Should there have been more sex and violence?

[Butters]

So basically more of the shit that killed Enterprise.

You know, they say that those that aren't getting any horizontal folk danicng, talk about it, those who are, don't.....just throwing that out there

Who is they? They need to be told that they're wrong. Some people like to talk about sex because its something they enjoy. They like to gauge their experience against others. Are they doing it right? Are they getting enough? Too much? Are they normal? and other such insecurities.

Just to turn it round, I'd hazard a guess that those casting such aspersions are trying to stifle a debate they find uncomfortable, because their limited experience leaves them little to contribute.

As for the stomach churning shit that killed Enterprise, keep it, but since sex is such a huge part of life the question should be why isn't there more of it Star Trek?

Its a taboo, and Trek should help break that down and it can be done without a single onscreen kiss or flash of nipple. If Star Trek can make people ask themselves why they don't want Sex on trek without a hint of gratuity then we'll be getting some of that mythical meaningful trek that the real trekkies lament.

 

[Quest_techie]

Perhaps a better question to ask: Should there have been a better story?

yes.

and anyone who says otherwise is just trying stubbornly to be "Right" about this movie

but come on, it could have been better, and still made all the money it's making, but orci, abrahms, kurtzman, didn't want to make that effort.

 

[superstring01]

but come on, it could have been better, and still made all the money it's making, but orci, abrahms, kurtzman, didn't want to make that effort.

Agreed. Every one of the BIG plot holes could have been closed and the movie would STILL have been just as profitable.

The movie was amazingly executed on a poorly written script. Imagine how great it would have been with an amazing script!

~String

 

[FalTorPan]

The movie's story and script weren't all that they could be, but darn it, the movie was fun and entertaining -- more so than most other Trek films.

 

[Lightinspire]

No, for once let's please have a good series of movies without all that sex and violence..that has been done on about every show and movie in TV Land. Trek needs to be suitable to the entire family, not just adults who want to see sex and violence..Let's be different. Sex and violence has been done and will always be done and that isn't necessarily good for the entire family. It doesn't NEED to be done....the success of this movie proves it.

 

[Lightinspire]

So basically more of the shit that killed Enterprise.

Yeah, I know that's why I didn't watch Enterprise: too much sex.

Yep, that is why I quit too. Star Trek has proven it doesn't need all that to be successful.

 

[Trilliam]

So basically more of the shit that killed Enterprise.

You know, they say that those that aren't getting any horizontal folk danicng, talk about it, those who are, don't.....just throwing that out there

Who is they? They need to be told that they're wrong. Some people like to talk about sex because its something they enjoy. They like to gauge their experience against others. Are they doing it right? Are they getting enough? Too much? Are they normal? and other such insecurities.

Just to turn it round, I'd hazard a guess that those casting such aspersions are trying to stifle a debate they find uncomfortable, because their limited experience leaves them little to contribute.

As for the stomach churning shit that killed Enterprise, keep it, but since sex is such a huge part of life the question should be why isn't there more of it Star Trek?

Its a taboo, and Trek should help break that down and it can be done without a single onscreen kiss or flash of nipple. If Star Trek can make people ask themselves why they don't want Sex on trek without a hint of gratuity then we'll be getting some of that mythical meaningful trek that the real trekkies lament.

Honey, those who are talking about sex aren't getting any. Those who are getting it are too busy getting it to be wasting time talking about it.

And no, there didn't need to be any more screen "sex". Ships full of healthy adults on patrol for long periods of time - of course there would be sexual activity behind closed doors. That's understood, isn't it? Why do you need to be shown that? Can't you make that leap of logic by yourself?

Sex and nudity have been on our tvs here since "No 96" in the 70s. It's not a big deal here to have it on screen.

 

[Butters]

Honey, those who are talking about sex aren't getting any. Those who are getting it are too busy getting it to be wasting time talking about it.

You never discuss the matter with your peers? Ever?

And no, there didn't need to be any more screen "sex". Ships full of healthy adults on patrol for long periods of time - of course there would be sexual activity behind closed doors. That's understood, isn't it? Why do you need to be shown that? Can't you make that leap of logic by yourself?

Nope. That leap of logic evaded me. Sex in modern trek was always portaryed rather formally. In portraying perfect humans in a conflict free, moneyless utopian society, the absense of sexually liberated free-love types is even more stark. Consider the characters of Reg Barclay or La Forge; if sex is happening behind closed doors, they never got any. Picard and Crusher dancing round eachother. Riker and Troi never crossing the line. Data did Tasha, and it was all so very very special. 24th Century humans are frigid.

I'm not advocating sex on trek, just a more 'intimate' crew. Something along the lines of the Holoship from Red Dwarf. We don't need to see kirk take a dump to know it happens, we don't need to see Geordie pulling his pud, but to get the impression that Humans in the trek world are getting any, they'd need to be far more relaxed about it than any episode portrayed it.

Sex and nudity have been on our tvs here since "No 96" in the 70s. It's not a big deal here to have it on screen.

Exactly. Sex and nudity is everywhere, why should trek buck the trend and avoid it. Why is it an issue? I can take it or leave it, its the outright objection that I find telling.

 

[Trilliam]

You never discuss the matter with your peers? Ever?

Well, most of my friends and I, are married, have been married or are in longterm committed relationships for over 20years (in my case nearly 27). We all have teenaged and older children. Sex per se, isn't that big topic amongst us old married ladies. NOt the same way it was when we were young singles.

Nope. That leap of logic evaded me. Sex in modern trek was always portaryed rather formally. In portraying perfect humans in a conflict free, moneyless utopian society, the absense of sexually liberated free-love types is even more stark. Consider the characters of Reg Barclay or La Forge; if sex is happening behind closed doors, they never got any. Picard and Crusher dancing round eachother. Riker and Troi never crossing the line. Data did Tasha, and it was all so very very special. 24th Century humans are frigid.

I don't know what that says about either of us. I just assumed that there were those who had their spouses on board, so were taken care of, and singles were fine to pair off for however long, just as longas it was off-duty and it wasn't with their line-supervisor.

I'm not advocating sex on trek, just a more 'intimate' crew. Something along the lines of the Holoship from Red Dwarf. We don't need to see kirk take a dump to know it happens, we don't need to see Geordie pulling his pud, but to get the impression that Humans in the trek world are getting any, they'd need to be far more relaxed about it than any episode portrayed it.

See above - I already assumed it was happening - didn't need to see the lingering looks etc preceding it. I never thought that all the singles were going back to their quarters, chastely alone, every night.

Sex and nudity have been on our tvs here since "No 96" in the 70s. It's not a big deal here to have it on screen.

Exactly. Sex and nudity is everywhere, why should trek buck the trend and avoid it. Why is it an issue? I can take it or leave it, its the outright objection that I find telling.

So if it's eveywhere, all around us, why does it need to be shown? Are you so lacking in imagination that you need your hand held and the dots joined for you?

 

[Butters]

Well, most of my friends and I, are married, have been married or are in longterm committed relationships for over 20years (in my case nearly 27). We all have teenaged and older children. Sex per se, isn't that big topic amongst us old married ladies. NOt the same way it was when we were young singles.

I'm also married, and the otherhalf lurks here so I'll be careful, but I do have a single friend out there that I can only describe as 'living the dream' and the conversation does occasionally take on a certain chauvinism. It depends on the company absolutely, but everyone needs an outlet, and getting some doesn't stop you thinking about it, and real sex is no substitute for the fantasy.

Nope. That leap of logic evaded me. Sex in modern trek was always portaryed rather formally. In portraying perfect humans in a conflict free, moneyless utopian society, the absense of sexually liberated free-love types is even more stark. Consider the characters of Reg Barclay or La Forge; if sex is happening behind closed doors, they never got any. Picard and Crusher dancing round eachother. Riker and Troi never crossing the line. Data did Tasha, and it was all so very very special. 24th Century humans are frigid.

I don't know what that says about either of us. I just assumed that there were those who had their spouses on board, so were taken care of, and singles were fine to pair off for however long, just as longas it was off-duty and it wasn't with their line-supervisor.

See above - I already assumed it was happening - didn't need to see the lingering looks etc preceding it.

I'm sensing an age thing. I was yet to get laid when I first saw All Good Things, and when you're young and impressionable, well Catholism has healthier attitudes to Sex than TNG.

Sex and nudity have been on our tvs here since "No 96" in the 70s. It's not a big deal here to have it on screen.

Exactly. Sex and nudity is everywhere, why should trek buck the trend and avoid it. Why is it an issue? I can take it or leave it, its the outright objection that I find telling.

So if it's eveywhere, all around us, why does it need to be shown? Are you so lacking in imagination that you need your hand held and the dots joined for you?

Of course I don't need the dots joining. But the impression of healthy sexual relationships I gained from trek bore fuck all resemblence to actually getting my end away.

I don't need star trek to show me sex. I'm neither single nor living with my parents. I know where to find free porn if I want to see bare bits. Nudity and the whole in and out of it is not what I'm discussing. I've been a trekky for most of my life and I've met other fans, frightening fans, T-shirt wearing fans that will tell you things about Star Ships that you didn't need to know, but they know nothing of women. These fans shy away from sex and they shy away from women, they are the stereotypical nerd that crave sex but see themselves above it. They have the crazy idea that women hate sex and they resent the arrogant sporty bastards that get all the action, and yet their hero, Kirk, is one of the arrogant twats they hate. It scares the shit out of me to think it, but in my mid teens I was well on my way to joining them.

I argue that Trek needs to portray sex, not show it. It needs to embrace this aspect of the human condition. This massive aspect. Why should nudity be shunned? I'm hardly a naturalist, but imagine the changing room scene from Starship Troopers. How did that make you feel? Men and women, naked together in a non-sexual context? Is that immature? Is it porn? Does it have to be an issue?

 

[Trilliam]

By the time "AGT" aired, I was in my 30s, had 4 kids and had been married for over 12 years. Plus I was a teen during the post 60s hippy free love, pre AIDS 70s. Maybe that has something to do with it.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Well.. I would enjoy it if Trek was more adult. No you don't nipples for that. But there was a sterile antiseptic quality to life on the Enterprise in TNG that really wasn't necessary. There were simply no undercurrents of attraction and connection that seemed like real life to me. I use TNG as an example because it seemed more entrenched there.

However I found STXI took a step in an adult direction. Spock and Uhura were quite erotic, quite adult, you could feel that much had passed between them in their somewhat secretive relationship. If that continues, and if other Trek characters are also more real and less painted-uniforms I will be very pleased.

 

[Trilliam]

Well.. I would enjoy it if Trek was more adult. No you don't nipples for that. But there was a sterile antiseptic quality to life on the Enterprise in TNG that really wasn't necessary. There were simply no undercurrents of attraction and connection that seemed like real life to me. I use TNG as an example because it seemed more entrenched there.

However I found STXI took a step in an adult direction. Spock and Uhura were quite erotic, quite adult, you could feel that much had passed between them in their somewhat secretive relationship. If that continues, and if other Trek characters are also more real and less painted-uniforms I will be very pleased.

THere were some "people" in board the TNG Enterprise that I wouldn't give the time of day to, let alone my cabin number

 

[Pindar]

there was a sex scene with a reman possessing Riker to have a go on Troi and Shiznon was impaled by a big speak then dragged himself along it to nearly kiss Picard. Of course the problerm with that is there's nothing sex about 55 year old Deanna Troi or Picard on Picard clone kissing.

I think that you should consider doing something for trek an fiction forum whilst we wait for the next installment of your crazy life.

 

[Butters]

Well.. I would enjoy it if Trek was more adult. No you don't nipples for that. But there was a sterile antiseptic quality to life on the Enterprise in TNG that really wasn't necessary. There were simply no undercurrents of attraction and connection that seemed like real life to me. I use TNG as an example because it seemed more entrenched there.

However I found STXI took a step in an adult direction. Spock and Uhura were quite erotic, quite adult, you could feel that much had passed between them in their somewhat secretive relationship. If that continues, and if other Trek characters are also more real and less painted-uniforms I will be very pleased.

There were some "people" in board the TNG Enterprise that I wouldn't give the time of day to, let alone my cabin number

Were they creepy and beardy by any chance?

 

[Trilliam]

Were they creepy and beardy by any chance?

 

[Butters]

Well.. I would enjoy it if Trek was more adult. No you don't nipples for that. But there was a sterile antiseptic quality to life on the Enterprise in TNG that really wasn't necessary. There were simply no undercurrents of attraction and connection that seemed like real life to me. I use TNG as an example because it seemed more entrenched there.

However I found STXI took a step in an adult direction. Spock and Uhura were quite erotic, quite adult, you could feel that much had passed between them in their somewhat secretive relationship. If that continues, and if other Trek characters are also more real and less painted-uniforms I will be very pleased.

Absolutely agree.

Were they creepy and beardy by any chance?

That would be a yes then

 

[Vassa]

Should there have been more sex and violence?

Yes, of course.

And bigger explosions too!

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

I suddenly remembered a friend I had some years ago. She was in her 30's, married with kids and a huge fan of Buffy and all the Buffy spin offs. She and her husband decided to "try" Trek at one point because they had never seen it and they rented some videos (I don't know which ones but it would have been either TNG, VOY or DS9 as that is what the video shop had.) She told me could not get into it because it was "not sexy". She said, "I need my shows to be sexy". I had already noticed this about her with movies, there had to be some sexual tension there or she would consider it childish.

Now Buffy was watched by zillions of teens and is hardly graphic in terms of anything sexual. But it had plenty of subtext and simmering sexual tensions and unstated drama. It was sexy in exactly the way Star Trek is not.

Now I don't really care, I'm one of those "call it Trek and spoon it into me" people BUT.. it would both be improved and grab a newer devoted following if they worked this aspect into it. Think of the TNG poker parties, how dull and sexless were they? They weren't like any downtime R and R of workmates I've ever experienced.

You can be adult and still be PG.

 

[Trilliam]

That bearded bloke always seemed kinda sleazy to me.