So what if Nova Squadron had pulled off that starburst trick?

[enterprisecvn65]

What did Nova Squadron hope to accomplish by pulling off that whatever it was called starburst at graduation, other than giving the assembled crowd and graduates something to be impressed by and go "Wow, that was f'n cool"

Did the really thing that Starfleet Academy administrators, as well as the other Federation brass that might be in attendance would go "Holy Shit....they just pulled off a stunt that is extremely dangerous and has been explicitly banned for decades. Not only that, but they've clearly been practicing it for a while so they've broken the rule maybe a hundred times or more. Plus the fact they practiced in secret and out of sight shows they knew what they were doing was forbidden and yet went ahead and did it anyway and took great pains to conceal their plans. Plus not one of the five members decided to obey the school's honor code and, at some point, realize they had a duty to report this......But they pulled it off beautifully so what the hell does it matter they broke some serious rules and violated the honor and trust placed in them by Starfleet. LeCarno we're promoting you to Captain and giving you your own ship immediately, and the underclassmen get to skip the rest of the Academy and will be commanders and will get a ship within a year"

Did they seriouly think there wouldn't be serious ramifications even if they did pull off the stunt successfully and the people in charge would just go "Screw the rules and codes of the academy....well done everyone." What the F was going through their minds when they came up with this idea, it's a total lose/lose. Either you screw up during training, like what happened, or you do it successfully and piss your superiors off that you pulled such a stunt and were extremely deceptive and dishonest in how you did it......What the hell did they think Starfleet Academy was? Animal House.

Reminds me of Top Gun when Maverick would do stupid and forbidden shit like blow by the tower and all he would receive is an ass chewing by one of his superiors and then sent on his merry way. If someone did that for real in the military at they very least they'd be grounded for a hell of a long time and more than likely would lose their wing and be reassigned to Alaska staring at a radar screen all day for the rest of their hitch.

 

[Marsden]

I think it's simply a result of non serving writers writing about something as they "imagine" it to be. They were never in any kind of situation like that, and that's popular culture's view of those kind of things. Just like cops that break the law are great and by the book procedure is considered stupid.

LeCarno we're promoting you to Captain and giving you your own ship immediately, and the underclassmen get to skip the rest of the Academy and will be commanders and will get a ship within a year"

But in the JJverse, that's exactly what would happen.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

LeCarno we're promoting you to Captain and giving you your own ship immediately, and the underclassmen get to skip the rest of the Academy and will be commanders and will get a ship within a year"

But in the JJverse, that's exactly what would happen.

No they promoted a Lieutenant to Captain for saving Earth and the rest of the federation from a psychotic time traveling Romulan with a pointy death ship. Totally different.

 

[Makarov]

I guess they expect to have increased reputation, which is actually valuable because getting promoted seems to come down to who you know. Picard just passes up boring first officers with perfect records and chooses Riker because he has something interesting on his resume.

Wesley already had a reputation though so it wouldn't benefit him at all. Wesley should have stopped time and then saved them with his traveler powers.

Nova Squadron is the worst.. Locarno expelled, Wesley quits starfleet, and that bajoran lady dies in Lower Decks. The academy should have something called the "nova squadron curse."

 

[Ithekro]

Red Squad assisted with the Leyton Coup, got set out on a deep space cadet cruise near the Cardassian border in a time of high hostility. Basically Starfleet figured they could get rid of them while also taking out some Dominion enemies. I just wonder what terrible thing those few officers running the Valiant did to deserve that fate?

 

[T'Girl]

No they promoted a Lieutenant to Captain for saving Earth and the rest of the federation from a psychotic time traveling Romulan with a pointy death ship. Totally different.

No, regardless of the rank of Lieutenant (temporary perhaps for the duration of the deployment?), Kirk was a third year cadet, promoting him to Captain was foolish on the parts of the writers and producers.

Cadet Kirk should have receive a commendation and a very nice notation in his service record, nothing more.

I think it's simply a result of non serving writers writing about something as they "imagine" it to be.

In reality all four cadets would have been arrested upon landing, there would have been a hearing and they would have been escorted to the nearest public street with the clothes they arrived with.

 

[Timo]

From the 2009 movie, we get the impression that Captain Pike, seemingly in charge of drafting somehow, believed Starfleet needed to get more mavericks in order to meet the demands placed on it. And he had supporters, did manage to get Kirk in, and apparently was head honcho Marcus' right-hand man and all. We don't know that this timeline would be all that different from the one that begat Locarno and Watters; apparently, it does pay off to have people who are interested in abusing the powers and hardware assigned to them when need be, and has paid off for centuries by the time Watters hijacks the Valiant.

Locarno would certainly know of the drafting policy - of hellraisers getting starship commands while merely superbly competent people get support duties. His personal gambit probably would pay off in the circumstances, then. Assuming, that is, that the Starburst worked. Nothing about the cover-up over the death would boost his reputation, but the actual stunt would: once it was performed, and the misdeeds leading up to it revealed by inference, these "heroes" would freely and proudly confess and even make a big speech at their trial like Kirk in the 2009 one. Starfleet would be "forced" to punish them, but people like Pike would make notes in their little black PADDs and greatly brighten the future of these rascals.

Why not risk it? They could get expelled at any time anyway, if failing a crucial psych test or something ("Bread and Circuses"), and supposedly there are no second chances. In an organization apparently millions of officers strong, operating inside a society that guarantees sustenance and happy life no matter what, standing out would be the only point of ever attending.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

LeCarno we're promoting you to Captain and giving you your own ship immediately, and the underclassmen get to skip the rest of the Academy and will be commanders and will get a ship within a year"

But in the JJverse, that's exactly what would happen.

No they promoted a Lieutenant to Captain for saving Earth and the rest of the federation from a psychotic time traveling Romulan with a pointy death ship. Totally different.

In the prime timeline, Kirk graduated from the Academy with the rank of Lieutenant. I find it likely that, had the hearing not been interrupted (in ST09), the exact same thing would have happened. So Kirk's rank in ST09 is not a brevet or temporary rank, it's permanent. He really was supposed to be a Lieutenant. And skipping the LCDR and CDR grades is unusual, but not unheard of (didn't the same thing happen with Picard?).

As for Nova Squadron: In the real services, they would have all been court-martialed, even if the stunt had worked and nobody had died.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I think it's simply a result of non serving writers writing about something as they "imagine" it to be. They were never in any kind of situation like that, and that's popular culture's view of those kind of things. Just like cops that break the law are great and by the book procedure is considered stupid.

I think even writers who have served are more than willing to go for the dramatic/cool thing rather than the realistic thing. That's why Spock isn't in a stockade after TOS season one.

 

[Ithekro]

I seem to recall Janeway saying something about all the officers in the likes of Kirk or Sulu would have been drummed out of Starfleet by her time. It was a different era in the 23rd century.

 

[enterprisecvn65]

From the 2009 movie, we get the impression that Captain Pike, seemingly in charge of drafting somehow, believed Starfleet needed to get more mavericks in order to meet the demands placed on it. And he had supporters, did manage to get Kirk in, and apparently was head honcho Marcus' right-hand man and all. We don't know that this timeline would be all that different from the one that begat Locarno and Watters; apparently, it does pay off to have people who are interested in abusing the powers and hardware assigned to them when need be, and has paid off for centuries by the time Watters hijacks the Valiant.

Locarno would certainly know of the drafting policy - of hellraisers getting starship commands while merely superbly competent people get support duties. His personal gambit probably would pay off in the circumstances, then. Assuming, that is, that the Starburst worked. Nothing about the cover-up over the death would boost his reputation, but the actual stunt would: once it was performed, and the misdeeds leading up to it revealed by inference, these "heroes" would freely and proudly confess and even make a big speech at their trial like Kirk in the 2009 one. Starfleet would be "forced" to punish them, but people like Pike would make notes in their little black PADDs and greatly brighten the future of these rascals.

Why not risk it? They could get expelled at any time anyway, if failing a crucial psych test or something ("Bread and Circuses"), and supposedly there are no second chances. In an organization apparently millions of officers strong, operating inside a society that guarantees sustenance and happy life no matter what, standing out would be the only point of ever attending.

Timo Saloniemi

Why not risk it because there's a chance they could get expelled anyway for something else?!?!?!

By that logic I should just stick a bullet in the old revolver and get my friends together for a high stakes game or Russian roulette. I mean why the hell not? I could die at any moment anyway, why not take the risk of blowing by brains out if it can make me some cash.

Yeah you can get tossed out of a service academy for a variety of reasons. The general idea though is to do your best, follow the rules and hope it's enough to get you through. Not to dramatically increase your chances of getting thrown out by committing a dangerous and forbidden action on the 1 in a million chance some higher up might be impressed with your balls and willingness to disregard rules and codes for nothing more than some cheap ass stunt and think "Man he'd be a hell of a captain"

 

[Nerys Myk]

I seem to recall Janeway saying something about all the officers in the likes of Kirk or Sulu would have been drummed out of Starfleet by her time. It was a different era in the 23rd century.

She did. But she has a skewed view of the 23rd Century. She also thought they pack their ships like sardines, yet the corridors are quite spacious and were rarely teaming with people.

 

[Ithekro]

Well a ship the size of hers would have had three times as many people on it at the time of Kirk's five year mission.

And how many people are walking the corridors typically on ship? A third of the crew will be at their stations. Another third is probably sleeping. The last third are probably busy in one place in their off time (probably in the bowling alley...)

 

[Nerys Myk]

Well a ship the size of hers would have had three times as many people on it at the time of Kirk's five year mission.

And how many people are walking the corridors typically on ship? A third of the crew will be at their stations. Another third is probably sleeping. The last third are probably busy in one place in their off time (probably in the bowling alley...)

Depends on how many extras they could afford in the episode.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

Slap on the wrist and permanent hero worship.

 

[Dukhat]

Even had they pulled it off and no one got killed, it shouldn't have mattered. A banned maneuver is a banned maneuver. They would have been reprimanded if not outright expelled IRL. In the Trek universe, who the hell knows.

 

[Ithekro]

From observed effect in Star Trek, they would have a reprimand but also a quiet mark of pride for doing somethng daring. Also a reputation has skilled pilots for pulling that off. If Starfleet needs pilots of that skill level, their reprimands aren't going to stop them from getting positions as helmsman across the fleet, or as pilots for some of those fighter-like ships we see in the Dominion War.

If they manage to do nothing else particularly stupid and regs breaking, the reprimand will probably be quietly ignored most of the time. Only brought up when they do something bad, or if they make a political enemy for promotion to command or department positions. The reprimand being a tool at that point to keep them out of positions for a bit. Wesley won't have these problems due to connections and expericance on USS Enterprise. Service on the flagship does have merits and potenally having a recommendation by Captian Picard is almost more than enough by the time Lt. Commander Crusher is up for the XO or chief engineer of some starship.

 

[Makarov]

I just want to point out that Picard actually says he requested the bajoran girl from Nova Squadron to be aboard the enterprise because of this incident. Although morbid it seemed to have benefitted her career even by failing the attempt.

(granted she blew up five seconds later)

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

If it were the TOS-era they might've been given a pat on the back for their daring, but by TNG they are somewhat stricter so it probably would've been a slap on the wrists--even if it had worked out alright on the night.

There would undoubtedly be some who would worship them for what they did, even some Captain's might like the streak of bravado in young officers, and take them under their wing to nurture them into becoming bigger and better. Many would probably give them a wide berth, or if forced to take them onboard their ship would have them watched closely--they obviously can't follow the rules and have issues with the health and safety in the workplace

If in NuTrek, Locarno would be a Captain, Wesley would be his temperamental XO who would fly into fits of rage over the death of his father and overbearing mother, Hajar would be his moaning girlfriend who picks fights at inappropriate moments, Sito would prance about in her skivvies, whilst Josh Albert would be ignored and largely forgotten about in the background

 

[Ithekro]

Not sure. In TOS a black mark for leaving a circuit open that nearly cost them the ship leads Ben Finney to be an Ensign for a decade or more while Kirk becomes his Captain. To some accounts, it was Kirk who go Finney on Enterprise by request.