series has some really good episodes that they are very much few and far between. In fact some of the episodes I thought were honestly okay, have become less rewatchable for me as time moves on.

This is also my opinion and experience of TNG. I watched each episode when it aired, but find there are only a few I don't find a little embarrassing in rewatch. But I will rewatch TOS anytime. I really love SNW and think it will be more like TOS for me in that regard. I also love STDiscovery and enjoy rewatching in blocks of episodes rather than randomly.

 

[ichab]

There's a lot of words/phrases I would use to describeTNG.

" The best Star Trek..."

Isnt one of them.

I agree. DS9 was the best Star Trek. IMO

I have my issues with STD, but the to bad ratio for the first 52 episodes is better than the entire 178 episode run of TNG.

Hard disagree on that. Seasons 1 and 2 of TNG maybe(the holier than thou vibe was a turnoff). But seasons 3 and 4 are far superior to anything DISC has done to this point.

TOS OTOH to this day still has a very high rewatch value for me even though I've been watching the episodes since 1969 at age 6.

Some episodes I enjoy going back for a rewatch, but that show also has some major flaws, particularly Shatner's overacting, lack of character development for anyone not named Kirk, Spock or McCoy and episodes that are just downright stupid (Spock's Brain, I,Mudd, Way to Eden etc.)

SNW the date has really hit the back jackpot for me as far as rewatchability is concerned. I know at one point there will probably be a bad episode; but so far it's 4 for 4, and overall it has the best start of any Star Trek franchise series to date.
YMMV.

I agree on this one. If it manages to reach 10/10, it would become the best first season of any Star Trek to date.

 

[Starship]

Well, i think that Picard is a good serialized show and, till now, Strange New Worlds is an excellent show in episodic format.
But Discovery still keeps a bad storytelling and characters without charisma. So, the trouble isn´t the format per se, but the content.

 

[Jadeb]

Yeah, I can’t really vote because there’s no good option for me. I’m all in favor of serialized Trek but don’t think it has been done well so far.

Peak Trek to me is II, III and IV, a trilogy that is both episodic and serialized while leaning heavily into character drama. (And, notably, it’s way more expansive In story and tone than a typical serialized season, while also being significantly shorter.)

 

[Haggis and tatties]

SNV for the win all day long, as i continue to have no interest in the STD or Picard formats, but i will say my main issue with both those shows is more that i just don't like the characters in them at all, as opposed to their story telling methods.

 

[valkyrie013]

Had a thought..
The main point/story of Disco season4 could be done in SNW in a 2 maybe 3 parter. Jettison all the filler.
Sorry but the writers seem to be pretty good at episodic writing but suck vacuum at 10-13 long serialized.

 

[Rhodan]

Idea versus execution. My only problem with SNW is that, being prequel again, it can´t use non-canonical changes for large galaxy. On the other hand, unlike Enterprise, it doesn´t pretend to have a thought-out unifying story and wants to actually use an interesting ideas for the writing, so it´s actually an ideal format.

I generally like serialized storytelling but I think Discovery´s execution of that is mixed bag.

Picard has some interesting ideas it´s arcs, however I would say say the show is fundamentally bad. I´m sorry. So I guess I theoretically love both.

 

[Jarvisimo]

I feel this is worth sharing here:

https://www.rollingstone.com/tv/tv-features/the-wire-20-anniversary-1361361/

As some of you may know, Sepinwall is one of the most significant TV critics in America, but he's been an increasingly vocal critic of over-serialisation in the last decade. This article, on the Wire, explains some of that frustration, although his review of SNW did some of that too.

 

[TRON JA307020]

I feel this is worth sharing here:

https://www.rollingstone.com/tv/tv-features/the-wire-20-anniversary-1361361/

As some of you may know, Sepinwall is one of the most significant TV critics in America, but he's been an increasingly vocal critic of over-serialisation in the last decade. This article, on the Wire, explains some of that frustration, although his review of SNW did some of that too.

He's right. Some shows like Breaking Bad,The Sopranos, Better Call Saul and of course The Wire did serialization brilliantly. The reason is each season did not focus on just one mission. Characters all had moments abd something interesting going on. Very little padding going on to try and stretch the story out. STD and STP have stuck eith the on mission story line per season abd irs like they are trying to stretch ac2 hour movie into 8 or 10 hours. It isn't working.

 

[AlanC9]

Thanks. I've liked Sepinwall's work for a long time, but I missed that.

 

[fireproof78]

It isn't working.

Can you say what is working with out constant comparisons to DSC? See, here's the thing. We have a brand new Star Trek series that is supposedly one of the best (some say "best ever") and yet we're still talking about Star Trek's failings? What the fuck is that about? It's like if your kid had an incredible game of soccer and you keep talking about how terrible they were at baseball last year. If Star Trek is going well shouldn't we be praising it for doing well?

 

[TRON JA307020]

Can you say what is working with out constant comparisons to DSC? See, here's the thing. We have a brand new Star Trek series that is supposedly one of the best (some say "best ever") and yet we're still talking about Star Trek's failings? What the fuck is that about? It's like if your kid had an incredible game of soccer and you keep talking about how terrible they were at baseball last year. If Star Trek is going well shouldn't we be praising it for doing well?

STD and STP are still out there and causing damage to the brand. So yeah it's still a problem in my opinion.

 

[fireproof78]

STD and STP are still out there and causing damage to the brand. So yeah it's still a problem in my opinion.

"damage?"

Yeah, the brand looks really damaging with 5 series currently being produced. "Damage to the brand" is a nonsensical statement. Instead of whining about perceptions of imaginary damage why don't we praise SNW for doing well? Why not give some actual positive feedback? Because, if we keep discussing Discovery CBS isn't going to "Oh, hey, they don't like DSC." They will just as likely go "Hey, DSC chatter is trending. Let's keep making it."

Your reinforcing the wrong behavior.

 

[TRON JA307020]

"damage?"

Yeah, the brand looks really damaging with 5 series currently being produced. "Damage to the brand" is a nonsensical statement. Instead of whining about perceptions of imaginary damage why don't we praise SNW for doing well? Why not give some actual positive feedback? Because, if we keep discussing Discovery CBS isn't going to "Oh, hey, they don't like DSC." They will just as likely go "Hey, DSC chatter is trending. Let's keep making it."

Your reinforcing the wrong behavior.

They went episodic with SNW for a reason. STD and STP are not nearly as popular at this point on time as SNW. It's just the way it is. Thdybsaw the writing on the wall. The fans weren't happy with it so they finally gave us what we all wanted. Episodic star trek that had more positive overtones. Sorry you don't like it but SNW is more popular because it's structured better.

 

[fireproof78]

They went episodic with SNW fur a reason. STD and STP are not nearly as popular at this point on time as SNW. It's just the way it is. Thdybsaw the writing on the wall. The fans weren't happy with it so they finally gave us what we all wanted. Episodic star trek that had more positive overtones. Sorry you don't like it but SNW is more popular because it's structured better.

I don't like it?

Oh, ok. Thanks for telling me that I don't like something. What I actually want is people to say they like it and not bring up other Treks they don't like. It's a very negative, pessimistic, view to me.

 

[TRON JA307020]

I don't like it?

Oh, ok. Thanks for telling me that I don't like something. What I actually want is people to say they like it and not bring up other Treks they don't like. It's a very negative, pessimistic, view to me.

I think you don't like that the episodic is getting better reviews by the fandom then the serialized stuff. It just is. Look at rotten tomatoes and imdb and any other forum. It's clear what people prefer. You're arguing the point so it's pretty clear where your preferences stand.

 

[fireproof78]

I think you don't like that the episodic is getting better reviews by the fandom then the serialized stuff. It just is. Look at rotten tomatoes and imdb and any other forum. It's clear what people prefer.

You can think that all you like.

It would be wrong thinking but I'll let you think it.

 

[TRON JA307020]

You can think that all you like.

It would be wrong thinking but I'll let you think it.

Think that serialized trek is better and more popular. It would be wrong but that's ok.

 

[fireproof78]

Think that serialized trek is better and more popular. It would be wrong but that's ok.

I have been pretty clear that I like both.

I don't care about popularity. That's a bullshit standard that people hide behind to justify opinions.

 

[TRON JA307020]

I have been pretty clear that I like both.

I don't care about popularity. That's a bullshit standard that people hide behind to justify opinions.

Popularity leads to success of a product which would lead to valid opinions about how successful and why a product is successfull.