Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 5x09 - "Lagrange Point"

[Mr Awe]

They did claim that the Breen are fighting for Imperial control, so having them call the other Big Bad Breen Primarch makes logical sense in the context of their world.

The Breen need to make up their minds. Did they want to put blood hunt on their scion or use him to run the Breen empire?! This group of Breen really aren't that sharp.

To me, it feels like the writers couldn't make up their minds and were trying to see what would stick.

 

[Firebird]

Lots of good action in this one. The episode fucking moved along quick! Unfortunately, it’s left me feeling like the series finale is going to be incredibly rushed, but I hope I’m wrong.

On the downside, Moll remains underwhelming because there’s still no variance to her performance at all. Every scene is the same.

 

[SJGardner]

"We've had one, yes. But what about second black hole?"

Well, I've found I can't just properly review it as an episode, because for the first time in me watching Discovery, this hour truly felt like just an act of a larger story, the monumental, thrilling closing act of an action-adventure movie. After the relative letdown of the previous two weeks, today's episode was an exciting heist all around with rough landings, going undercover, quick-fire brainstorming sessions and coded messages to avoid the villain's suspicion, all thoroughly enjoyable so I could even excuse the plot contrivances needed to have Burnham and Moll and only those two enter the portal at the end. I mean, was it stupid of the Breen to try and throw Burnham and Book in the brig with only two guards so that they could easily dispatch them the moment they're left alone? Of course, but it's stupid in every other movie and it never bothers me so it didn't this time either.

Michael and Book blundering their way through Breen culture was fun to watch, even though this once I really felt that discussing their relationship was out of place, even if Book replied in kind without implying this wasn't the right time. I personally would've preferred they have this talk while preparing for the mission, but ah well, a small nitpick in the overall big picture. Tilly was also in her element today, blowing that stubborn strand of hair out of her eye after the rough jump was the very picture of cuteness, and her interactions with Rayner who showed an uncanny talent of getting her to focus by sternly but neatly snipping off her wayward trains of thought were also hilarious.

I also enjoyed Saru and T'Rina's subplot, they're always refreshing to see in how they play with our (and Saru's) expectations with their conflicts and misunderstandings appearing as classic relationship tropes first before revealing their entirely different context. When T'Rina wordlessly left after Saru volunteered, the episode let us follow his worry that she might be afraid of losing him and wanted to keep him away from the mission, when it turned out she actually just had rational concerns about his emotional involvement possibly affecting his reasoning, something that Saru was all too happy to refute. His words of reassurance as well as T'Rina's argument that it would be illogical to make him promise to return so she'll only ask him to try his best were really emblematic of their delightfully unique romance.

 

[Mr Awe]

No problem.I'll just share a link to the google doc. I've had a devil of a time finding beta readers who don't flake out, so if you want to, be my guest - I'd love the feedback.

There's a tiny bit of Star Trek influence in there with one of the characters, if you look hard enough. Heh.

I've bookmarked it. Will check it out. Thanks!

 

[Mr Awe]

Boy, child rulers in history would irk you probably

Most likely! But at least those cases were based on historical precedents and a supportive culture. Also, they tended to have regents actually running the show.

But, yes, they probably were annoying!

The biggest issue I have with Moll, more than her petulant nature, is that she has no gravitas. I can't buy her being a threat or a ruler.

 

[firehawk12]

That's not how a chain of command works.

I mean there are clearly no rules since anyone can be chosen to be XO apparently, but it's just odd when everything is made up. They could have made her any rank they wanted.

 

[fireproof78]

I mean there are clearly no rules since anyone can be chosen to be XO apparently, but it's just odd when everything is made up. They could have made her any rank they wanted.

Rank doesn't automatically reflect position. The CO can place a line officer in to the chain of command at any position and they are eligible to move up the chain.

Most likely! But at least those cases were based on historical precedents and a supportive culture. Also, they tended to have regents actually running the show.

Oh, not always. And study Roman emperors who even in their 20s were still extremely petulant.

The biggest issue I have with Moll, more than her petulant nature, is that she has no gravitas. I can't buy her being a threat or a ruler.

Ah, well. That's my difference. People are always a threat, no matter the gravitas.

 

[Mr Awe]

The Shuttle was cloaked, it was also coming in directly inline with the Impulse Exhaust port on the Breen ship.
Ergo a "Sensor Blind Spot" due to all the sensor noise caused from the Impulse Exhaust of their own ship.

I must have missed where they said the shuttle was cloaked.

But the exhaust raises several questions.

For one thing, revealing a cloaked ship by having it pass through something has been used several times in ST. The exhaust slamming into the shuttle should be detectable.

Also, hot exhaust?! Are they using chemical rockets?!

None of this detracted from the episode for me. Just idle wonderings!

 

[fireproof78]

Also, hot exhaust?! Are they using chemical rockets?!

Waste heat in a vacuum is very much a concern for spaceships.

 

[mswood]

Donald Trump says hi! I mean seriously the US was run (cough) by a narcissistic egomaniac, who lacked any basic skills in governing. And it's quite possible he will again. And the year he lost had the second highest voting turnout in the recorded history of the US (1960 election just marginally higher).

People through out time have shown the ability to be utterly irrational in whom they support. Obviously the two party system doesn't mean the best people run or get a parties nomination, but seriously..... People complain about age needn't to be a qualifier to vote. How about a testing for critical and rational thought processes.

 

[KamenRiderBlade]

The Breen need to make up their minds. Did they want to put blood hunt on their scion or use him to run the Breen empire?! This group of Breen really aren't that sharp.

Both! They need their Scion Back (ALIVE & in one piece), under the control of his uncle to lay claim to the throne.

To me, it feels like the writers couldn't make up their minds and were trying to see what would stick.

I understand what the writers were getting at.

 

[Mr Awe]

Oh, not always. And study Roman emperors who even in their 20s were still extremely petulant.
Ah, well. That's my difference. People are always a threat, no matter the gravitas.

Usually, yes, though. Regents have existed for ancient Egyptian pharaohs, Chinese Emperors, and various European monarchs.

Some people are more capable at being threats than others, an important distinction.

 

[Yistaan]

Progenitor creation tech that has destructive power seems like Genesis Project 2.0, going where Trek went before 40 years ago. Maybe Burnham will kick Moll into a sea of lava after screaming "I have had enough of you!"

 

[fireproof78]

Usually, yes, though. Regents have existed for ancient Egyptian pharaohs, Chinese Emperors, and various European monarchs.

Some people are more capable at being threats than others, an important distinction.

Moll has demonstrated capacity to be a threat so I see her as one.

And, I never assume someone isn't potentially a threat unless there is an obviously debilitation. Too many horror stories from group homes and psychological treatment inpatient to assume otherwise.

Usually, yes, though. Regents have existed for ancient Egyptian pharaohs, Chinese Emperors, and various European monarchs.

Of course. But, the question is of petulance, and Roman emperors were famous for it, especially in their late teens and early 20s.

I don't know. I find Moll credible enough to work. Mileage varies.

 

[Mr Awe]

Waste heat in a vacuum is very much a concern for spaceships.

This wasn't waste heat in the sense of thermal radiation. This was a very hot exhaust.

And, usually the concern for spaceships and heat is finding ways to radiate it away effectively because they can't use conduction or convection because those require an atmosphere.

So, that's entirely different.

 

[fireproof78]

This wasn't waste heat in the sense of thermal radiation. This was a very hot exhaust.

And, usually the concern for spaceships and heat is finding ways to radiate it away effectively because they can't use conduction or convection because those require an atmosphere.

So, that's entirely different.

So, possibly through an exhaust system?

"The thing has to have a tailpipe."

 

[Mr Awe]

Moll has demonstrated capacity to be a threat so I see her as one.

Moll has had a considerable assist from the writers. I don't find her rise to power as being plausible at all.

Obviously we differ on that perception!

 

[KamenRiderBlade]

I must have missed where they said the shuttle was cloaked.

But the exhaust raises several questions.

For one thing, revealing a cloaked ship by having it pass through something has been used several times in ST. The exhaust slamming into the shuttle should be detectable.

Most people aren't staring at their hot exhausts, especially in a area with a high amount of debris & crap flying by like when they're near a set of Binary Black holes. Sensors just see crap going out of your aft Impulse Exhaust Port as typical noise. Doesn't matter what gets cooked when going into the Exhausts path.

Also, hot exhaust?! Are they using chemical rockets?!

None of this detracted from the episode for me. Just idle wonderings!

Impulse Engines are Sub-Space enhanced Fusion Rockets that propel themselves off of Plasma Exhaust out of the aft of your vessel.

 

[fireproof78]

Moll has had a considerable assist from the writers. I don't find her rise to power as being plausible at all.

Obviously we differ on that perception!

I mean, she took down Fred with cunning and obvious duplicity so I don't struggle with this idea that she can, with insider knowledge like form another Breen, be able to step in.

Yes, of course the writing gives an assist. That's usually what I see in Star Trek.

 

[Mr Awe]

So, possibly through an exhaust system?

"The thing has to have a tailpipe."

Yes, for chemical rockets as I mentioned. I kind of assumed the Breen would be past that. Although, I don't know if it was ever discussed in ST how the sub-light drives for the various species works? I assumed they weren't chemical by that far in the future, but this would seem to suggest they do.

No big deal though. It just surprised me because that would seem to be a relatively primitive technology.

But it doesn't affect my enjoyment. Just something that struck me.