Star Trek Nemesis (Rant)

[Michael]

For two, the backstory that DS9 has with the Dominion would be insane for a general audience member to know about. That is mainly why, creatively speaking, there will never be a DS9 movie.

And a DS9 movie would have to be about the Dominion why?

 

[blueziggy]

i distinctly remember the dominion war being over prior to Nemesis. wouldnt having the back story of the Dominion in Nemesis kinda be lack luster? think about it.

-Backstory-

For four years an alien empire from a far away galaxy waged war on the federation, intent on destroying it. worlds were lost, ships destroyed and countless lives gone. in the end, the federation defeated said enemy and they sued for peace.

now your gonna have the same enemy that was already defeated once come back? the average movie goer will say "well they beatem once, they will beatem again".

 

[Tyson]

A Dominion War movie would have fitted in perfectly instead of Insurrection. They could have done an invasion of Betazed story or something. The only people going to see Star Trek movies at that point were fans and people looking for pretty explosions, a war movie would have surely delivered that better than what we got.

If they had gone that route, it could have been TNG's swan song and we'd have been spared Nemesis.

 

[blueziggy]

A Dominion War movie would have fitted in perfectly instead of Insurrection. They could have done an invasion of Betazed story or something. The only people going to see Star Trek movies at that point were fans and people looking for pretty explosions, a war movie would have surely delivered that better than what we got.

If they had gone that route, it could have been TNG's swan song and we'd have been spared Nemesis.

the first movie after a major NON STAR TREK FAN draw like First Contact would only draw star trek fans? the reason why insurrection was even made was because of the popularity of First Contact with the general public.

and again please tell me how a Dominion War movie would have fit in perfectly when there was no mention of the Dominion in Generations or First Contact? the whole back story for the dominion was done on DS9. more people watched First Contact then DS9.

 

[RAMA]

I think I'll stay out of Nemesis threads from now on, I finally have mentally exhausted all my BBS energy on it, and will instead concentrate on the new movie.

RAMA

 

[Peach Wookiee]

Good for you, RAMA! ^^

 

[AlboOfBorg]

I think Insurrection was worse. I see no redeeming quality in that movie whatsoever.

Having two sets of "twins" (Picard and Shinzon; Data and B-4) in Nemesis was really bad. Along with the whole "Argo" thing. Ugh. I'm going to have to watch First Contact again just to get this bad taste out of my mouth...

 

[PhoenixIreland]

I think I'll stay out of Nemesis threads from now on, I finally have mentally exhausted all my BBS energy on it, and will instead concentrate on the new movie.

RAMA

I have FEARED coming back to this thread just for what it would do to my blood pressure.
Sacred rules that one enemy may not cross trek zones even though it's happened a dozen times....the anger...the horror

 

[EmoVulcan]

I could live with everything in the movie EXCEPT killing Data. This is the only Star Trek movie I don't own and probably never will. Data, along with Geordi, is probably my favorite character and the only reason he died is because Brent had been trying to kill him off for the past several movies.

 

[Krieg1981]

It was not as bad as insurrection but I have some problems with it:

1. The notion of a Picard clone being in charge of the Romulan empire was a very stupid story they could have done so much better, now I'm a firm beleiver in not complaining about something without sugesting something I think would be better so.... a movie with the Enterprise E and the Dominion somehow involved would have been far better since we never go to see the two interact. Maybe the E, Voyager under Captian Chakotay and the Defiant under Vaughn (im sure they could get an actor to play him) go through the wormhole to investigate why the dominion has suddenly gone quiet (or like in the relaunch books why the jemhadar strike the station and instead the taskforce of ships, made of those three, goes to the Gamma Quadrant to investigate) and it turns out theres been a coup there maybe by that angry changeling (Nos?) from DS9, have some battles with the jemhadar and eventually they get Odo and the rest back to their rightful place.

2. Why no refrence to Sela or Spock???? It would have made more sense for HER to launch the coup.

3. Don't kill Data, kill Troi

Amen brother. Nemesis isn't the worst, but it sure isn't the best!

 

[Icy_Penguigo]

I say just let the TNG era die with what little dignity it has left. All the interest and creativity has been violently strangled out of it. DS9 was great, but I think it stands just fine in it's current state, and doesn't need more material made out of it. To do so would be risking(IMO) it sliding into the same retarded morass as Insurrection and Nemesis. Just let it go.

I'm looking forward much more to seeing if Abrams can legitimately bring excitement and life back into the dead horse that is Star Trek.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

The notion of a Picard clone being in charge of the Romulan empire was a very stupid story they could have done so much better...

Could've been worse. John Logan stated, in an interview in the defunct Star Trek: The Magazine, that the original idea was that Shinzon was Picard's long-lost son from the Stargazer. Picard would've had a family on that ship, one he never mentions, because they were believed to have been killed during a Romulan attack. It would've been revealed that his son survived and was raised by the Romulans.

It was dropped, as Logan said, because it was too complicated and stretching things a bit to reveal that Picard had a family that he never once mentioned in seven years of television and three other movies. Also, they felt it was too much of a riff on TWOK.

 

[PhoenixIreland]

The notion of a Picard clone being in charge of the Romulan empire was a very stupid story they could have done so much better...

Could've been worse. John Logan stated, in an interview in the defunct Star Trek: The Magazine, that the original idea was that Shinzon was Picard's long-lost son from the Stargazer. Picard would've had a family on that ship, one he never mentions, because they were believed to have been killed during a Romulan attack. It would've been revealed that his son survived and was raised by the Romulans.

It was dropped, as Logan said, because it was too complicated and stretching things a bit to reveal that Picard had a family that he never once mentioned in seven years of television and three other movies. Also, they felt it was too much of a riff on TWOK.

...and the nebula right wasn't a rip off of TWOK?

....it makes as much sense as the idea of a long lost clone

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

The notion of a Picard clone being in charge of the Romulan empire was a very stupid story they could have done so much better...

Could've been worse. John Logan stated, in an interview in the defunct Star Trek: The Magazine, that the original idea was that Shinzon was Picard's long-lost son from the Stargazer. Picard would've had a family on that ship, one he never mentions, because they were believed to have been killed during a Romulan attack. It would've been revealed that his son survived and was raised by the Romulans.

It was dropped, as Logan said, because it was too complicated and stretching things a bit to reveal that Picard had a family that he never once mentioned in seven years of television and three other movies. Also, they felt it was too much of a riff on TWOK.

...and the nebula right wasn't a rip off of TWOK?

....it makes as much sense as the idea of a long lost clone

Hell, the whole damn movie is a riff on TWOK. To a certain extent, the TNG movies from First Contact on are all riffs on TWOK, either in structure or theme.

 

[Lonemagpie]

Shinzon (at least in concept) was the one thing that worked in the film.

That's debatable... A guy who has a *completely* different upbringing and personality from Picard is supposed to be... exactly like Picard.

Um, yeah, right...

 

[Kryton]

Nothing redeemable here. (Squashes heel down.)

 

[Surefire]

To me, this was a terrible movie that disapointing beyond belief.

I wanted a well made movie about the Romulans. Instead, we get the worst TNG movie ever made (IMO) devoted to the Romulans.

Here are the major issues that ruined it:

1. Ridiculous plot
2. Choppy story telling
3. Lame characters (the bad guys particularly)
4. Stupid motives for said characters
5. Worthless battle scene. Building a super ship that was able to defeat two Warbirds and the E-E while barely taking a scratch removed all suspense
6. [FONT=&quot]Embarrassingly [/FONT] bad comic relief
7. No focus -- seems to movie was put together very scatterbrained

I was hoping for such a better movie, and IMO it turned out to be a festering pile of dog crap. It's a shame IMO that the TNG crew had to go out this way. I wish they'd make one more TNG movie so the crew (and fans) could go out on a high note.

 

[muse93muse]

I was going to rip into it but then I thought, I could complain (ALOT) about this one, but it's still in my collection and will never leave my collection...for better or worse, It's a piece of my Star Trek history.

 

[CaptainStoner]

The ship battles in INS and NEM piss me off. In both I seem to remember the Enterprise takes a couple of hits, and the next thing you know the bridge is a mess, warp drive is out, shields are down, etc. The pattern started with the demise of the D. From then on the Enterprise in the films became like Worf was early in the series. Always getting its ass handed to it, and rather quickly. How about letting us see what that new deflector technology can do? Would have loved to have seen a classic ship-type battle with Riker at the helm in INS with more shots of the ships maneuvering and pummeling each other.

 

[jgdst]

I think we've all lost sight of the important issue here.

Troi crashed TWO Enterprises.

Does General Order 7 apply here?

Nemesis, I've gotta say, isn't the best film, but compared to The Final Frontier? You've practically got Shakespeare here.

I think the major issue is Stuart Baird didn't seem to respect the material enough, and seemed to me to want to make his own version of Star Trek, not the one we've all been watching for umpteen years...

It's the little things that chip away at this film - the stars at warp for some reason now make zzzzhish noises, the extras shout out ridiculous lines (like after Geordie beams Picard to the Scimitar and the transporter controls explode, you can hear some redshirt shouting "THE SYSTEM IS FUSED!!!"), the tricorder on the planet oddly doesn't make any noise until Data mentions there's inteference, then it starts making squiffle gerrrrrr nnnnn noises (you can get my rendition of these effects on CD), and then there's the seeming abandonment of the Prime Directive on the planet where they discover B-4. Why would the Reman Viceroy beam onto the lowest deck to get Picard?! Since when was there a deck 29? And why is there still enough space below him to fall to his death?

Data's sacrifice seemed forced at best, and as for Picard ramming the ship - I'm fairly sure that would earn him a court martial...

Actually, on reflection, I'm not that impressed with the film at all now Still better than TFF tho. The whole film had a kind of fanboy feel to it. I like seeing redshirts get blown out into space as much as the next guy, but not like this.

Not like this :'(

The film should definitely have been about the Tribble Alliance instead of the Romulan Empire. A Tribble clone of Picard intent on destroying the Federation? A shock alliance between the Tribbles and the Klingons? You've got yourself a trilogy there.

THAT's how easy it is to write a blockbuster. Get me JJ Abrams on the line, we've got some things to discuss...