Season 6: Is it me?

[EnriqueH]

Why did TNG run out of gas?

It seems to me that they had enough material to keep the characters going?

I guess hindsight is 20/20. They introduced Ro Laren, which had potential, but then they didn't know what to do with her.

They had this great Cardassian stuff in "Chain of Command" and introduced some other great characters like David Warner's inquisitor, Jellico, and Capt. Maxwell, and it would seem to me that several of these characters COULD have returned but didn't.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

I think the best episodes of the later seasons were as good as the best episodes of seasons 3-5. Just, the non-great episodes of season 3-5 were better than the non-great episodes of season 6-7.

It's really just writer fatigue. Some of the writers went off to DS9, the others had already exhausted their best ideas.

 

[EnriqueH]

Too bad because there were definitely concepts and characters in place to keep it going. It shouldn't have become as inconsistent as it did.

 

[kirkfan]

Why did TNG run out of gas?

It seems to me that they had enough material to keep the characters going?

I guess hindsight is 20/20. They introduced Ro Laren, which had potential, but then they didn't know what to do with her.

They had this great Cardassian stuff in "Chain of Command" and introduced some other great characters like David Warner's inquisitor, Jellico, and Capt. Maxwell, and it would seem to me that several of these characters COULD have returned but didn't.

I thought it had more to do with a lack of availability of the actress.

 

[MikeS]

I just rewatched FIstful of Data's for the first time in years. I always remembered this one fondly but ouch, that was a bit painful! And a sign of things to come re Spiner's wanting to hog the limelight in the films. I was a bit embarrassed by this one.

 

[Ensign_Redshirt]

Michelle Forbes wanted to do movies. Which didn't exactly turn out the way she intended, but that's how these things go sometimes.

Strictly speaking, they even had planned for her to become a main cast member on DS9, but then she opted out and the character of Ro Laren was re-modeled into Kira Nerys (with O'Brien filling out the role of the Enterprise-D crewmember who transfers to DS9).

 

[kirkfan]

Michelle Forbes wanted to do movies. Which didn't exactly turn out the way she intended, but that's how these things go sometimes.

Strictly speaking, they even had planned for her to become a main cast member on DS9, but then she opted out and the character of Ro Laren was re-modeled into Kira Nerys (with O'Brien filling out the role of the Enterprise-D crewmember who transfers to DS9).

You don't mean it was either O'Brien or her kind of a deal?

 

[STEPhon IT]

You started a thread about S6 having only watched the first few episodes? Is this board your Facebook?

Has to be because what he's writing doesn't make any sense.

 

[EnriqueH]

Well, I just saw Descent Part I, and thus I finished Season 6.

Uneven season. Some great episodes in here, such as Chain of Command, Frame of Mind, Lessons, Tapestry, and Relics.

Some solid, good ones, like Starship Mine, Birthright, Rightful Heir and Timescape.

But man, it was uneven. Great episode, bad episode, good episode, bad, good, great, bad, bad, good, great, good, bad, great. Or at least that's how it felt by the end of it.

I enjoyed Descent Part I. I remember earlier some people here saying they disliked it. I don't remember the payoff, except for Data "killing" Lore, so I'm looking forward to seeing the whole thing again.

One surprise episode for me was "Second Chances".

I really liked Thomas Riker.

For some reason, I remember him being a TNG version of "evil Kirk" from Enemy Within. I have NO IDEA where that memory comes from, (or am I remembering a Season 7 episode?), but Thomas Riker was a good character.

 

[kirkfan]

Descent part II is a major let down.

 

[Seven of Five]

I thought Descent was dull overall. Lore's cheesy cliffhanger was very eye-rolling.

I agree with the general assessment of season six though. More misses than in season five, but still a lot of good stuff in there.

 

[kirkfan]

I thought Descent was dull overall. Lore's cheesy cliffhanger was very eye-rolling.

I agree with the general assessment of season six though. More misses than in season five, but still a lot of good stuff in there.

Yes, I didn't particularly appreciate Descent part I but it seemed to be building up toward something. I wasn't expecting much but still a great deal more than what we got.

 

[mswood]

Too bad because there were definitely concepts and characters in place to keep it going. It shouldn't have become as inconsistent as it did.

Sure it should vary. Any chance in the writer staff, especially in the head writer. The one who typical does some level of rewriting on each and every script, who is the one to green light ideas, and so. Is going o have a marked impact on a show. Know you bring in some one better, they improve, you get some one not as good they typically decline.

We lost a staff writer Joe Menosky near the end of season 5, so that is also going to change things to a degree.

Trek lost Michael Piller as a day to day runner of TNG. If you listen to the writers group on the season three blu-ray, you can hear some of the differences the writers experienced between Piller and Taylor.

You also had Berman and public submissions know having to split with Deep Space Nine. Meaning previously any solid pitch or submission was always going to be held for possible TNG story development. Not at this point, DS9 was also going to dip into the same source. And of course Berman who did work on each and every episode, know had not 26 episodes a year to focus on, but 46 for this year.

Season 7 was even worse, as the writing resources of Trek got spread even further as work was done on 52 episodes of tv, the two biggest TNG writers spent nearly the first two months of season 7 with their primary focus being the film Generations. You also had the the two head writers, and the Shows head producers working on development of Voyager.

Even if the writers were working at the same exact level as seasons 4-5, there is no way the quality should stay the same. It logical should drop and drop to a significant degree.

 

[kirkfan]

I don't agree that the quality SHOULD drop. It's laziness that makes the quality drop.

 

[jaime]

I am inclined to agree with the original sentiment. There is a real sense of winding the show down and perhaps a little less care going into the show by the end, and more so in season seven. For a variety of reasons.
However....I really really like Ro, and the episode Rascals is remarkably well done for an obvious slice of cheese. I will always dislike Fistful of Datas, as aside from Troi getting a little development, not one of its various aspects appeal to me in any way.

 

[Kobayshi Maru]

Fistful Of Datas was played for laughs only.

 

[jaime]

Literally the only thing that amused me was smoking deanna, and her childhood liking for westerns.

Its entirely a personal opinion, but this episode almost felt more like a filler than Pulaski sticking aerials into Rikers head.

Of course, I don't like westerns, am not a huge worf or alexander fan, think Brent Spiner is a great actor as Data when its part of a group effort or as a serious moment, and am struggling to think of a genuinely great holodeck episode.

On plus side, its not a braga twilight zone episode or the one where enterprise has a baby on the holodeck. XD

 

[IrishNero]

Nah, I agree with you. Season 6 and 7 were a slow decline in quality, I think the episodic formula simply grew stale. It has not nearly as many good episodes, in my eyes, as did Seasons 4 and 5.

On the positive side you have "Tapestry", "Face of the Enemy" and "Lessons" to look forward to.

IMO, generally speaking most seasons of any series begin to suffer from quality issues after the 3rd or 4th season. I think that's why it's good to rotate writers now and again.

 

[FormerLurker]

Which is why seasons 6-7 and all of Voyager were substandard. They kept the same writing staff for over a decade. The insularity of that is why everything we complain about, especially in Voyager, happened. The technobabble, the repetitive nature, the draining, weary "let's just try this one more time" attempts to tell one more good Borg story, for instance. What was intended to be a brain trust became a brain drain.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

Which is why seasons 6-7 and all of Voyager were substandard. They kept the same writing staff for over a decade. The insularity of that is why everything we complain about, especially in Voyager, happened. The technobabble, the repetitive nature, the draining, weary "let's just try this one more time" attempts to tell one more good Borg story, for instance. What was intended to be a brain trust became a brain drain.

I think season 6 and 7 were less consistent but had their share of great episodes, but basically I agree. They siphoned off the best writers to DS9 and didn't hire new blood. That's why Enterprise after being horrid for its first two and a half seasons miraculously got good the moment Manny Coto came on the scene. He had ideas for the direction of the show that other people hadn't had before.