Size of NX01 vs other ships

[In Thy Image]

NX was smaller and had a much smaller crew complement to show it was an older ship. Also food, water, and machinery would take up more space because the technology was more primitive. Having no starbase support network they probably carried a lot of spare parts (they were able to build two new phase cannons from scratch in "Silent Enemy").
I read somewhere that Galaxy class ship complement varies according to the mission. So 1014 crewmen was not necessarily a fixed number. Also TNG Technical Manual claims Galaxy class ships could evacuate up to 15 000 people, so they probably had a lot of extra space. Not to mention cetacean ops and supposed huge mall/grotto for crew comfort

 

[Anduril]

The Abramsverse ships are bigger simply to sex up the franchise for the teenage action movie audience.

That's your opinion.

 

[C.E. Evans]

Back when ENT started, I thought that NX-01 perhaps was a bit too big for her britches, but then I realized that there was nothing that said she couldn't be that big in that point of time. She would still be smaller than the TOS Enterprise when all is said and done.

 

[Tenacity]

The Abramsverse ships are bigger simply to sex up the franchise for the teenage action movie audience.

And to compete with Star Wars and their thirty mile long lawn darts.

It was never made clear why the Abrams-prise needed to be larger. What's the reason for being so much bigger than a prime connie? One theory I've read is the technology is in fact vastly more primitive, and they require a larger ship to fit in essentially the exact same equipment and capasities.

I read somewhere that Galaxy class ship complement varies according to the mission. So 1014 crewmen ...

Is 1,014 just crewmembers, with the spouses and children and visiting scientist and the odd VIP being extra?

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

And to compete with Star Wars and their thirty mile long lawn darts.

It was never made clear why the Abrams-prise needed to be larger, I don't think we're ever told what the crew compliment is. The E-D is supposedly a flying starbase, so what is the Abrams-prise's excuse?
Is 1,014 just crewmembers, with the spouses and children and visiting scientist and the odd VIP being extra?

Actually, I read somewhere - not sure where - that the ships crew (needed to fly and 'fight' the ship) is usually ~800 with civilian services and research personnel, spouses and children bringing the total to ~1000 (+/- <10%) depending on crew rotations and current mission profile.

 

[Ithekro]

I seem to recall that the 2009 Star Trek ships were scaled up from when designed due to the sets used not fitting the ships at all, as well as to justify the huge numbers of shuttlecraft needed. Though it might also be due to the script having the Kelvin carrying 800 people, or it that was adjusted upwards due to the scaling changes from using a brewery as engineering, and a cavernous hanger deck. There were remains of the ship being a smaller scale on the design, like the visual design on the airlock doors and the windows. There were adjusted in the later films so Enterprise is as large as claimed in 2009.

Imperial Star Destroyers are huge specifically to be intimidating. They are suppose to loom over their enemies and cause fear. Add to this their function of suppressing star systems in to submission via a legion of stormtrooper, their wing of TIE fighters and well over a dozen large walkers, as well as a prefab garrison, the huge size makes sense. You need a lot o room for all that and be able to power that huge mass through hyperspace at a reasonable speed, and have the ability to do so for six years. There could be Star Destroyers roaming from star system to star system of the old CIS and Old Republic, suppressing them and simply waving the Imperial flag to remind them the Empire cares, than heading to the next system, for years before they head back to the Core World, or even a minor Imperial supply yard for resupply. And with millions to billions of star systems and around 25,000 Star Destroyers, that is not unreasonable.

The NX-01 does not have those needs. It is a prototype exploration starship from a minor regional power that controls only a few star systems and trades with maybe a dozen alien species locally, and a few at long distances. They have partial control of maybe a 40-60 light year across sphere of influence they share primarily with the Vulcans and less so with the Andorians, who they somehow have managed not to encounter much since first contact with Vulcan. Enterprise is not suppressing peoples, it can barely show the flag anyplace. It is a warp drive with a few labs, and a sensor package. That's about it.

 

[F. King Daniel]

The Kelvin Timeline Enterprise is that big because they filmed in a brewery for engineering and built shuttles to hold 40 instead of 6. Then they ran with it and created interiors like the massive plaza at the centre of the saucer or the enormous hollow surrounding the saucer separation apparatus. It's not to "compete" with Star Wars, it's a logical outgrowth of production choices.

 

[Spot261]

It's necessary for the new Enterprise to be much larger than the original, unless you literally ignore every interior set or exterior visual cue.

And here's it all fitting nicely:

But we're going way off topic here. Discussion of the Kelvin timeline ship sizes is probably best kept to the eternal thread for it.

Back on topic, although Enterprise NX-01's saucer is about the same size as the TOS Enterprise's, there's much less living space inside. The 1701 saucer doesn't have to cram in engineering and cargo sections, or a shuttlebay.

All that demonstrates is that the interiors have been sexed up to match...

 

[TheSubCommander]

Only when the size was pointed out did the 2009 Trek ships seem large. Most cases they look normal and seem to behave normal. Even in Beyond I don't recall seeming a scaling issue that made them seem as huge as they are reported to be in 2009. Maybe they are that big, but they rarely seem that big. Save for the Vengeance, which is suppose to be huge via the plot.

As I recall, when Star Trek 2009 first came out, Abrams and staff couldn't even agree on the size of the alternate-reality Enterprise-1701. Some sources said it was about the same size as TOS, others about 2000 feet long. If I remember correctly, think it came down to a lot of fans pointing out the size ratio of the shuttles VS shuttle bay, that it was later "officially" stated after the 2009 release the ship was some 725 meters.

What you can take away from that is that Abrams and staff didn't really concern themselves with officially stating how large the ship was, and underestimated the fact some fans really take that seriously. Just like it was never officially stated whether the alternate Enterprise-A is the same size, or not. Sean Hargreaves has stated it is about the same size, but no exact figures have been stated as far as I know.

As for the size of the NX-01, I know it's now generally accepted that the saucer of the NX01 is about the same diameter as the TOS Enterprise, but in this video, the Defiant looks significantly larger than the NX ship, at 0:42.

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[Captain of the USS Averof]

Everything You Always Wanted to Know About Size*
(*But Were Afraid to Ask)

http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/articles/new_enterprise_comment.htm#size

 

[F. King Daniel]

Everything You Always Wanted to Know About Size*
(*But Were Afraid to Ask)

http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/articles/new_enterprise_comment.htm#size

I'll take Mike Okuda's word over some windbag with a chip on his shoulder

 

[Captain of the USS Averof]

I'll take Mike Okuda's word over some windbag with a chip on his shoulder

And I'll take Bryan Fuller's and Rod Roddenberry's word over some windbag with a chip on his shoulder

http://discovery.trekcore.com/galle...writers-room/bryan-fuller-rod-roddenberry.jpg

http://discovery.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/behind-the-scenes/writers-room/ship-wall-2.jpg

If you read the windbag's (with a chip on his shoulder) thoroughly researched article you'd clearly see the "Evidence of a huge Enterprise" paragraph. He clearly states: "In all fairness, we have got the following evidence of a huge ship". Because that's what an unbiased researcher does, he examines all the available evidence, not only those that suit his position.

BTW, I hope Mike Okuda has Tobias Richter's permission to use his artwork in the Encyclopedia.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Bernd and myself have gone back and forth a few times over this. He's not an unbias researcher, since he firmly believes the Enterprise should be 366m and skews all his evidence toward that.

He doesn't even mention that in the one scene the Enterprise is indisputably 366m (the Riverside shipyard, to fit over the location), the details reflect the 725m size and the guys working on the hull wouldn't fit in the exposed decks. It's been pointed out, but he doesn't care because it's the "wrong" answer.

And again, discussion of the Kelvin timeline NCC-1701 should really be HERE, where every single shot of the ship from the first two movies (and a bit of the third) are dissected and every argument anyone has to make already has been. Airlocks, windows, shuttlebays, construction scenes, sets, camera tricks and anything else is detailed there.

 

[Captain of the USS Averof]

Bernd and myself have gone back and forth a few times over this. He's not an unbias researcher, since he firmly believes the Enterprise should be 366m and skews all his evidence toward that.

He doesn't even mention that in the one scene the Enterprise is indisputably 366m (the Riverside shipyard, to fit over the location), the details reflect the 725m size and the guys working on the hull wouldn't fit in the exposed decks. It's been pointed out, but he doesn't care because it's the "wrong" answer.

What do you mean? Like I said, in the article I posted, Bernd devoted a whole section mentioning every one of the things you address! He has 8 paragraphs of arguments that support the 725m position!

Personally I agree with Schneider that the nuEnterprise should have been 366m but I agree with Okuda that it is 725m. Just my two cents.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Have a look at the other thread, there's a lot in there not mentioned in his article. And I completely understand saying the ship should be 366m.

Back on topic, AstroSmurf made these amazing NX-01 Enterprise deck plans. It's all conjecture, but it's a fantastic look at how the inside of the ship might be laid out.

 

[publiusr]

Looks very nice!

One reason to look forward to books with electronic paper. Showing a brief scene, but still turning the page.

 

[Mudd]

And I'll take Bryan Fuller's and Rod Roddenberry's word over some windbag with a chip on his shoulder

There's no good reason to - neither of them has worked in any capacity on the nuTrek movies, and neither of them has ever worked as an artist or designer on any Trek production.

Their opinions on the size of U.S.S. Discovery would, of course, be informed and germane.

 

[FlipORican]

Specifically, compared to NCC1701, Voyager, and Defiant.

I recently watched the episode where Travis visits his family and I noticed that Enterprise wasn't very big compared to the freighter.

most of the freighter is empty open spaces for cargo, while Enterprise does not need to be as big as it is not a cargo ship. I am sure by comparison of just the sections where the crew of the freighter live, it is probably smaller compared to the Enterprise.

 

[FlipORican]

Here's more angles on the other ships, but it seems I missed the NX-01 off this one

Does this mean the ships in the Kelvin Timeline are much more bigger than the Prime Universe? Thus, they have a bigger crew as well? Looking at the picture...the NCC-1701 in the Kelvin Timeline is just as big as the Enterprise-E in the Prime Universe...is this comparison official canon or speculation?

 

[Captain of the USS Averof]

Does this mean the ships in the Kelvin Timeline are much more bigger than the Prime Universe? Thus, they have a bigger crew as well? Looking at the picture...the NCC-1701 in the Kelvin Timeline is just as big as the Enterprise-E in the Prime Universe...is this comparison official canon or speculation?

Unfortunately, it is canon. These are the "official" sizes…