So Black Hole is officially being remade by Disney?

[MeanJoePhaser]

^^ Yippee ki-yay, robof#cker?


LOL

"I think he's an astrocop."

"What makes you think that?"

"Things he said, like being able to spot bad a.i."

"Christ, he could be a f#ckin' computer programmer!"

and...

"Hanz, did you have to blow up the whole spaceship?!"

"If you steal a billion dollar spaceship they will find you unless they think you are already dead."

 

[Holoaddict]

I would also be interested in a remake, with a few conditions

1. They should keep B.O.B, V.I.N.C.E.N.T and Maximilian (Especially Maximillian)!

2.They should keep the music. The opening music was the first thing that came to mind when I saw this thread. Check it out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTuKQEJErGg

 

[Harvey]

Barry's score is certainly a classic. I haven't even seen the film (yet), but I'm well aware of the score (especially the main theme).

Actually, why not just bring back John Barry? He hasn't worked since Enigma in 2001, but perhaps he could be brought out of retirement?

 

[MeanJoePhaser]

It was Frank McCrae (Kate's father), who had - in life - been trapped inside of Maximilian; Frank's brain was used as the "A.I." for the big robot. Reinhardt did this because Frank led the Cygnus crew in mutiny against him, and Reinhardt wanted revenge.

The angelic being we see is actually the soul of Frank being released and sent to his final reward in Heaven.

we see the Cygnus' robotified crew in "Hell," but why would they be there?

Part of Reinhardt's punishment, most likely. The humanoids aren't really there, probably just the bodies wandering around mindlessly (the souls having passed on to Heaven like Frank did). So Reinhardt gets to 'rule' over a 'kingdom' of empty shells.

Was Reinhardt and Maxmillian made into one being? Or....what?

Again: part of Reinhardt's eternal punishment. In life, Reinhardt trapped Frank McCrae inside Maximilian because the robot needed an A.I..

Based on what I read elsewhere, there's no evidence that interpretation has any basis in the story at all. Not sure where the "Maximillian's brain was Frank McCrae's" came from. All the security robots have a.i., apparently not using human brains. Maximillain was more advanced a.i.

Another, more far fetched theory is that Maximillian was the real Reinhardt (his brain inside, because he'd have died of old age otherwise) and the human Reinhardt was a copy clone or robot...what the fuck was the person smoking when they came up with that one?

The other theory, that while the bad side of Reinhardt went to hell, the good side of Reinhardt went to heaven (he was the "angel" seen). HUH?

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Not sure where the "Maximillian's brain was Frank McCrae's" came from.

I agree it's speculation, but it does make sense. We already know that Frank tried to lead a mutiny against Reinhardt. So using Frank's brain for Maximilian would seem to be entirely within Reinhardt's character.

All the security robots have a.i., apparently not using human brains. Maximillain was more advanced a.i.

Then again, there's no proof that S.T.A.R., his troops, or Maximilian himself *weren't* simply lobotomized humans just like the rest of the Cygnus' crew... If the technology existed to lobotomize the crew, it probably also exists to use the extracted minds for computer AI's (which may yield 'better' such minds than if the robots simply had computer brains of their own).

The other theory, that while the bad side of Reinhardt went to hell, the good side of Reinhardt went to heaven (he was the "angel" seen). HUH?

I don't see how that could be possible either. Reinhardt clearly had NO good side.

 

[MeanJoePhaser]

The security robots had to have existed in some form before Reinhardt took over, or how else could he have restrained the entire crew? I mean, fuck, Old B.O.B. could've handed Hanz his ass by himself.

Also, we see a security robot's head explode as it takes the lobotmizing beam meant for Kate McCrae...inside it was shown as circuits.

B.O.B. and V.I.N.C.E.N.T. seem have quite capable A.I., btw. If they had human brains in them...well, ick!

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

B.O.B. and V.I.N.C.E.N.T. seem have quite capable A.I., btw. If they had human brains in them...well, ick!

They sounded human enough. Especially B.O.B. Why would a strictly robotic organism talk like Slim Pickens?

In any case, they could have had human engrams (a la the M-5 from ST:TOS) but not the actual physical brain tissue itself. Same for Maximilian, S.T.A.R., etc.

 

[The Castellan]

Not sure where the "Maximillian's brain was Frank McCrae's" came from.

I agree it's speculation, but it does make sense. We already know that Frank tried to lead a mutiny against Reinhardt. So using Frank's brain for Maximilian would seem to be entirely within Reinhardt's character.

All the security robots have a.i., apparently not using human brains. Maximillain was more advanced a.i.

Then again, there's no proof that S.T.A.R., his troops, or Maximilian himself *weren't* simply lobotomized humans just like the rest of the Cygnus' crew... If the technology existed to lobotomize the crew, it probably also exists to use the extracted minds for computer AI's (which may yield 'better' such minds than if the robots simply had computer brains of their own).

The other theory, that while the bad side of Reinhardt went to hell, the good side of Reinhardt went to heaven (he was the "angel" seen). HUH?

I don't see how that could be possible either. Reinhardt clearly had NO good side.

I think Reinhart simply reconditioned the Sentry robots to obey him, sorta like Terren Kapel did to the robots in the Dr. Who story, The Robots of Death. He either reprogramed them directly, or used some sort of secondary control overides. Hell, for all we know, Reinhart might have been the one who designed and created the sentries himself. Either way, he waited till the time was right, and ordered the sentries in action and take over the ship.
He'd have the advantage of surprise, plus robots don't get tired.

 

[splodenode]

that ending was scary when i was a kid

 

[Chaos Descending]

B.O.B. and V.I.N.C.E.N.T. seem have quite capable A.I., btw. If they had human brains in them...well, ick!

They sounded human enough. Especially B.O.B. Why would a strictly robotic organism talk like Slim Pickens?

In any case, they could have had human engrams (a la the M-5 from ST:TOS) but not the actual physical brain tissue itself. Same for Maximilian, S.T.A.R., etc.

And don't forget that V.I.N.CENT was telepathically linked to Kate McRae as well.

Human brain? Maybe...

 

[Peter the Younger]

I'll admit to a weird affection for the ending - I never would have expected Disney to turn a sci-fi climax into a full-blown religious vision - I'd like to see a little more hard science in the remake. The timelike curvature of space around a really big black hole might lend itself to all sorts of weird endings.

But they must, must, must keep Maximillian.

 

[Christopher]

B.O.B. and V.I.N.C.E.N.T. seem have quite capable A.I., btw. If they had human brains in them...well, ick!

If the "good guys'" robots had human brains in them, I don't think the characters would've been so horrified by Reinhardt's "Cyber-conversion" (as it were) of the crew.

They sounded human enough. Especially B.O.B. Why would a strictly robotic organism talk like Slim Pickens?

Why would an in-car GPS device talk like Homer Simpson or Mr. T? People like giving novelty voices to machines. (This is also the current topic in Doonesbury. I find it perfectly plausible that future robots and AIs would be programmed to simulate celebrity voices. Maybe the designers of V.I.N.CENT paid the heirs of Roddy MacDowall a licensing fee for his voiceprint. Or maybe each robot of that class has a whole menu of celebrity voice options on top of the default options, kinda like how the Planet Express ship in Futurama could be reset to sound like Sigourney Weaver. (Although they'd be more likely to use contemporary celebs rather than 20th-century ones, but there are always people who like nostalgia. Given the technology, I'm sure some people would want their GPS or other talking devices to sound like Cary Grant or Lauren Bacall or Orson Welles. Heck, I'd like my computer a lot more if it talked like Lauren Bacall.)

And don't forget that V.I.N.CENT was telepathically linked to Kate McRae as well.

Human brain? Maybe...

Since Kate's "telepathy" seems to have been limited to contacting V.I.N.CENT, I tend to interpret it as some kind of communication/interface implant in her brain.

 

[drasche]

I think it was explicitely mentioned in the comic adaptation that Kate has indeed an implant allowing her to telepathically talk with VINCENT (I could be wrong, that was a very long time ago )

 

[Chaos Descending]

And don't forget that V.I.N.CENT was telepathically linked to Kate McRae as well.

Human brain? Maybe...

Since Kate's "telepathy" seems to have been limited to contacting V.I.N.CENT, I tend to interpret it as some kind of communication/interface implant in her brain.

Quite valid POV, naturally. My only counter (weak indeed), is that the nature of it was never mentioned at all, so we are free to speculate on it to our heart's content.

 

[Christopher]

I think it was explicitely mentioned in the comic adaptation that Kate has indeed an implant allowing her to telepathically talk with VINCENT (I could be wrong, that was a very long time ago )

Maybe that's where I got the idea.

 

[milo bloom]

I just remembered I have Alan Dean Foster's novelization. Just flipped through and it's a device implanted in McRae's brain that allows her to contact Vincent. Says she underwent the risky operation to make her a better candidate for the deep space mission.


As for the ending, just looking at the last few pages it doesn't mention Reinhardt, but the good guys retain their "essences", and physically become part of the universe.

 

[stonester1]

No, I definitely would not call The Black Hole a kid's movie...not that kid's can't enjoy it. Hell, when I was a kid I liked Logan's Run -- but that clearly was not a kid's movie either...

Agreed. Love both movies and also agree that both movies, though still very enjoyable, certainly aren't the final word on their subject.

And, interestingly, Logan's Run is in the remake hopper, too.

It's good to be a geek.

 

[Christopher]

I just remembered I have Alan Dean Foster's novelization. Just flipped through and it's a device implanted in McRae's brain that allows her to contact Vincent. Says she underwent the risky operation to make her a better candidate for the deep space mission.

Okay, that's definitely where I got the idea, then, because I used to have the novelization myself, and in fact I read the book long before I ever got to see the movie (which I didn't actually see until it came to television, I believe).

What threw me off was that I remembered the ending where Kate's telepathy linked everyone's discorporated essences together, and that didn't seem compatible with the idea of it just being a communications implant.

 

[stonester1]

Unless she was given the procedure because her brain had the capacity, but the implant she was given only tuned her to VinCENT. That the "spiritual evolution" she went through at the end used her as the conduit, that potential, to reach out to her whole crew...

...an idea.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

And, interestingly, Logan's Run is in the remake hopper, too.

And HAS been for about 15 years now. It pretty much defines the phrase "development hell".