Spoilers Shouldn't the Farragut disaster have happened already?

[Jedi Marso]

I agree. Since the First Officer is technically second in command, and probably received commendations for getting the ship and remaining crew out of a fatal situation, they were probably promoted to Captain of the ship. Since Kirk showed heroism above and beyond in saving the ship and crew, it probably warranted such a promotion to First Officer of Farragut.

Where is there any indication that Kirk did anything heroic in the Farragut incident? He blamed himself for hesitating when the Cloud Creature killed Garrovick, and Kirk was always brave and acting bravely. But I never remember seeing or reading anything to indicate that he was somehow instrumental in 'saving' the ship (which was structurally unscathed, probably) or saving what remained of the crew.

 

[Nerys Myk]

MA has a habit of making allowing a lot of things from non-canonical sources. Indeed, the only time besides Adira's gender that I noticed the "Strictly Canonical Only" policy being enacted was when they refused to accept the term "Kelvin Timeline" which undoubtedly was done to appease the anti-Abrams gatekeepers.

Not remotely canon at all, but a few years back there was a novel released set between Disco's first two seasons which depicted the Farragut's encounter with the vampire cloud. Of course, they also said Section 31 was involved in the incident because like I said, this was a novel.

A Klingon farts and suddenly Section 31 is involved.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

Reviewing the transcript there is zero indication it was destroyed

MA is wrong. Farragut wasn't destroyed.

Yeah, the Farragut wasn't destroyed.

Neither the Farragut article or Obsession article on M-A mention the Farragut being destroyed. I even checked a random revision from 2019 for the Farragut page, no mention of it being destroyed.

I don’t remember anything canonical stating that the Farragut was destroyed during the cloud creature encounter.

And it's true that it's never been suggested that Farragut was destroyed.

Okay, okay! We've had a half dozen people say this already. We don't need it pointed out any more.

@TBonz, could you or another mod please adjust the thread title to "Shouldn't the Farragut disaster have happened already?" so this conversation isn't just a constant stream of people saying "ACTUALLY, the Farragut wasn't destroyed" over and over and over again?

 

[Tuskin38]

MA has a habit of making allowing a lot of things from non-canonical sources.

It depends if one of the hard stance editors catches it or not.
Somethings slip between the cracks.

"Shouldn't the Farragut disaster have happened already?"

Nothing says it hasn't.

 

[HotRod]

I don’t remember anything canonical stating that the Farragut was destroyed during the cloud creature encounter. I do remember a long-held non-canonical belief that Kirk commanded a destroyer before the Enterprise, but I can’t recall the exact source for that.

Maybe the Farragut is classified as a Destroyer?

 

[Nerys Myk]

Do we pronounce Farragut like Kelvin Uhura?

Maybe the Farragut is classified as a Destroyer?

But not destroyed.

 

[Dukhat]

Maybe the Farragut is classified as a Destroyer?

Or they were thinking of the Franz Joseph Saladin class destroyer?

 

[T'Bonz]

Okay, okay! We've had a half dozen people say this already. We don't need it pointed out any more.

@TBonz, could you or another mod please adjust the thread title to "Shouldn't the Farragut disaster have happened already?" so this conversation isn't just a constant stream of people saying "ACTUALLY, the Farragut wasn't destroyed" over and over and over again?

Done.

 

[HotRod]

Or they were thinking of the Franz Joseph Saladin class destroyer?

Oh, I'm sure that was the original intention. But things can change.

Plus, I'll admit that I've never cared for Starfleet ships being given military designations. I don't recall the Enterprise being called a Heavy Cruiser in TOS, so that designation must have come from the FJ Manual, I'm assuming.

Scout, Destroyer, Cruiser, Heavy Cruiser, Dreadnought...... nah. Doesn't exactly reek of a peaceful exploration vessel.

 

[fireproof78]

Scout and cruiser never bothered me.

 

[Dukhat]

Oh, I'm sure that was the original intention. But things can change.

Plus, I'll admit that I've never cared for Starfleet ships being given military designations. I don't recall the Enterprise being called a Heavy Cruiser in TOS, so that designation must have come from the FJ Manual, I'm assuming.

Scout, Destroyer, Cruiser, Heavy Cruiser, Dreadnought...... nah. Doesn't exactly reek of a peaceful exploration vessel.

Well, military designations for starships went out of vogue after TNG’s first season, and they never came back.

 

[HotRod]

Well, military designations for starships went out of vogue after TNG’s first season, and they never came back.

True. I seem to recall non canon sources referring to both the Galaxy and Sovereign classes as "Explorers." I liked that.

 

[FederationHistorian]

It did. Chapel even wore a memorial pin to commemorate it on Starfleet R emembrance Day.

And even if the Farragut suffered significant hull and structural damage, it could have always been repaired. Two years seems like plenty of time to repair the Farragut.

 

[Noname Given]

SPOILERS for the SNW episode "Lost in Translation."

So the latest episode of Strange New Worlds establishes that James T. Kirk becomes the first officer of the Farragut at the rank of Lieutenant, around the same time that Christopher Pike is promoted to Fleet Captain.

But according to Memory Alpha, SNW is currently taking place in 2259. The TOS episode "Obsession," which takes place in 2268, tells us the USS Farragut was destroyed 11 years before, which would put its destruction in 2257, before SNW even begins. So Kirk should most likely be on another assignment. (On my TOS timeline, I have Kirk on an Earthside assignment at this point.)

So is this just a screw up, or are they intentionally changing the timeline for some reason, like when ENT established Zephram Cochrane's disappearance was in 2219 instead of 2117, 150 years before "Metamorphosis"? Any thoughts?

Yes it already happened, and James T. Kirk has so far dealt with it the best he can and continued to serve on the ship (which was never stated to be destroyed, just half the crew and the Captain killed in that encounter.)

At this point in Strange New Worlds, it's two to three years after that incident. What? You expect Kirk to be going around mumbling and ruminating about the situation? If he did he never would have been promoted to Captain and been given command of the USS Enterprise. He was dealing with the situation fine until he was confronted with the same creature which led to the events depicted in TOS S2 Obsession.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

Yes it already happened, and James T. Kirk has so far dealt with it the best he can and continued to serve on the ship

But the show hasn't mentioned it at all, has it? That was my question.

(which was never stated to be destroyed, just half the crew and the Captain killed in that encounter.)

Jesus F--ing Christ. Enough Already!!! This has been pointed out multiple times already. Once was fine. Twice is understandable. The seventh time it's pointed out, it's really fucking annoying.

Forgive me for misremembering "Obsession" slightly and thinking that if half the crew died, the ship was possibly damaged beyond all repair.

What? You expect Kirk to be going around mumbling and ruminating about the situation? If he did he never would have been promoted to Captain and been given command of the USS Enterprise.

I was simply asking if it's been definitely established on SNW that the Farragut thing has already happened. And if not, if that was possibly something they were leading up to. But if we're in for pages more of this, I may just forget the whole thing and ask if the mods can just lock the thread instead.

 

[Jedi Marso]

Jesus F--ing Christ. Enough Already!!! This has been pointed out multiple times already. Once was fine. Twice is understandable. The seventh time it's pointed out, it's really fucking annoying.

Forgive me for misremembering "Obsession" slightly and thinking that if half the crew died, the ship was possibly damaged beyond all repair.

Heh. Chill, bro. Deep breaths!

Nobody is coming to take away your nerd card.

 

[hbquikcomjamesl]

Sounds like the vampire cloud already got to the equine before we started flogging it.

 

[Unique]

 

[Noname Given]

But the show hasn't mentioned it at all, has it? That was my question.

Jesus F--ing Christ. Enough Already!!! This has been pointed out multiple times already. Once was fine. Twice is understandable. The seventh time it's pointed out, it's really fucking annoying.

Forgive me for misremembering "Obsession" slightly and thinking that if half the crew died, the ship was possibly damaged beyond all repair.

I was simply asking if it's been definitely established on SNW that the Farragut thing has already happened. And if not, if that was possibly something they were leading up to. But if we're in for pages more of this, I may just forget the whole thing and ask if the mods can just lock the thread instead.

You seem to believe I should read the entire thread before posting a response to one of your posts. I don't read that Threads that way.

If I decide to respond to a post I respond to what's in the post; I don't worry about what people after me have posted to you if they've also responded to said post.

If you're not prepared to have people discuss a single post, then maybe you should lurk more.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

You seem to believe I should read the entire thread before posting a response to one of your posts. I don't read that Threads that way.

On a thread that's dozens or even hundreds of pages, that's reasonable. This thread is still at two pages. It would take, what, 5-10 minutes to read in total?