Spoilers Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker - Grading & Discussion

Discussion in 'Star Wars' started by Commander Richard, Dec 13, 2019.

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Grade the movie...

  1. A+

    6.2%
  2. A

    11.8%
  3. A-

    15.4%
  4. B+

    11.3%
  5. B

    14.4%
  6. B-

    6.2%
  7. C+

    9.2%
  8. C

    6.7%
  9. C-

    5.1%
  10. D+

    2.6%
  11. D

    4.6%
  12. D-

    2.1%
  13. F

    4.6%
  1. Cutie McWhiskers

    Cutie McWhiskers Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    R2 was whizzing about* in the air in Episode II, he'd just putter along - even at warp speed - and a way to contrive him to be by Threepio would be made.


    * a euphemism for "flying through the air", not a certain bodily function that I'm sure droids will get outside of comedy venues such as "Futurama" one day


    And to think Harrison wanted Han to be killed off in TESB... yet there he was in TFA hamming it up badly* and wishing the audience would go back in time and talk to Lucas in order to let Han be killed off in TESB instead of TFA. He must have foreseen and predicted the future, isn't that the usual excuse?

    * even in ROTJ he's sleep-acting** but they didn't pay him nearly as much and wasn't allowed to be killed off***, which explains his OTT meth-addicted antics in TFA

    ** which goes right along with the story's plot being a victim of sleep-scripting with the lame redo of the Death Star, walking clumps of cat hairball puke, how quickly and conveniently the Empire is toppled on Endor - never mind Jabba's barge, etc, etc... they really tried to market the bleepdoo out of those Ewoks, as everyone knows were based on the Viet Cong, didn't they...

    *** which may have been the impetus behind Luke and Leia not being revealed as siblings so late in the day, the first two movies are hinting that it's a love triangle cliche and even Yoda saying to ForceGhost Ben "there is another" could have been anybody that wasn't a droid (or even then)
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2019
  2. BillJ

    BillJ History's Greatest Monster Premium Member

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    Your "reality" comes from a dark disturbing place.

    Remember, she's ruined Star Wars, yet is just a glorified secretary at the same time.
     
  3. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    She is Schrödinger's SJW.
     
  4. Campe

    Campe Vice Admiral Admiral

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    [​IMG]
     
  5. Flying Spaghetti Monster

    Flying Spaghetti Monster Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I'm not going to convince anyone here, but I'm convinced that over feminazation of the new trilogy was her vision.. every chance she had to put females in and have them be "strong" while making men look like buffoons she took it with free reign. Some of the other projects were approached to her by people that had as much pedegree in the business as her, and more when it comes to franchise (Knoll with R1 and Favreau with Mandolorian) and she was obviously going to give those guys their projects.
     
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  6. Captaindemotion

    Captaindemotion Admiral Admiral

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    This is where you should’ve stopped.
     
  7. Flying Spaghetti Monster

    Flying Spaghetti Monster Vice Admiral Admiral

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    you are awesome. love ya bro
     
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  8. Captaindemotion

    Captaindemotion Admiral Admiral

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    Back at ya babes
     
  9. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    Just conspiracy theory the planet ;)
     
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  10. WarpFactorZ

    WarpFactorZ Commodore Commodore

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    This scene was basically a Choose Your Own Adventure where Kylo decides to follow the "You don't kill your dad; turn to page 25" instead. Huge missed opportunity here to have Anakin's force ghost appear to Ben in order to turn him back. They snagged Hayden Christensen for some voice work, anyway, so why not pony up the extra cash to have him on screen for a tiny bit? I mean, we got Wedge, Wicket, etc... And he's really not that busy, so... It would have been an apt closure of Kylo seeking Vader's guidance to the Dark Side.

    Plus, it has balance:
    Rey (good) ----> Grandfather (bad)
    kills / killed by
    Kylo (bad) ----> Grandfather (good)
     
  11. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Nostalgia: Of course you ignored objective facts to argue that nostalgia even exists as a reason for the glaring difference in perception/assessment of the ST, as if (in the larger point) nonexistent "rose colored glasses" prevent OT fans from enjoying the ST. The only fair way to judge the ST is to be compared to other parts of the same series, which is not influenced by the myth of nostalgia. One can easily and use only facts to analyze & conclude that Terminator: Dark Fate was an artistically and culturally inferior film compared to the original (or T2); similarly, the same, fact based analysis concludes that The Ghost of Frankenstein (1942) was a cultural and artistic failure, and that's certainly apparent when compared to its series predecessors, Frankenstein (1931), The Bride of Frankenstein (1935) and Son of Frankenstein (1939), even acknowledging that the third was the weaker entry of that group.

    That is how analysis of any group or series works...except in the case of Star Wars, where some are so hyper-defensive over the ST, that any honest analysis / criticism of it must come from the take-your-pick catalog of sweeping, false accusations (but not limited to):
    • "hate"
    • "OT nostalgia" / "Rose-colored glasses"
    • "Anti-SJW", etc.
    • Any number of personal insults
    The majority are unfounded accusations to be sure. Some will need to accept that a film is judged by it parts of / overall series it is a part of. It is utterly dishonest to avoid holding part of a series to its best standards as the only way of selling it, or attempt (and fail) to tear down acknowledged superior entries in some breathless crusade to pump up the ST, and yes, in this forum that has happened in reviews threads for every ST film. That says so much about the how and why of their motivations.

    Age: I covered that; I was there to see Star Wars when it was released in 1977, and movie goers of all ages were in those theatres. In other words, "...the OT had on audiences of all ages in its time" meaning there was no

    No, they do not. Actually, I addressed each of your questions with ease, as those were not unanswered by the films, but to keep it short, I will post the answer to two here

    Considering the Empire was founded on a false war, mass murders/assassinations, hostile takeovers of worlds, etc., all topped by being orchestrated by Palptatine--an undeniably evil member of an equally evil religious order, then the reaction/rejection to the Empire could only be one that seeks to restore the freedom the Empire violently ripped away / crushed. The Rebellion--unlike the Empire--is not in the business of forcing anyone to comply or die. Freedom is there to be reclaimed if the individual/group/world desires it. The Empire as a force of totalitarian, spiritually corrupted overlords, which by any measure is in the ideological wrong. Opposing it makes one an advocate or freedom, not terror.

    Adversity and/or so many tragedies (as Luke endured) can be a forked road for some: one can lead to accepting it (but not losing its meaning to your life) and becoming stronger, wise to the darker realities of the world, and never taking it for granted The other can lead to a life of unending depression, or in some cases, a feeling that disaster is just one step in front of--and behind you, and/or a bleak, self-oppressing outlook on life.
    Luke chose the former, or rather, his true self naturally took that road. I understood that in 1977, as I watched Luke suffer one blow after another, yet he saw the Empire as not only this omnipresent threat, but step by step, it was the source of his greatest losses. It was all brought to his life. One could take that second fork in the road as a response to that, or attempt to stop it from harming and/or killing others (just as Obi-Wan warned aboard the Death Star in regards to the importance of delivering the DS plans to the Rebellion). Luke was burdened with personal tragedy, but it also served as his emotionally believable call to action.

    For the same reason real world private and commercial airplane construction/use continues despite a very long history of tens of thousands of crew and passenger deaths...with no end in sight. To avoid returning to a practical invention due to death or a technical failure robs the users of its obvious benefits. In the SW sense, you don't have to be a supporter of the Empire to see how valuable a Death Star would be in that galaxy. Just ask Alderaan's population or the crews of a number of Rebel capital ships and fighters during the Endor battle...

    Then it should come as no surprise, and not be taken as an offense for fans to offer legitimate, critical analysis of the Star Wars sequel trilogy. It is, after all, a part of fandom.

    .
    Lucas wanted to bring an older, then-buried form of the morality play back to audiences; he famously did not even think the original film would be successful at all, and was shocked to see the response to its opening. but he was wise enough to secure the merchandising rights, among other things.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2019
  12. Claudia

    Claudia Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I'll grant you that some kind of Vader-guidance would have been nice (better than the rehashed Han-Kylo/Ben thing where Han just forgives him and the audience is probably meant to forget all the evil things, including killing Han, Kylo did).

    But Anakin was not a good person - even if he turned back to the light in the end. Even as Anakin he did some quite despicable things...
     
  13. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    That was the undeniable case with Finn, who was created to be the equivalent of an Old Hollywood Black Buffoon stereotype, including making him a frightened sanitation worker with no attempt to chart his own course based on his unique identity/perspective/place in the world. Obviously, the SW PTB did not care about that, as Finn could not be the strong character he would have been if the SW PTB were not Hell bent on creating their own Mantan Moreland act...for space.
     
  14. Skywalker

    Skywalker Admiral Admiral

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    I actually think that's why he's the one person who could have gotten through to Ben. He understands exactly what Ben is going through, better than anyone else in the galaxy could.
     
  15. Saul

    Saul Vice Admiral Admiral

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    So like a Hayden Christensen Cameo?
     
  16. Skywalker

    Skywalker Admiral Admiral

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    I wouldn't have been opposed to it. I really liked seeing Harrison Ford again but Anakin might have made more sense there.
     
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  17. Saul

    Saul Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I wouldn't have been surprised if it had happened. I know there were rumors of it going around before the film came out. Which is nothing new.
     
  18. ichab

    ichab Commodore Commodore

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    I'm just not seeing it. Princess Leia was a very strong female character in the original trilogy as was Padme in the PT. The only difference with Rey is she is the one performing the main Jedi role. As for the buffoons....I'm really drawing a blank. Which male characters were acting like buffoons? The only buffoon I can think of in the entire saga is Jar Jar and that was a Lucas character.
     
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  19. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    Even though I don't agree many have made the argument that Finn is a buffoon, in the tradition of very stereotypical black characters.Though, I don't see that being connected to Rey in any way, but I know that's the argument that will be made here shortly.
     
  20. WarpFactorZ

    WarpFactorZ Commodore Commodore

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    Absolutely. I've been saying this for a while (after TFA, and as recently as upthread!). Bringing Han back for a do-over of the iconic TFA scene was dumb. It would have meant so much more for the guy whose mask Kylo worships to tell him the error of his ways -- only Vader/Anakin could set him on the path to the light side.
     
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