Spoilers Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 3x10 - "New Life and New Civilizations"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
Cut out the sarcasm, it's not appreciated
Sir, this is a Wendy's.
I'm saying continuity errors are common by citing another one from another prominent franchiseLoved the episode. Sad to see Batel go, but the send-off was done really well. Wasn't sure about this finale after a mixed season, but loved the Inner Light-inspired segment a lot. Even got the inspiration for my username from this episode! So, great episode!
You enjoyed this episode enough to join the board? Well welcome, I'm not sure there are many episodes that can motivate that (even though I didn't care for this episode much)
Sarcasm is my default response to an apparent non sequitur. I was not aware of any of that Star Wars information nor did I see the connection to my previous post. Thank you for clarifying.Cut out the sarcasm, it's not appreciated
Two, I agree continuity issues are extremely common, especially in Star Trek and that was only in TOS, much less TMP, TNG, TWOK, etc. But, SNW has become more clear to me to not connect to TOS, save for references to events. TOS will not be in continuity for me with anything else.
Well, I knew about the board a long time, but I need even longer (in general) to finally decide on a great username. But this name was just too adorable to miss. Lucky me!
Welcome aboard and glad to have you. The episode seems to generate a lot of interesting points of view. I'm glad to see a positive one.
Isn't that the beauty that there can be both positive and negative at the same time? In fact, wasn't that acknowledge in this very episode itself?
Thanks for the warm welcome and your kind words!
It is a fundamental facet of humanity. I think Star Trek even had an episode about it once
Incidentally my P+ subscription ran out a few hours after I watched the finale. I guess you can wake me when season 4 comes around. XD
10
Wow. This is how to do a season finale that ties up all the personal and other plot points from the other episodes of this season.
This is how you do something very much akin to TNG's S5 The Inner Light and really make it hit home as being a real part of STAR TREK and not just an episode that would work in any other Sci Fi/Fantasy anthology series like Twilight Zone or Outer Limits.
This was also miles above other similar Trek Franchise episodes like TNG's S6 Tapestry because it involved more than just the main characters and it pulled in and tied together stories from secondary characters they've taken the time to develop and make us care about. It's not just a bunch of 'one and done' guest stars of the week interacting with our Leads; it's secondary characters you know (assuming you've been watching the series of course.)
Loved:
- Pike got to experience the life he and Marie Batel wanted. It's so great the way they SHOWED in full how Pike 'gave Batel (now also a Beholder) the power needed to defeat the Vezda. (And wow, Pike is ascending to 'Kirk' level status because not only does he get his life with Marie Batel, he'll also get to live out a life with Vina on Talos IV in 2266.)
- Spock's explanation of 'dealing with Dimensional space' that lays the groundwork to make the various plot elements work out within the episode.
- The Mind Meld between Kirk and Spock that allows them to pilot the two ships in perfect synch (among other things.)
- Pela's self cut off 'admission' that she once 'hung out' with a 'Time-Travelling Doctor'
(STAR TREK/Doctor WHO crossover confirmed. )
Nit Picks:
- The degree of Spock's memories Kirk appeared to retain after the Mind Meld. I assume such memories fade over time OR Spock still has ways of not sharing everything as one would think that after that Kirk would remember that Sarek is Spock's father and Amanda is Spock's mother just a few years later in TOS S2 Journey To Babel.
- Didn't really care for Spock's "One day we may serve of the same ship..." bit. Less blatant foreshadowing is more in my book, and this was unnecessary.
And yeah, you can tell that Akiva and Co. were definitely thinking SNW S3 might be the last (and this was obviously written prior to them getting the SNW S4 renewal) - as yeah, it definitely came across as something that would work and was intended as a series finally, especially given that blatant Spock line I mentioned above, the whole "enough for a 5 year mission..." which would move them to 2265 and imply 'more adventures' in case we had no more actual episodes coming; and the way they did the final ship 'Warp Out' sequence.
^^^
So, no - these writers and producers weren't assuming anything was set in stone for this series after Season 3, and especially after the SAG strike.
But, that said - I'm extremely happy we're getting a SNW S4 (10 episodes) and S5 (6 episodes) and my only annoyance at this time is I have to probably wait another year before seeing the next 10 SNW episodes.
So again, a 10 from me and IMO this is how to do something like TNG's S5 The Inner Light (which I know is many a Star Trek TNG fan's favorite, but which I didn't find that good as it could work equally well with no real changes for ANY anthology series) and make it uniquely and DEFINITELY Star Trek.) YMMV.
And overall I have to say S4 really worked for me. There were only two episodes I disliked:
SNW S3 Ep. 2 Wedding Bell Blues to which I gave a 3 because yeah, I didn't need to see Trelane be confirmed as a Q nor John De'Lanice's Q confirmed as his father.
SNW S3 Ep. 4 A Space Adventure Hour to which I gave a 1 as I felt it was laughing at Star Trek (and TOS in particular) and not with it, as a majority of other parodies have done. (And yes, I know others very much disagree and think it was a good parody laughing 'with' Star Trek, but not me.)
The other eight episodes are six 10's one 8 and one 9 so yeah, this was IMO a great season overall for me.
Wow. This is how to do a season finale that ties up all the personal and other plot points from the other episodes of this season.
This is how you do something very much akin to TNG's S5 The Inner Light and really make it hit home as being a real part of STAR TREK and not just an episode that would work in any other Sci Fi/Fantasy anthology series like Twilight Zone or Outer Limits.
This was also miles above other similar Trek Franchise episodes like TNG's S6 Tapestry because it involved more than just the main characters and it pulled in and tied together stories from secondary characters they've taken the time to develop and make us care about. It's not just a bunch of 'one and done' guest stars of the week interacting with our Leads; it's secondary characters you know (assuming you've been watching the series of course.)
Loved:
- Pike got to experience the life he and Marie Batel wanted. It's so great the way they SHOWED in full how Pike 'gave Batel (now also a Beholder) the power needed to defeat the Vezda. (And wow, Pike is ascending to 'Kirk' level status because not only does he get his life with Marie Batel, he'll also get to live out a life with Vina on Talos IV in 2266.)
- Spock's explanation of 'dealing with Dimensional space' that lays the groundwork to make the various plot elements work out within the episode.
- The Mind Meld between Kirk and Spock that allows them to pilot the two ships in perfect synch (among other things.)
- Pela's self cut off 'admission' that she once 'hung out' with a 'Time-Travelling Doctor'
(STAR TREK/Doctor WHO crossover confirmed. )Nit Picks:
- The degree of Spock's memories Kirk appeared to retain after the Mind Meld. I assume such memories fade over time OR Spock still has ways of not sharing everything as one would think that after that Kirk would remember that Sarek is Spock's father and Amanda is Spock's mother just a few years later in TOS S2 Journey To Babel.
- Didn't really care for Spock's "One day we may serve of the same ship..." bit. Less blatant foreshadowing is more in my book, and this was unnecessary.
And yeah, you can tell that Akiva and Co. were definitely thinking SNW S3 might be the last (and this was obviously written prior to them getting the SNW S4 renewal) - as yeah, it definitely came across as something that would work and was intended as a series finally, especially given that blatant Spock line I mentioned above, the whole "enough for a 5 year mission..." which would move them to 2265 and imply 'more adventures' in case we had no more actual episodes coming; and the way they did the final ship 'Warp Out' sequence.
^^^
So, no - these writers and producers weren't assuming anything was set in stone for this series after Season 3, and especially after the SAG strike.
But, that said - I'm extremely happy we're getting a SNW S4 (10 episodes) and S5 (6 episodes) and my only annoyance at this time is I have to probably wait another year before seeing the next 10 SNW episodes.
So again, a 10 from me and IMO this is how to do something like TNG's S5 The Inner Light (which I know is many a Star Trek TNG fan's favorite, but which I didn't find that good as it could work equally well with no real changes for ANY anthology series) and make it uniquely and DEFINITELY Star Trek.) YMMV.
And overall I have to say S4 really worked for me. There were only two episodes I disliked:
SNW S3 Ep. 2 Wedding Bell Blues to which I gave a 3 because yeah, I didn't need to see Trelane be confirmed as a Q nor John De'Lanice's Q confirmed as his father.
SNW S3 Ep. 4 A Space Adventure Hour to which I gave a 1 as I felt it was laughing at Star Trek (and TOS in particular) and not with it, as a majority of other parodies have done. (And yes, I know others very much disagree and think it was a good parody laughing 'with' Star Trek, but not me.)
The other eight episodes are six 10's one 8 and one 9 so yeah, this was IMO a great season overall for me.
Yes! I could tell they had no idea how to write any of this from the moment we had that scene in sickbay with Chapel.
Where she just kept saying "oh my god, this can't be" or whatever - vague statements of shock that actually say nothing. As Pike repeatedly prompted for more explanation. And then it's just basically: "She IS the statue."
I've written scenes like this before, that have embarrassed me. Where I don't know how to get to the point I want to make, so I try to hide that by filling it up with SHOCK and PROCESSING or whatever.
Then during the rewrite, I'm horrified by the cheats and fix it. I'm surprised they couldn't get these scenes in better shape.
My thinking now is that this was an actual timeline that really happened, and now continues. With all the talk about how Batel can actually access time and changes to cause/effect etc.
And Pike was also near the end of his life in this timeline, so it's nearly as if he lived that whole life, died naturally, and then his survivor's continued on as they would have after his death.
Not to say this is what the writers intended - I think it was more likely that "child!" was just a lazy thought for how to indicate "a full life!", and they didn't fully think through the bleak implications.
But I think the text allows for my kinder interpretation, so I'm going with that!
Yes please! If they're going to force Kirk into a series he never should have been on, can we at least get something fun out of it?
Mine's close to your's in that I agree with:
1. A Quality of Mercy
2. Under the Cloak of War
But for S3:
3. What Is Starfleet?
Mine would be:
Season 1: A Quality of Mercy
Season 2: Those Old Scientists
Season 3: Four and a Half Vulcans
Season 1: A Quality of Mercy
Season 2: Those Old Scientists
Season 3: Four and a Half Vulcans
This is a far more minor issue than the Dagger of the Mind continuity error I already mentioned, but Kirk knowing that Spock is dating La'an doesn't really sit well with his seeming ignorance on everything relating to Vulcan mating in Amok Time, or his easy acceptance that T'Pring was Spock's betrothed since childhood, if he now knows that Spock was running around with La'an already. Although to be fair you can say TOS already disrupted this as Kirk already knew about Leila Kalomi before Amok Time, but even that was portrayed as a one sided thing outside of the spores.
Continuity errors have always been compounding and stacking in Star Trek since the 1960s. We've gotten by without needing to cry "Alternate Timeline" for the first forty years.
As late as 1996 or 1997 Trek had the Eugenics Wars being around the year 2173. I know, the writer of that DS9 episode later admitted they made a mistake in dating the conflicts, but still. It got onscreen. So...canon. 
Even if wrong.
Even if wrong.
Yeah, but that was before.
This is now.
Continuity errors now equal an alternate timeline to avoid any problems. Same reason why Lego sets need instruction for everything.
Meh, I generously gave it a 7 but really it is a 6.5.
It just wasn't compelling. The setup was good enough but the resolution fell flat. So, epigenetics are real but they don't give super powers. So basically Pike and Batel had a shared illusion of a life together and then she magically contained the alien threat.
And, I guess it's nice they could have a fake life together but it wasn't real so . . .
Basically the solution was way too easy. It just kind of happened and not through any intentional efforts on their own. And then the emotional part just didn't work.
I enjoyed the season overall but it's easily the weakest SNW season. One of the problems of filming subsequent seasons (4th) before the current (3rd) one airs is that they don't get feedback on audience reactions. The humorous episodes were overdone and unfunny and now I'm dreading the puppet one already.
One the good side, I'm finally starting to see some Kirk in Wesley!
It just wasn't compelling. The setup was good enough but the resolution fell flat. So, epigenetics are real but they don't give super powers. So basically Pike and Batel had a shared illusion of a life together and then she magically contained the alien threat.
And, I guess it's nice they could have a fake life together but it wasn't real so . . .
Basically the solution was way too easy. It just kind of happened and not through any intentional efforts on their own. And then the emotional part just didn't work.
I enjoyed the season overall but it's easily the weakest SNW season. One of the problems of filming subsequent seasons (4th) before the current (3rd) one airs is that they don't get feedback on audience reactions. The humorous episodes were overdone and unfunny and now I'm dreading the puppet one already.
One the good side, I'm finally starting to see some Kirk in Wesley!
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