So the Regeneration limit jumps from 12 to 507...? SJA SPOILERS

[diankra]

No retconning on my part. I have always viewed those other faces as anything but those of Morbius and have trouble how anybody could consider them the Doctor since it had already been established that Hartnell was the first.

Well, without be rude enough to ask your age, I suspect it does depend on how old you were in 1976.

I don't think age has much to do about how the scene was viewed, like many others I thought those were past faces of Morbius not the Doctor. Of course in Mawdryn Undead the Doctor said he had more lives left, so I guess you either go by behind the scenes talk or what's onscreen.

Sorry, I could have made my point clearer: I meant that if you first saw Morbius in January 1976, then you tend to view it differently from someone who's watching it after Deadly Assassin and already knows about the 12 regenerations thing from all the mentions in PR material, reference books and DWM.
BTW: My sister (who also saw it back on first transmission) says for she thought then that the other faces were Hartnell getting younger...

 

[Professor Zoom]

What is it with fanboys not being able to take a joke? I just don't get it.

 

[The]

There’s a fascinating academic study to be made out of how some facts stick and some don’t – how Jon Pertwee’s Doctor could say he was thousands of years old, and no-one listens to that, and yet someone once says he’s only got thirteen lives, and it becomes lore. It’s really interesting, I think. That’s why I’m quite serious that that 507 thing won’t stick, because the 13 is too deeply ingrained in the public consciousness. But how? How did that get there? It’s fascinating, it’s really weird. Anyway, that’ll be my book in my retirement!

Assuming RTD is the one who said that, I don't understand what he's talking about. Is he saying that because we don't bitch loudly that he changed the Doctor from being thousands of years old to "900" that we don't "listen" to that? What? HE'S the one that changed the age rule in the first place! If Pertwee said he was thousands of years old, then that should at least tell you that having the 9th Doctor say he's 900 is where it went wrong. His statements don't really correlate or make any sense...

 

[JoeZhang]

There’s a fascinating academic study to be made out of how some facts stick and some don’t – how Jon Pertwee’s Doctor could say he was thousands of years old, and no-one listens to that, and yet someone once says he’s only got thirteen lives, and it becomes lore. It’s really interesting, I think. That’s why I’m quite serious that that 507 thing won’t stick, because the 13 is too deeply ingrained in the public consciousness. But how? How did that get there? It’s fascinating, it’s really weird. Anyway, that’ll be my book in my retirement!

Assuming RTD is the one who said that, I don't understand what he's talking about. Is he saying that because we don't bitch loudly that he changed the Doctor from being thousands of years old to "900" that we don't "listen" to that? What? HE'S the one that changed the age rule in the first place! If Pertwee said he was thousands of years old, then that should at least tell you that having the 9th Doctor say he's 900 is where it went wrong. His statements don't really correlate or make any sense...

No he's talking about the fact that the Pertwee's Doctor is thousands of years old and then the fourth Doctor is suddenly 750.

 

[Samurai8472]

There’s a fascinating academic study to be made out of how some facts stick and some don’t – how Jon Pertwee’s Doctor could say he was thousands of years old, and no-one listens to that, and yet someone once says he’s only got thirteen lives, and it becomes lore. It’s really interesting, I think. That’s why I’m quite serious that that 507 thing won’t stick, because the 13 is too deeply ingrained in the public consciousness. But how? How did that get there? It’s fascinating, it’s really weird. Anyway, that’ll be my book in my retirement!

Assuming RTD is the one who said that,

Yep Russell also talked about the 507 regenerations

http://www.sfx.co.uk/2010/10/26/int...-talks-about-that-sarah-jane-adventures-line/

 

[StCoop]

If Pertwee said he was thousands of years old, then that should at least tell you that having the 9th Doctor say he's 900 is where it went wrong. His statements don't really correlate or make any sense...

Pertwee said he was thousands of years old and then a few years later the 4th Doctor was only 750, long before Davies was involved.

His statement that fandom picks and chooses the "facts" it cares to place importance on makes perfect sense.

 

[The]

And that was forty-years-ago, and there was no internet. So, how would he or anyone else know who bitched about what, when that happened? Answer: He doesn't. He's just trying to say "Those guys back then did it and you thought it was okay!" Yet, has no proof that anyone back then thought, "Oh hmmm, you know that Hinchcliffe fellow is right and we shouldn't bitch cause he knows best". In fact, I'm pretty sure there were quite a few that rolled their eyes and thought, "Do the people that make this even watch their own show?" But, hey, that's just a guess since I wasn't there either. Thus, my point stands. RTD's just pulling it all from his ass...

 

[Skellington]

What is it with fanboys not being able to take a joke? I just don't get it.

Exactly. As RTD himself pointed out, it creates no problems whatsoever for the parent show. Maybe he should just have had Eleven say "507, now quiet please!" just to spell it out.

 

[VDCNI]

And that was forty-years-ago, and there was no internet. So, how would he or anyone else know who bitched about what, when that happened? Answer: He doesn't. He's just trying to say "Those guys back then did it and you thought it was okay!" Yet, has no proof that anyone back then thought, "Oh hmmm, you know that Hinchcliffe fellow is right and we shouldn't bitch cause he knows best". In fact, I'm pretty sure there were quite a few that rolled their eyes and thought, "Do the people that make this even watch their own show?" But, hey, that's just a guess since I wasn't there either. Thus, my point stands. RTD's just pulling it all from his ass...

Since when has RTD bothered justifying himself to fandom!? Why would he care enough to say this unless he actually finds it interesting.

Anyway organised Who fandom started around that time, DWAS and fanzines etc. We know for example that The Deadly Assassin was very badly received at the time for its potrayal of the Time Lords. Fandom existed before the internet.

 

[Professor Zoom]

RTD's just pulling it all from his ass...

But in regards to the 507 regenerations, he ADMITS that.

 

[Guartho]

Pertwee said he was thousands of years old and then a few years later the 4th Doctor was only 750

Does 3 specifically mention whose years he's measuring his age in? Seems pretty Earth-centric of us to assume a cosmopolitan traveler in space and time will always be talking about years in our years.

 

[JoeZhang]

And that was forty-years-ago, and there was no internet. So, how would he or anyone else know who bitched about what, when that happened? Answer: He doesn't. He's just trying to say "Those guys back then did it and you thought it was okay!" Yet, has no proof that anyone back then thought, "Oh hmmm, you know that Hinchcliffe fellow is right and we shouldn't bitch cause he knows best". In fact, I'm pretty sure there were quite a few that rolled their eyes and thought, "Do the people that make this even watch their own show?" But, hey, that's just a guess since I wasn't there either. Thus, my point stands. RTD's just pulling it all from his ass...

I know this is hard for young fans to understand but fandom did actually exist before the internet. People wrote news letters and fan magazines.

 

[JoeZhang]

Pertwee said he was thousands of years old and then a few years later the 4th Doctor was only 750

Does 3 specifically mention whose years he's measuring his age in? Seems pretty Earth-centric of us to assume a cosmopolitan traveler in space and time will always be talking about years in our years.

Oh please... once you get into that level of fanwankery, you might as well give up.... it's a kid's show, when he says years he means years.

 

[Captain Pike]

507? Silly RTD!

 

[Guartho]

when he says years he means years.

3 was pretty good at specifying when he was referring to another planet's version of something. Venutian Akido anyone?

 

[Skellington]

Does 3 specifically mention whose years he's measuring his age in? Seems pretty Earth-centric of us to assume a cosmopolitan traveler in space and time will always be talking about years in our years.

Fair pointy, but I'd go with Earth years on the basis that he was talking to humans.

 

[Bones2]

As for your idea, good for you but, as I think Lonemagpie once said, having an idea is the easy part, writing the story is the hard part; but if you want to be a writer go for it, the BBC Writers' room does accept scripts (though not for Who, but just like anyone else you'll have to serve your apprenticship if you're good enough before they'd let you anywhere near it).

Oh yeah, I'm under no illusion that I've near fuck all chance of getting my idea in there. I'm actually tragically plugging away on writing a two-parter in my spare time for Smith's Doctor that I like to think ties into the 2012 end of the world stuff in a clever way, but I'm quite aware there's next to zero chance of it going anywhere, however good it is. But as for the regeneration limit, it's not something that needs dealing with now anyway, which is why I'd rather it wasn't bothered with for the time being. My story would be the 12/13th regeneration, and as I'd like to think Smith'll be in the role for many years (he's wonderful ), I'd like think it won't be mentioned again until then.

I took the line to be a joke and once again something that the fandom is tearing apart and really makes no difference in the long run.

I don't think a single fan of the show (well, Jon Blum might) thinks the Doctor now has 507 regenerations. But it's brought up the subject, which is always worth discussing.

The line will be decidedly swept away years from now, just like how RTD has done Robert Holmes Deadly Assassin line.....and Azmael's final 13th incarnation death in Twin Dilemma.....and The Doctor being faced with death in Mawdryn Undead when they needed to use his remaining eight lives.....and all the times The Master was trying to get The Doctor's remaining regenerations (1970's/1980's/1990's).....or when The Valeyard was described as coming from somewhere between the Doctor's twelfth and final 13th incarnation.....or when the 8th Doctor said, point-blank, that he has thirteen lives.....and when, you know, it was a fact of the show for thirty-five years.

But, hey, it's RTD, right? So, what everyone has done before is irrelevant. Right?

Good stuff. I wonder what exactly we ever disagree about sometimes.

 

[Cutter John]

Seesm to me its like the Colonel dissapearing. He's left it up to future writers to take or leave as they see fit.

Or hey, another possibility is maybe Rassillon shared part of his little secret with some of his favorites during the Time War (probably whether they wanted it or not).

 

[Samurai8472]

RTD's just pulling it all from his ass...

This is the guy that basically said he just makes things up off the cuff

"I live in the moment!"

http://www.sfx.co.uk/

Discussing re-watching a repeat of “The Sound Of Drums”, he ponders the fact that you suddenly learn about things like the Archangel network, the Valiant, and the TARDIS becoming a Paradox Machine out of nowhere, with no advance seeding or foreshadowing in the script. It’s a fascinating passage, worth quoting at length: “I can see how annoying that looks. I can see how maddening it must be, for some people. Especially if you’re imposing really classical script structures and templates on that episode, even unconsciously. I must look like a vandal, a kid or an amateur… The simple fact is, all those things were planned. All of them were my choice. They’re not lazy, clumsy or desperate. They’re chosen. I can see more traditional ways of telling those stories, but I’m not interested. I think the stuff that you gain from writing in this way – the shock, the whirlwind, the freedom, the exhilaration – is worth the world. I’ve got this sort of tumbling, freewheeling style that somersaults along, with everything happening now - not later, not before, but now, now, now. I’ve made a Doctor Who that exists in the present tense. It’s happening now, right in front of your eyes! If you don’t like it, if you don’t join in with it then… blimey, these episodes must be nonsensical

 

[Bones2]

^
One of the more irritating quotes from the man. "I'm a revolutionary; it's your own problem if you mistake it for incompetence". The reason traditional and classical script structures developed is because they work. Just chucking any old rubbish in is fundamentally unsatisfying, and I think it's a vain attempt to pretend he's operating on a whole 'nother level rather than being an incapable hack.