Star Wars:The Clone Wars S3......so far

[O'Dib]

Will it be Obi-Wan interacting with Chewie in the ep, or a different Jedi Master?

 

[Temis the Vorta]

He may write it off as just being the Son's influence like what happened with Ahsoka. Also, per RotJ he allowed his pride to blind him to Anakin's flaws.

What's the difference between the Son's influence and falling to the Dark Side? It was clearly established that Ahsoka had been "taken over" by the Dark Side, and it looked like Anakin had been too.

The Son had the power to cause that to happen frighteningly easily. Maybe back in the "real" universe, a Sith wouldn't be able to do the same, but Obi-Wan can't know that. None of them would be in a good position to interpret exactly what happened and what kind of danger it might signal for the future. They should give the information to the Jedi Council and let them try to sort it out.

Obi-Wan in the TCW doesn't seem at all prideful. He's not as different in the TCW vs PT as Anakin, but he's definitely different - much more charming, not priggish and cold, intellectually curious, almost like a scientist, and quite modest. So I don't think that angle works anymore.

And pride shouldn't stop him from doing his duty, namely to report to the best of his ability what happened on that mission. All three of them should be reporting to the Jedi Council. Don't they get reports from their people in the field as a matter of course? That should just be standard procedure.

I still think it was "Lucas bitches about the state of American politics" but we'll see.

Ugh. Lucas should just write a different space opera franchise if he wants to bitch about American politics because Star Wars has too many exotic elements that destroy any analogies. For instance, it looks to me like politics actually don't count for much. There's no political solution to the chaos enveloping the galaxy because the source of the chaos is mystical, not political. The Dark Side is causing the chaos and using politics as one conduit. Unless Lucas believes there are mystical forces that control what the idiots in Washington DC get up to (I'm envisioning something like Cthulhu ), he's not going to come up with analogies that work work a damn. The story must be resolved on the mystical, not the political level.

Even beyond that, the society is far too different from our own in some very crucial ways. The Republic is apparently so degenerate that it can't get its own citizens to fight for it, and so amoral that they'd prefer to breed sentient beings as cannon fodder. How can you really get behind a society like that? I'm increasingly unsure the Republic is even salvageable. On top of that, they turn their military over to an elite cadre of superheroes and allow children in their military, which would be considered a war crime if the Pentagon tried it. The Republic is a very bizarre place, which I love about it, but to have useful analogies, it would have to be far more parallel to America than it actually is.

 

[Set Harth]

Will it be Obi-Wan interacting with Chewie in the ep, or a different Jedi Master?

I have no idea. Obi-Wan wasn't in the clip I saw, for whatever that's worth.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

BTW was it established anywhere that Obi-Wan knew Chewbacca prior to ANH?

No. If its been "established", its a recent retconning.

But I always found their initial meeting and discussion in the Mos Eisley cantina to be an odd betrayal of familiarity, gauging mainly by the way Chewie nods.

 

[Set Harth]

No. If its been "established", its a recent retconning.

I didn't mean that it had been definitively "established", I meant something more along the lines of this:

But I always found their initial meeting and discussion in the Mos Eisley cantina to be an odd betrayal of familiarity

 

[DarthPipes]

I think Chewbacca is going to be dealing with Ahsoka. So long as it's not Anakin, Obi-Wan, and the droids I'm fine with it.

Anakin's idea of using the carbon freeze should be another example of him being the cunning warrior that Obi-Wan talked about. Though that kind of risk borders on insane and disturbing.

I remember in the old SW Republic comics, a family line or a group of senators who passed away would have their bodies frozen in carbonite. I guess like a masoleum.

 

[JediKnightButler]

No. If its been "established", its a recent retconning.

I didn't mean that it had been definitively "established", I meant something more along the lines of this:

But I always found their initial meeting and discussion in the Mos Eisley cantina to be an odd betrayal of familiarity

Or maybe Obi-Wan could've casually (and very QUIETLY) mentioned that he was a former Jedi Master (or Chewie recognized his robes as belonging to a Jedi)- After all, the Wookies were very loyal to the Jedi for their efforts to defend them in the Clone Wars and even afterwards (DL)
I guess we'll have to see the episode to find out more.......

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Anakin's idea of using the carbon freeze should be another example of him being the cunning warrior that Obi-Wan talked about. Though that kind of risk borders on insane and disturbing.

TCW is doing a good job of actually providing evidence of Anakin being an impressive Jedi, rather than just telling us about it. I also liked the counter-Jedi measures the writers invented for the Citidel. I appreciate all the clever little touches.

 

[timothy]

I love the citidel part 1 especialy the anomosity already building between tarking and anakin . Also the citidel had a very death star feel to it . The prison walk arera
the wall lasers and cameras . I love the magnetic wall capablity . Why did'nt they
have that in the first death star prison leval . Now clone wars is soppossed to be pg
rating right . well what is with torturing master peel. that should be at least pg-13.

now we have a two week break . WHY?!

I love the fact that they use ughanauts to be the carbon freeze operators.
Since carbonite comes only from bespin. I also love the fact they use reprogramed
battleoid to sneek them in.


09/27/11 STAR WARS EPSIODES 1 - 6 ON BLU RAY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

THURSDAY'S AND FRIDAY'S ARE DVR OVERLOAD NIGHTS

 

[Temis the Vorta]

But the ending was hokey. Look, the door is cut in a big CIRCLE! What does this remind us of, kids!

 

[Admiral_Young]

I'm guessing there is another hiatus because it's the end of Feb sweeps.

 

[Christopher]

now we have a two week break . WHY?!

Because next Friday, Cartoon Network is pre-empting its new-cartoons block in favor of its "Hall of Game" sports awards show. What does that have to do with cartoons? The same thing wrestling has to do with sci-fi: it helps pay the bills.

 

[Admiral_Young]

^ Exactly. It's the end of Feb sweeps.

 

[fett51]

To have all consequential episodes all the time would be untenable (there isn't that much mystery to be resolved, they've handled most of what they needed to do) and might get kind of exhausting to watch. They're only halfway thru the series run, so they need to pace themselves.

Didn't necessarily mean exploring the mysteries of Star Wars every week, just that they go in new directions and continue to stay away from being Jedi vs droids every week. Even so, now that they've gone to explaining the Seps aren't all bad, they have a lot more dramatic options for war stories when they get back to them.

So they've both got issues. it was treated rather lightly this time, but I think they're on a collision course.

Between that and what she said on Mortis while darksided, I agree. The show is supposed to be serialized from now on, so I certainly hope we'll get running plotlines and character arcs.

What's the difference between the Son's influence and falling to the Dark Side? It was clearly established that Ahsoka had been "taken over" by the Dark Side, and it looked like Anakin had been too.

Choice. The Son mindfraked Ahsoka, Obi-wan might've thought the same happened to Anakin, and I doubt Anakin shared the Father's explanation with him.

And pride shouldn't stop him from doing his duty, namely to report to the best of his ability what happened on that mission. All three of them should be reporting to the Jedi Council. Don't they get reports from their people in the field as a matter of course? That should just be standard procedure.

I'm sure he reported it, but the notion that the Jedi Order stood in the way of peace would likely strike the council as a sign of twisted thinking on Anakin's part. If so it would point them to thinking he got mindfraked by the Son as well.

The Republic is a very bizarre place, which I love about it, but to have useful analogies, it would have to be far more parallel to America than it actually is.

Which is why several of the episodes were set on Mandalore. The one that really hit on the politics of the Republic was Pursuit of Peace, and the episode was a complete mess writing wise as a result. My view is that if he wants to yell about paying attention to government, they should be running a subplot about Palpatine's takeover and how he's getting away with it. Pursuit of Peace did have that bit with him at the end, but they haven't followed up on it.

 

[ALF]

Well, I'm taking the break to revisit season 1. Watched the first 30 mins of the pilot/movie whatever it is last night wasn't nearly as bad as I remember it... in fact I thought it was quite great. It might change one Ziro gets in there...

 

[Set Harth]

I'm sure he reported it, but the notion that the Jedi Order stood in the way of peace would likely strike the council as a sign of twisted thinking on Anakin's part. If so it would point them to thinking he got mindfraked by the Son as well.

So that notion is a sign of twisted thinking, eh?

 

[Temis the Vorta]

The show is supposed to be serialized from now on,

Wow, I was thinking it's pretty serialized so far, in that I can see a through-line for in several things such as Padme's increasingly figuring out the corruption of the Republic; Ahsoka growing up and starting to push her own agenda; and not just a collision course for Anakin and Ahsoka but also for Anakin and Padme (the girls should gang up on him ).

Do you mean that there won't be trilogy formats anymore and it will be one continuous story, or that there won't be any more disconnected digressions like the droid spa story? Even the disconnected episodes often have little elements that contribute to the larger threads.

Choice. The Son mindfraked Ahsoka, Obi-wan might've thought the same happened to Anakin, and I doubt Anakin shared the Father's explanation with him.

I didn't get the notion that Anakin made a choice, because the Son's argument should not have convinced an intelligent person, which Anakin seems to be. Anakin has learned that as the Chosen One, his job is to balance Light and Dark. How can he possibly reconcile that with the notion of joining one side or the other?

That simply makes no sense. He should have told the Son, "sorry, as a follower of the Dark Side, you're only a pawn to be used in my end game. I'm not going to join you - but you can cooperate with my plans to the extent I deem you useful to them."

Anakin should realize that he needs to be in charge, not subordinating himself to either Light or Dark. That's why I figure the Son must have simply overpowered Anakin's mind by throwing terrible visions at him. Anakin should be the boss, but the Son somehow got more powerful than Anakin by the end of the trilogy even though Anakin was more powerful in the first episode, not sure what happened there, maybe just because the Son was on his home turf?

And pride shouldn't stop him from doing his duty, namely to report to the best of his ability what happened on that mission. All three of them should be reporting to the Jedi Council. Don't they get reports from their people in the field as a matter of course? That should just be standard procedure.

I'm sure he reported it, but the notion that the Jedi Order stood in the way of peace would likely strike the council as a sign of twisted thinking on Anakin's part. If so it would point them to thinking he got mindfraked by the Son as well.

The Jedi Council needs to get all the information they can, and try to sort through what happened. Having two Jedi join the Dark Side and come back is a huge event for them - unprecedented? - and they need to seriously figure out what it all means.

I don't see why they'd dismiss Anakin's viewpoint out of hand, not unless they're utterly closed minded. He'd simply tell them that balance means balance. The Force wants a balance of Light and Dark, and their job is not to win the war but to find a way to live in equillibrium with the Sith. An unappealing prospect, certainly, but who says the Force wants to make things easy on the Jedi? The Force is what it is, and the Jedi's job is to serve its will.

These ideas didn't come from the Son, but rather from what Anakin, Obi-Wan and Ahsoka all experienced on Mortis. If I can figure all this out based on the evidence, why the frak can't the big-shot Jedi Council? Or are they going to conclude that all three of their Jedi were mindfraked? If they're going to take that kind of attitude, why send their people out to investigate the distress beacon in the first place?

If the intent is to depict the Jedi Council as calcified and closed-minded, so be it. Let's see Anakin try to convince them of his (correct) viewpoint and have them arrogantly dismiss his ideas. Or even have them explore his ideas and decide (for reasons yet to be introduced) that they are wrong, or even more interestingly, right but politically untenable. Because how the heck are they going to explain to the Senate that the Force wants them to sign a peace treaty with the Separatists and then live forever with the forces of Darkness at their doorstep forever after?

 

[Set Harth]

He'd simply tell them that balance means balance. The Force wants a balance of Light and Dark, and their job is not to win the war but to find a way to live in equillibrium with the Sith.

And Force means Force. That's not the definition of the term "balance of the Force" as it was used in the films, nor is it what Anakin learned in Mortis. It's just a misguided rewrite of "balance of the Force" into "balance of Jedi and Sith", taking out certain words and replacing them with different words. One of these was discussed in the films and was the subject of a Jedi prophecy. The other wasn't. Keeping the Banite Sith around is in no way what the Force "wants" or the right thing to do; it's merely "twisted thinking" which heedlessly throws both trilogies under the bus.

Let's see Anakin try to convince them of his (correct) viewpoint and have them arrogantly dismiss his ideas.

This viewpoint is canonically incorrect, and is not the viewpoint of Anakin in TCW. Anakin says no such thing anywhere in the arc, so it's just a mistake being projected onto his character. Anakin's destiny remains unchanged after Mortis. If Mortis serves as an example, it only reinforces the idea that the method of balancing the Force tends to be the destruction of the dedicated instrument of the dark side.

 

[Whofan]

Katee Sackoff (BSG) did some voice work for the series recently.


http://www.theforce.net/latestnews/story/TCW_Starbuck_Meets_Star_Wars_136851.asp

 

[DWF]

Since there's so much talk about Anakin's fall here's an article detailing how it happened.

http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com/theturn.html

This is what appeared in the film when a rough cut was assembled in 2004. Seeking to gauge the film, Lucas showed this cut to a number of people, most of whom expressed some concern or confusion over Anakin's motivation for giving in to the darkside. "Some people were having a hard time with the reason Anakin goes bad," Lucas says. "Somebody asked whether somebody could kill Anakin's best friend, so that he gets really angry. They wanted a real betrayal, such as 'you tried to kill me now I'm going to kill you.' They didn't understand that Anakin is simply greedy. There is no revenge. The revenge of the Sith is Palpatine." Arguably, Lucas hadn't clearly developed this element of Anakin's pyschology. However, while Lucas did not initially instigate as drastic changes as some suggested, he would soon change his mind from his first instinct, which was to leave the film as is. While editing the film down further, Lucas began to realise that the through-line of the picture was Anakin, and that any scene not directly related to him be exercised. The removal of these superfluous scenes unexpectedly began to shift emphasis towards the character's obsession for Padme, which Lucas then began to actively re-structure the film around, because, as he says, it seemed "poetic." Anakin would go to the darkside to save Padme, with his attempts to prevent her death ultimately killing her, in the vein of Macbeth. He says: "The first script I wrote had stories for everybody...and I cut it down and we had a script. But when we cut it together, there were still problems. Finally, I said, 'Okay, let's be even more hard-nosed here and take out every scene that doesn't have anything to do with Anakin.' But that causes you to juxtapose certain scenes that you were never contemplating juxtaposing before. And these scenes take on different qualities than before, because the scenes were never meant to be next to each other...What happens then is that some of the themes grab hold of each other and really strengthen themselves in ways that are fascinating...so we'll strengthen that theme because it seems poetic"