Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 1x10 - "Et in Arcadia Ego, Part 2"

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Picard' started by Commander Richard, Mar 25, 2020.


Rate the episode...

  1. 10 - I'm sending the writers orchids!

  2. 9

  3. 8

  4. 7

  5. 6

  6. 5

  7. 4

  8. 3

  9. 2

  10. 1 - Crash and burn!

  1. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

    Feb 4, 2002
    The Old Mixer, Somewhere in Connecticut
    It was "leak" in his case. He got over that leaking thing.

    I can't deny it...but I can disavow it. This social revolution will self-destruct in five seconds. Good luck, Boomer!

    But he was, with his actions, hastening his death. Which plays right into what you're saying a couple of quotes below. Does the fact that he had a terminal disease make his life less precious?

    Of course, that Starfleet showed up and and protected the planet was also a major factor in convincing Soji (and through her, presumably, the other synths). And that owed entirely to Picard's persistence.

    I think it was only meant to be a clue that Picard was dreaming. All the attempts to interpret it were clearly running too far with it.

    There's been much discussion in these parts of how Gene decreed, regarding the TNG episode "The Bonding," that in the 24th century, kids wouldn't grieve the loss of a parent. And fighting mortality, extending a still finite existence, is one thing...embracing immortality is really a completely different thing. Something we've never had to deal with.
    Ovation, fireproof78 and Gonzo like this.
  2. Nyotarules

    Nyotarules Vice Admiral Moderator

    Jan 20, 2016
    He sacrficed himself for his Captain in Nemesis, his death had meaning, it did not need another one
    Lord Garth and Gonzo like this.
  3. Gonzo

    Gonzo Guest

    I considered Data to be officially dead before Picard was released, seeing his actual death in the show was not really necessary but perhaps Brent insisted on it to close the door on the character once and for all.

    It must be a real chore having to go through all that makeup when he was younger never mind now, much easier for him to play an actual person like Altan every now and then instead.

    I can certainly appreciate that some will have issue with the scene but it didn't bother me at all.
    saladdays and fireproof78 like this.
  4. Nyotarules

    Nyotarules Vice Admiral Moderator

    Jan 20, 2016
    ^I can appreciate the real life reason for another Data death, but if the character was not a part of the show I would not have missed him, but then I am not a Dataphile.
    Gonzo likes this.
  5. Jadeb

    Jadeb Commodore Commodore

    Jul 11, 2017
    I dunno. Data’s ghost hung over every episode of this thing, so it’s not like he showed up out of the blue. That criticism could be more easily directed toward Seven, IMO — that she was brought in just to please fans, had very little plot importance and could have been excised to make more time for other things.
    SolarisOne and eschaton like this.
  6. Gonzo

    Gonzo Guest

    Its highly likely that Seven will become more important in future seasons especially as a bridge to bring in more Voyager characters, same goes for Elnor.

    I want to know how long it took for Seven to become so bored by Chakotay that she switched sides, asking for a friend.

    She was never going to be able to compete with his Spirit Animal anyway. :biggrin:
  7. Longinus

    Longinus Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Sep 2, 2008
    But usually the parents try to ensure that their babies will live as long as possible. There merely are some things that they cannot control.
    At that point his normal lifespan would have been indefinite.

    And what is 'normal'? There is very little 'normal' in being transferred into an android body. People with the 24th century medical tech can live to be 140. Is that normal? Is it normal that we can expect to live twice as long as the cavemen? At what point life extending medical technology becomes abnormal?
  8. Gonzo

    Gonzo Guest

    Picards body swap doesn't bother me.

    If we take what Altan and Agnes says at face value then Picard has really only had a brain transplant, of course there is no such things as a brain only transplant due to the connected spinal cord and central nervous system so everything else had to be replaced as well.

    Personally I think Altan and Agnes chose their words carefully when explaining to Picard and assuring him that he is 100% normal, after all there is no true limit to life expectancy in the 24th Century as we saw with McCoy, its more about the quality of life than how long it lasts as they can replace pretty much everything else besides the brain, spinal cord and central nervous system.

    Picard isn't immortal by any stretch of the imagination but I do think his life expectancy is considerably more than he has been led to believe.

    It wouldn't surprise me if they locked away a few bonuses that will reveal themselves when the circumstances require it.
  9. Nyotarules

    Nyotarules Vice Admiral Moderator

    Jan 20, 2016
    I was glad he was not a non moutstache twirling evil baddie. Arik, Noonien, A.I were all different as all of us are when to comes to our relations and their personalities
    SolarisOne, Turtletrekker and Gonzo like this.
  10. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

    Aug 23, 2003
    Tacoma, Washington
    I did enjoy the little misdirect though. Alton introducing himself as a "mad scientist", and being understandably distraught over the death of Saga, his "niece", making him open to summoning the super synths in order to protect his "family" made me certain that he was going to be a bad guy.

    I felt a little bad for him when he realized that his synthetic kin were capable of all the same irrational and illogical actions as humans were.
    SolarisOne likes this.
  11. 11Alive

    11Alive Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

    Apr 24, 2017
    The Big Apple
    Just like in the Robin Williams movie Bicentennial Man.
  12. TimeIsAPredator

    TimeIsAPredator Commodore Commodore

    Mar 15, 2020
    To me it looked like Data's choice to die was in part due to being stuck inside his own subconscious for 30yrs ya he could have entered the golum but was ready to go
    Farscape One likes this.
  13. Gonzo

    Gonzo Guest

    Yeah there is an argument for that, if Data had been outside and able to interact he may not have chosen death at all.

    It is what it is though, Data's story is over and done, that is probably also true for Lore even though we haven't seen him.
    SolarisOne likes this.
  14. 137th Gebirg

    137th Gebirg Admiral Premium Member

    Aug 31, 2000
    Eaten by Cannibals
    If I was stuck in that bland little box for 30-some years, I think I’d probably be ready for a profound change too. Jus’ sayin’...
    Farscape One and Gonzo like this.
  15. TimeIsAPredator

    TimeIsAPredator Commodore Commodore

    Mar 15, 2020
    But now we get Sojis story. Lovin, learnin, gettin angry and going all River Tam on everyone
    Gonzo likes this.
  16. Yminale

    Yminale Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Dec 30, 2002
    Democratically Liberated America
    People complaining about Picard's mind transfer seem to forget about Data's mom. Soong gave his wife a limited life span when he transferred her mind to her android body.
    NCC-73515, SolarisOne and Kevman7987 like this.
  17. AlanC9

    AlanC9 Commodore Commodore

    May 5, 2004
    At least that plot point came over from the Asimov story intact.
    Kevman7987 likes this.
  18. Makarov

    Makarov Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Jul 9, 2013
    Soong wasn't a nice guy though.

    I wish we had at least one scene of Data meeting Soji
  19. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Apr 11, 2014
    Journeying onwards
    My view on this is that it is a natural progression of such an attitude. That to be mortal and to die is a part of humanity. As Gene said "Death is a part of life."

    Despite the protests against Picard and Data's death I think it is perfectly keeping with what Trek has presented as it concept of humanity.
  20. Samurai8472

    Samurai8472 Admiral Admiral

    Mar 27, 2007
    So both Picard and Professor X died and had their consciousness transferred into new bodies?

    They should've had Picard in a wheelchair when he was recovering after getting his new body. If they wanted a 24th century equivalent, it could've been a hoverchair.

    I would have LOL'd if Picard 2.0 needed a wheelchair to get his bearings first.